Arete Blood Work

[Arete]

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I have been reading alot of the blood work reviews over the last few weeks to try and analyze my blood work as well before posting. I would appreciate some input on it since I am considering doing HRT through a doctor that uses BIOTE pellets or if I should just do Test Cyp TRT. A little history to follow the blood work.

I had done a 12 week cycle of Test E 500mg and Deca 250mg a week. This blood work is 4 months post and I can definately feel now that things have not improved from this blood work in the last 3 months. When I came off the cycle I did not do a proper PCT and tried with natural supplements that they say would recover the body. I now know much more and if I cycle again I already have the HCG / Nova and Clomid but at this point I am still trying naturally to cure my messed up HPTA and hormones.

Current weight 240# - id say 25+% body fat. Prior to coming off the cycle in december I was 210# more around 17%. In the last 2 years I went from 270# to 205# before doing a Test E cycle to try and gain mass and started lifting heavy. I ate a Ketogenic diet to loose the weight to 205 but then introduced carbs and the Test E and went to 225# very fast. Then when I came of the cycle I have slowly crept back to 240#.

42 year old male, 6' tall, walk 12,000 steps minimum a day and eat a Higher fat low carb diet for the most part at 2400-3000 calories a day mostly from eggs and protein with some green veges in line with Paleo more or less. When I was on Test I was highly motivated and lifting 5 days a week for mostly strength 5x5 style. I try to not go below 1000 calorie deficient and track food and activity every day religiously so I know macro break down very well.

I got this blood work done in April from someone that promotes BIOTE and will not do Test C. I have looked for information on it vs Test on the forums and online but dont find many comparisons. Some of the notes on the test were discussions i had with him. I said I was going to try and reset myself before moving forward with these pellets. It has been 3 months and all I have done is put on 15# and lack motivation, drive and libido with my wife. My Goal is to have a sense of well being and motivation along with body comp and being more around 200#. I believe I have messed up my system and have read the posts to reset the HPTA but its all with Nova/Clomid and HGC. I am not against it at all but I thought before doing anything I wanted someone to evaluate the blood and see if from this work I need to get on some sort of permanant TRT or HRT.

Really appreciate it if Kelkel could give me some insight and any others. Thank you.

[Mr.BB]

You are shut down, but you forgot to test LH and FSH which are important to figure out whats going on. So you need to attempt a restart, the more time it passes the worse it gets for you. Dont know what are you waiting for.

ALT is high and cholesterol is horrible. Blood count is good.

Drop the high fat paleo and start eating veggies for your cholesterol, this is not very good for your arteries and heart.

[Arete]

Yeah reading I noticed that the doctor didn't test or discuss the LH or FSH. This kind of tells me he is selling BIOTE and not seeing what the root cause may be. Thanks for the input as well on diet, when I was stricter on the carbs my cholesterol actually was much better for some reason on this blood work my triglycerides tripled.

[kelkel]

I tried to expand your BW and was unable to. Is there any way you can repost it so my old ass can read it? I even printed it and it comes out microscopic?

[Arete]

I have uploaded better views now sorry. I wasnt able to orignially get the file size limit in order. Thanks Mr.BB for posting and kelkel for looking. As Mr.BB stated why am i not on a PCT right now after the blood work. I have tried naturally to bring it back which may be a myth but here I am 8 months post and still not recovered. I am looking for a way to bring it back which still may only be to 200-300 which after feeling much better on Test I now know the difference at my age of what I may have lost over the years slowly. I know the bloods are missing a few things which is surprising since it was a HRT person but at the same time since I have read a ton on here in the last 2 weeks its not uncommon for once again a doctor to not know something and not want to fix the root cause of a problem but just give a shot, pill or Pellet in this case. Appreciate it guys a ton of knowledge on here from you long term members so thanks for taking the time. Some of the things I have been taken are listed below. Some of these are to help the whole HPTA and Adrenals.

DIM 100 mg ED
DHEA 200mg ED
Ashgawanda 200mg
Essential oils for Endo system
Vit D 10,000 IU ED
ZMA
Rhiodlia with Royal Jelly
Daily Vitamin
Healthy fats from Eggs, Coconut and MCT oils.

[kelkel]

Much better, thanks.

I agree with BB. You need LH and FSH numbers for a proper assessment. Cortisol and prolactin would be good as well. We're looking for items that are suppressive to LH function. Going with the assumption (from your story) that your issue is secondary and not primary (testicular) then your LH must be abysmal. That said, running a pct would not hurt. BW during to check response and then about 8 weeks after would be great.

If at that point your testosterone level is still poor than I'd suggest an MRI of your pituitary to rule out adenoma's. The MRI can be done now if you have the means.

Drop the DIM as you do not need it now and replace it with NAC.

I would hold off on any testosterone replacement until you do your due diligence. If it gets to that point, pellets would be a last resort, imho.

[Arete]

I'll get new blood work and we can review once I include those other tests. I'll drop the DIM and get some NAC. Do you suggest getting another blood before going on a PCT to include HCG /nova and clomid or at this point sooner then later? On my B12 being so high at 1200+ is there a concern or a possibly reason.

Thank you guys really appreciate it I need to get a better overall feeling to get back in the game.

[kelkel]

If you can check BW ahead of time that's always a plus. Refer to the example in the Finding A doc sticky thread at the top of this forum.
You do not run HCG during pct as it's suppressive to LH function. Stick to clomid and nolva similar to this:

Clomid: 100/50/50/50
Nolva: 40/20/20/20/20/20

(per day, per week)

Your B12 is fine.

[Arete]

Perfect. Thanks for getting me back to figuring and healing the root cause first. I want to have the better test levels but first getting my body working is the goal.

[Arete]

Reading more and thinking back. Until these levels get reset and hopefully I start making some T would I still be able to grow muscle mass. I'm going to loose BF to 15% while doing the PCT. I guess I'm wondering should I just do cardio and put the heavy lifting on the back burner. Honestly I worked out hard for about 6 months and saw very little gains. Maybe in the end it was due to the hormones. I just want to do the best exercise to help reset these hormones during the PCT. Thanks.

[Mr.BB]

Dude, you need to start Clomid and Nolva like Kel posted above.

Its quite stupid to not do a PCT after a deca cycle, which is one of the most supressive compounds there is.

Again, is also stupid to try and cut during PCT or any recovery fase, as your hormones are messed up and you need all the help to keep the muscle tissue gained on cycle.

[Arete]

I am doing the clomid and nova as mentioned. I am asking what exercise source while recovering these hormones I should still do or just let my body recover at this time. I truly appreciate the advice which is far better then the doctor I talked to. When I got the blood work results I asked him if he would prescribe me clomid and Nova since I had read some on here but all he wanted todo was put pellets in me. Thanks again for helping me recover.

[Arete]

I got blood work done and wanted to see what you thought Kelkel. I started the PCT above as you mentioned and also the NAC. This was scheduled and taken the morning after I started the PCT. It shows definite increase in FSH/LH and even Test. I am about 1 week into the PCT since I was out of town when I first started this conversation with you guys. So a couple of questions.

From a glance does it appear that the HPTA may be working as intended?

I am curious does the Nova and Clomid have that instant of a response to see results the next day?

So this morning a week into it I started to develop a lump on my right nipple. Is it possible to get gyno symptoms on PCT as you go from very low test to a higher amount through activating the HPTA? If so should I take anything to help that, I have some liquid dex but thought that the AI should be used only on cycle. I have read the threads and searched and couldn't find anything on these 2 topics.

Anyway thanks for the response and help getting my body reset. Looking forward to bloods in 4 weeks as suggested above to see where we are when nearing the end of the PCT.

[kelkel]

It's functioning yet your LH is still low, which ultimately results in low t. FSH is high which could have many causes which I do not want to guess at. Give it time and see how it balances out. Yes, they can work relatively quickly. Regarding a possible lump one will not form in a week. It takes much more time than that. Also the nolva will protect you during this time period. Just keep an eye on it and don't constantly stimulate it by touching it.

[Arete]

Thanks for checking in kelkel. We will see what the bloods look like in a few weeks. Appreciate the follow up.

[Arete]

So I have been gone for a while but did the PCT as directed by you guys. Really appreciate it. I took a blood test a day after I completed the PCT just to see how things were looking even though I know it isn't a true case of the actual long term out come. I would like a little review and thoughts on if I am secondary or not. The LH level increased but and Test was at 800+ but the FSH also went through the roof. Estradiol went up as well but a lot better percentage then it had been. I can say though even with 800 Test I did not feel anything like I had when injecting.

I appreciate the input from you guys and want you to understand that I am not trying to become this monster beast or anything, I just want to have a good quality of life and loose some fat and be at a best version of my self. Over the last year trying to reset all of this I have gained back 30# of fat, sex drive is down and over all sense of well being. When this is done I am looking to be on more of a TRT plan. I have taken blood work last week which was another 9 months after this PCT blood work so I would very much appreciate the input on the latest blood work once it comes in. Thank you once again for sharing your knowledge and input with everyone on the forums.

[Arete]

Here are the latest bloods. This is about 8 months post PCT. Looks like Test is better and LH is working and Estrogen isn't high. The FSH is still high which from reading suggests sperm production failure but I am don't having children and actually never had any problem making babies from experience. So where do I go from here with moderate Test levels. I mean there is a sense of well being that is missing and unless you have been on a cycle and had things elevated again I guess you would just think its being a 40+ year old. I would like to do something to help me have that feeling and also get my BF% into a healthy males range 12-15%. I am not against supplementing from here until death if that is what it takes but I don't want to over due it like I did. Once you guys Mr.BB and Kelkel please input I would like to proceed. What I have in my tool box but not sure how to implement are listed below besides taking NAC, Vit C and D and ZMA daily. Im not trying to make this a complicated cocktail for huge gains just 200#+- lean mean F&%$ing machine with the wife. I was thinking of starting with low dose Test cyp 2 times a week like 150mg weekly. Please let me know your thoughts since they have been so helpful in helping me get here and the sharing on this forum should also help educate others before jumping in with both feet.

Incase they are hard to read

Test 588 348-1197
LH 5.3 1.7-8.6 MIU/ml
FSH 14.1 1.4-12.4 mIU/ml
Estradiol, Sens. 15.9 8.0-35 pg/ml


Healthy workout (heavy lifting 4 days and a day of HIT)
Instead of HFLC using Carb/ keeping protein at 1g per lb body weight (60F/200C/200+P)
Test Cyp
Armidex
HCG
Winny
Eq

Thanks again,

Arete

[kelkel]

Arete what is your free T level? And you have to keep in mind that you really can't compare how you may feel on cycle to how you feel with normal endogenous levels or TRT.

[Mp859]

I personally would be happy with your numbers.

[Arete]

Kelkel I didn't get Free T with this blood work maybe I ordered the wrong labs. From the numbers provided it would seem that I am producing a fair amount of Testosterone . The feelings I understand when adding a stimulant or drug to your system of course would cause effect, otherwise we wouldn't have drug addicts and such so maybe its just feeling like a normal 43 year old. Could the High FSH be due to the fact that I have had a vasectomy 15 years ago so my sperm production is decreased or something?

Mostly from the information we have to date it would seem that Mp859 may be correct and I should be ok with them. I was talking to someone about this forum and my situation and I said you guys Kelkel and Mr.BB will most likely say eat a good diet and go lift heavy stuffs. If this is the current conclusion please let me know your thoughts and after a couple of months of getting off my ass and lifting along with a few carbs ill re evaluate. If you thing there is something I can to help optimize fat loss (HCG -TRT) then let me know as well. Really appreciate the dedication and constancy from the long term knowledgeable members on this forum.

[kelkel]

Yes, your TT level is not bad, but free T is what works for us. Always test that in the future.
Why is your FSH elevated? Wild guess is something testicular in nature causing it. Don't think I'd worry about it. Our HPTA's negative feedback look plays into this. I've not read any studies indicating elevated FSH due to Vasectomies.

You said it. Good nutrition and consistent training. Most all fail with their nutrition. Also, optimize your vit D level, but know what it is before you supplement. It will help to reduce shbg and free up more testosterone for use.

[Arete]

Thanks a lot Kelkel. I supplement 10,000 IU Vit D and NAC as I read in your cholesterol post as wel, My Vitamin D is at 60-62 consistently for the last couple years since I have been staying constant on the blood work. On assisting with the fat loss as I work BF % down do you think a run of HCG would help or low level Test like TRT or just work out for a couple of months and see where we go. I see to have a problem getting off this set point. Im eating very clean and getting at least 1g protein except for a more keto eating on off days Wed and Sunday otherwise eating 500 below maintenance. Appreciate it and man that picture for your Avatar is HOT!!!

[kelkel]

That's a good number for your Vit D. Do not run HCG by itself. HCG Mono is a form of TRT and over time will suppress your LH level further via the negative feedback loop. Consider talking to the guys in the Nutrition forum and see if they can improve things for you diet wise.

And yes, I like the pic as it looks just like my bike.