The secret lives of wives...

[Devil Dog74]

The Secret Lives of Wives

Why they stray: With the work place and the Internet, overscheduled lives and inattentive husbands—it's no wonder more American women are looking for comfort in the arms of another man

By Lorraine Ali and Lisa Miller
Newsweek

July 12 issue - When groups of women get together, especially if they're mothers and have been married for more than six or seven years, and especially if there's alcohol involved, the conversation is usually the same. They talk about the kids and work—how stressed they are, how busy and bone tired. They gripe about their husbands and, if they're being perfectly honest and the wine kicks in, they talk about the disappointments in their marriages. Not long ago, over lunch in Los Angeles, this conversation took a surprising turn, when Erin, who is in her early 40s and has been married for more than a decade, spilled it. She was seeing someone else. Actually, more than one person. It started with an old friend, whom she began meeting every several months for long dinners and some heavy petting. Then she began giving herself permission to flirt with, kiss—well, actually, make out with—men she met on business trips. She understands it's a "Clintonian" distinction, but she won't have sex with anyone except her husband, whom she loves. But she also loves the unexpected thrill of meeting someone new. "Do you remember?" She pauses. "I don't know how long you've been married, but do you remember the kiss that would just launch a thousand kisses?"

Erin started seeing other men when she went back to work after her youngest child entered preschool. All of a sudden she was out there. Wearing great clothes, meeting new people, alive for the first time in years to the idea that she was interesting beyond her contributions at PTA meetings. Veronica, on the other hand, fell in love with a man who was not her husband while she was safely at home in the Dallas suburbs looking after her two children. Hers is the more familiar story: isolated and lonely, married to an airline pilot, Veronica, now 35, took up with a wealthy businessman she met at a Dallas nightclub. Her lover gave her everything her husband didn't: compliments, Tiffany jewelry, flowers and love notes. It was, in fact, the flowers that did her in. Veronica's lover sent a bouquet to her home one afternoon, her husband answered the door and, in one made-for-Hollywood moment, the marriage was over. Now remarried (to a new man), Veronica says she and her friends half-jokingly talk about starting a Web site for married women who want to date. "I think there might be a market in it," she says. There is. Wives who want extramarital sex—or are just dreaming about it—can find what they seek on Yahoo!, MSN or AOL.

Much has changed since Emma Bovary chose suicide with arsenic over living her life branded an adulteress—humiliated, impoverished and stripped of her romantic ideals. In the past, U.S. laws used to punish women who cheated; in a divorce, an unfaithful wife could lose everything, even the property she owned before marriage. Newer laws have been designed to protect these women.

The reality is this: American women today have more opportunity to fool around than ever; when they do fool around, they're more likely to tell their friends about it, and those friends are more likely to lend them a sympathetic ear. They probably use technology to facilitate their affairs, and if they get caught, they're almost as likely to wind up in a wing chair in a marriage counselor's office as in divorce court. Finally, if they do separate from their husbands, women, especially if they're college educated, are better able to make a go of it—pay the bills, keep at least partial custody of the children, remarry if they want to—than their philandering foremothers. "It was just so ruinous for a woman to be caught in adultery in past times, you had to be really driven or motivated to do it," says Peter D. Kramer, clinical professor of psychiatry at Brown University and author of "Should You Leave?" "Now you can get away with it, there's a social role that fits you."

Just how many married women have had sex with people who are not their husbands? It's hard to say for sure, because people lie to pollsters when they talk about sex, and studies vary wildly. (Men, not surprisingly, amplify their sexual experience, while women diminish it.) Couples therapists estimate that among their clientele, the number is close to 30 to 40 percent, compared with 50 percent of men, and the gap is almost certainly closing. In 1991, the National Opinion Research Center at the University of Chicago asked married women if they'd ever had sex outside their marriage, and 10 percent said yes. When the same pollsters asked the same question in 2002, the "yes" responses rose to 15 percent, while the number of men stayed flat at about 22 percent. The best interpretation of the data: the cheating rate for women is approaching that of men, says Tom Smith, author of the NORC's reports on sexual behavior. When Michele Weiner-Davis, a marriage counselor and founder of the Divorce Busting Center in Woodstock, Ill., started practicing 20 years ago, just 10 percent of the infidelity she knew of was committed by women. Now, she believes, it's closer to 50 percent. "Women have suddenly begun to give themselves the same permission to step over the boundary the way that men have."

A rise in female infidelity, though titillating, does not do much to clarify the paradoxes in American culture surrounding sex. Taboos about female sexuality are falling away; together, Dr. Phil and "Sex and the City" have made every imaginable sex act fodder for cocktail-party conversation. At the same time, Americans developed a lower tolerance for infidelity: 80 percent of Americans say infidelity is "always wrong," according to the NORC, up from 70 percent in 1970. Popular opinion is on to something: infidelity can be devastating. If discovered, it can upend a marriage and create chaos in a family.

Nevertheless, in America, as in other parts of the world, a double standard continues to thrive: boys will be boys, but girls are supposed to be good. Even though women are narrowing the gap, men still do the bulk of the domestic damage. "Bill Clinton, who we're all loving on TV—he's a charmer. The poor, weak, wandering guy is kind of a cultural norm," says Elizabeth Berger, a psychiatrist in Elkins Park, Pa., and author of "Raising Children With Character." A weak or wandering mother is a scarier image, she adds.
Popular culture has always been full of unfaithful wives, but even today's fictional cheaters share something that sets them apart from the tragic Anna Karenina or the calculating Mrs. Robinson. Their actions may cause their lives to unravel, but the new philanderers aren't victims. When, on the HBO series "The Sopranos," Carmela finally took a lover after putting up with her mob-boss husband's extracurricular antics for years, audiences cheered. (Her lover was a cad in the end, but the dalliance gave Carmela a secret source of strength.) Sarah, the heroine of this year's best-selling novel "Little Children," falls in love with a handsome stay-at-home dad she meets at the playground; the affair doesn't last, but it gives her the impetus she needs to leave her husband, a weaselly man with a fetish for the underpants of a swinger he met online. And with her role in the 2002 movie "Unfaithful," Diane Lane created an iconic new image of a sexually adventurous wife. Beautiful and well dressed, Connie Sumner has what looks like a perfect life, and she fools around not because she's miserable but simply because she can (a decision that soon makes her life a lot less perfect).

"Women always say 'thank you' for that role, and at first I wasn't sure how to take that," says Lane, who adds that the character was capable of far more denial than she could ever be. "I mean, she was cheating and lying. Then I realized it was because she wasn't a victim. She made a choice to have an affair. It's not something you often see."

Where do married women find their boyfriends? At work, mostly. Nearly 60 percent of American women work outside the home, up from about 40 percent in 1964. Quite simply, women intersect with more people during the day than they used to. They go to more meetings, take more business trips and, presumably, participate more in flirtatious water-cooler chatter. If infidelity is an odds game, then the odds are better now than they used to be that a woman will accidentally bump into someone during the workday who, at least momentarily, interests her more than her husband does.

There's a more subtle point embedded in here as well: women and men bring their best selves to work, leaving their bad behavior and marital resentments at home with their dirty sweatpants. At work, "we dress nicely. We think before we speak. We're poised," says Elana Katz, a therapist in private practice and a divorce mediator at the Ackerman Institute for the Family in New York City. "And many people spend more time out in the world than with their families. I think sometimes people have the idea that [an affair] will protect the marriage." They get a self-esteem boost during work hours and don't rock the boat at home. "In some paradoxical sense this may be a respite, a little break from the marriage.”

"I wasn't out there looking for someone else," says Jodie, 34, a marketing professional in Texas and mother of two. (NEWSWEEK talked at length to more than a dozen women who cheated, and none of them wanted her real name used.) Her continuing affair with a co-worker started innocently enough. She liked his company. "We would go to lunch together and gradually it started feeling like we were dating." At Christmas, Jodie asked her husband of 10 years to join her at the office party, and when he declined, the co-worker stepped in. "We just had so much fun together and we laughed together and it just grew and grew and grew until ... he kissed me. And I loved it."

It's not just opportunity that fuels the impulse to be unfaithful; it's money and power as well. American women are better educated than they've ever been. A quarter of them earn more money than their husbands. A paycheck and a 401(k) don't guarantee that a woman will stray, but if she does, they minimize the fallout both for her and for her children. The feminist Gloria Steinem once said, "Most women are one man away from welfare," but she recently amplified her views to NEWSWEEK: "Being able to support oneself allows one to choose a marriage out of love and not just economic dependence. It also allows one to risk that marriage." In other words, as women grow more powerful, they're more likely to feel, as men traditionally have, that they deserve a little bit of nooky at the end (or in the middle) of a long, busy day.

And like their fathers before them, these powerful women are learning to savor the attentions of a companion who is physically attractive but not as rich, successful—or as old—as they are. In his practice in Palo Alto, Calif., family therapist Marty Klein sees a rise in sexual activity between middle-aged women and younger men. "Forty-year-old women have more of a sense of entitlement to their sexuality than they did before the 'Hite Report,' the feminist movement and 'Sex and the City'," he says. A story currently circulating in Manhattan underscores his point. It seems that a group of 6-year-old girls from an elite private school were at a birthday party, and the conversation turned to their mommies' trainers. As the proud mothers listened nearby, one youngster piped up: "My mommy has a trainer, and every time he comes over, they take a nap." The wicked laughter this story elicits illustrates at least what is dreamed of, if not actually consummated.

The road to infidelity is paved with unmet expectations about sex, love and marriage. A woman who is 40 today grew up during the permissive 1970s and went to college when the dangers of AIDS were just beginning to dawn. She was sexually experienced before she was married and waited five years longer than her mother to settle down. She lives in a culture that constantly flaunts the possibility of great sex and fitness well after menopause. "Great Lovers Are Made, Not Born!" read the ads for sex videos in her favorite magazines; "What if the only night sweats you had came from a good workout?" ask the ads for estrogen therapy.

At the same time, she's so busy she feels constantly out of breath. If she's a professional, she's working more hours than her counterpart of 20 years ago—and trying to rush home in time to give the baby a bath. If she's a stay-at-home mom, she's driving the kids to more classes, more games, more playdates than her mother did, not to mention trying to live up to society's demands of perfect-momhood: Buy organic! Be supportive, not permissive! Lose five pounds! Her husband isn't a bad guy, but he's busier than ever, too, working harder just to stay afloat. And (this is practically unmentionable) therapists say they're seeing more cases of depressed male libido. It turns out he's too tired and stressed to have sex. An affair is a logical outcome of this scenario, therapists say: women think they should be having great sex and romantic dates decades into their marriage, and at the same time, they're pragmatic enough to see how impossible that is. Couples begin to live parallel lives, instead of intersecting ones, and that's when the loneliness and resentment set in.

Marisol can't remember the last time her husband paid her a compliment. That's why the 39-year-old grandmother, who was pregnant and married at 15, looks forward to meeting with her boyfriend of five years during lunch breaks and after work. "There is so much passion between us," she says. "He tells me my skin is soft and that my hair smells good. I know it sounds stupid, but that stuff matters. It makes me feel sexy again."

Ironically, the realities of the overprogrammed life make it easier, not harder, to fool around. When days are planned to the minute, it's a cinch to pencil in a midday tryst—and remember to wear the lace-edged underwear—at least compared with trying to stay awake and in the mood through "Law & Order." And as any guileless teenager knows, nothing obscures your whereabouts better than an Internet connection and a reliable cell phone. Amanda's husband has no idea she has six e-mail addresses, in addition to an account specifically for messages from her boyfriend Ron. Amanda, a customer-service rep in L.A., uses e-mail to flirt with Ron, then turns to her instant messenger or cell phone when it comes to setting up a rendezvous. "Text messaging is safer than e-mailing," says Amanda, 36, who's been married for eight years. What would she do without her mobile or computer? "No cell phone? I can't even imagine."

Along with its 4 million porn sites, the Internet has exploded with sites specifically for people who want to cheat on their spouses—sites like "Married and Flirting" at Yahoo, "a chat room dedicated to those who are married but curious, bored or both!!" These sites contain all the predictable pornographic overtures, but also such poignant notes as this: "Ok, I know it is late almost 11:30 my time and I am still up on this pitiful Friday night. Hubby STILL at work."

Online romances have a special appeal for married women. For one thing, you don't have to leave the house. "You can come home from work, be exhausted, take a shower, have wet, dripping hair, have something fast to eat and then, if you're feeling lonely, you can go on the Internet," says Rona Subotnik, a marriage and family therapist in Palm Desert, Calif. On the Web, women can browse and flirt without being explicit about their intentions—if they even know what their intentions are. Clicking past porn, women prefer to visit sites that dovetail with their interests, such as chess, bridge or knitting, explains Peggy Vaughan, author of "The Monogamy Myth" and host of dearpeggy.com, a Web site for people with unfaithful spouses. "They find somebody else who seems to think like they do, and then they gradually move from that to an instant message, and then they wake up one day and they cannot believe it happened to them," says Vaughan. Last year Vaughan did a survey of a thousand people who visited her Web site, and 70 percent of the respondents were women. Her results, though not scientific, are remarkable: 79 percent said they were not looking for love online. More than half said they met their online lover in person, and about half said the relationship culminated in sex. Sixty percent said their spouses had no idea.

John LaSage was shocked to come home one day and find his wife of 24 years had disappeared. No note, no phone call, nothing. He'd bought her a computer four months previously, he says, and he knew something was wrong: she'd stay up until 3 or 4 a.m., browsing online. She told him she was doing research for a romance novel she was writing, he says, and after her disappearance, he hacked into the computer to investigate. "She had set up a chat room that was called ... gosh ... 'Smooth Legs.' And so guys would come in there and flirt with her. I have transcripts. I can't tell you how excruciating it was to read the e-mails from people supposedly speaking with my wife, but she wasn't talking like my wife. That was just weird." Two weeks later he discovered she had left the country, he says. "I wasn't the perfect husband. I would have done a lot of things differently, but I never got the chance," says LaSage, who has since founded an online support group (chatcheaters.com) for people with spouses who stray.

In 1643 Mary Latham, who was 18 years old and married, was hanged in Massachusetts with her lover James Britton. Since then, adultery has been a crime in many states. A woman accused of adultery could, in divorce court, lose her home, her income and her children. All that changed in the 1970s, when most states adopted "no fault" and "equitable distribution" divorce laws, in which nearly all the assets accrued to either partner during the marriage belong to the marriage and, in a divorce settlement, are split evenly. And unless a woman (or man) has been flagrantly or inappropriately sexual in front of the children, or has, in the frenzy of an affair, neglected them, infidelity does not legally affect settlements or custody. In researching her book "The Price of Motherhood," journalist Ann Crittenden found, however, that an implicit bias against female adultery still prevails in the country's predominantly male courtrooms—and that when it came to settlements, that bias was costly to women. "There may be no fault as grounds, but fault has not left the system," she says.

Unearthing infidelity is shattering to any spouse. Men can be as traumatized as women by such a revelation; they can also be more surprised. David, 39, a government worker in Washington, D.C., discovered his wife was cheating the day she told him she wanted a divorce. "Never in a million years did I think it was possible." He found out later that his wife had started seeing someone at work, someone David knew fairly well because the two couples often met socially. Once the reality set in, he couldn't get images of his wife and the other man out of his head. Beset by nightmares, he started taking antidepressants. "I felt shame for what had happened, like I couldn't keep a person happy enough to stay with me." Now, eight months later, David is beginning to date again. His divorce should be final this month.

Just over half of all cases of female infidelity end in divorce, says Susan Shapiro Barash, a professor of gender studies at Marymount Manhattan College and author of "A Passion for More: Wives Reveal the Affairs That Make or Break Their Marriages." But that number may be shrinking. The conservative-marriage movement, as well as recent books like Judith Wallerstein's "The Unexpected Legacy of Divorce," have created a backlash against separation and raised consciousness about the seriousness of its effects on children. Therapists who see the overworked professional set say they've noticed an interesting trend: people who have children and marry late in life tend to be less interested in cheating than their contemporaries who married earlier—and more willing to work it out when a woman (or man) does stray. These women have spent a lot of time alone, and they're wise to the benefits of companionship. They've also waited a long time to have families and have a realistic sense of what's at stake. "I think people try to stay together," says Alvin Mesnikoff, a psychiatrist with a private practice in New York. In spite of the temptations, "women want a relationship, and they're willing to work hard at it."

Divorce or no, how do responsible parents protect the hearts of their children when they're in the midst of heartbreak themselves? Therapists say kids don't care whether it's Mom or Dad who fools around—all they care about is knowing they're safe and that their lives will remain stable. It's difficult, but parents who are dealing with a revelation of infidelity need to protect young kids from the facts of the case, as well as from their own anger. "There are very few things I will be absolute about, and this is one of them," says Katz. "Everything [children] ask for is not something they want. And if they ask, you should say, 'Yes, you're right. Things are tense around here, but this is between Mom and me'."

Explaining infidelity to older children is somewhat more complicated. If a 15-year-old turns to his mom and asks, "How long has this been going on?" a truthful answer may be in order, says Berger, the Elkins Park psychiatrist. And if he asks, "How could this happen?" "It may be reasonable for Mom to say, 'You don't understand, dear, that Dad has been cheating on me'," Berger says. Sometimes correcting the record is all right. "There's nothing gained by one parent being a martyr to the other parent's mistreatment." What parents need to avoid at all costs is to wrap the children into the drama by treating them as confidants.

Nadine grew up in a small, Midwestern town, and when she was 13 years old, her mother cheated on her father, moved to a town two hours away and married the other man. "There weren't any fights, nothing crazy," says Nadine, who at 28 lives in a big city and works in finance. "We sat down at Christmas. We discussed that Mother was leaving; it was nothing we had done." She and her siblings continued to live with her father; her mother went to school conferences and games as she had always done. Her parents remained, as she puts it, "best friends." But Nadine's teenage years were difficult. She never warmed up to the new man. She felt abandoned.
In retrospect, Nadine understands what pushed her mother to be unfaithful. Beautiful and intelligent, her mother was stifled by her life's low horizons, and her father, a stand-up guy, was probably a little bit boring. The new man promised travel, wealth and adventure; her father was the kind of guy who'd say, "Why go around the world? You'll get plane-sick." And although she and her mother have made a kind of peace—"I got tired of making her cry," she says—she thinks the affair eroded any kind of trust she has in marriage or love. She can't stay in long relationships. "Ever since I could date, all I could think was, 'I will never, ever, ever do what my mom did.' I will never have a man take care of me. I have been called an ice princess in the past. I feel in some way my mom sold out and kind of fell for something."

Who said being married and raising kids was easy? The good news is that the wounds inflicted on a family by a woman's infidelity are not always critical. Therapists say couples often can—and do—get past it. Sometimes the husband sees it as a wake-up call and renews his efforts to be attentive. Sometimes, especially if neither party is too angry, too defensive or too far out the door, the couple can use it as an opportunity to air grievances and soothe old hurts. Sometimes the woman sees the dalliance for what it is, a fling, and takes it with her to the grave. In her study of good marriages, Wallerstein found that an affair did not necessarily damage family life—especially if it fell into the category of a "one-night stand."

"In good marriages this doesn't dominate the landscape, and the kids don't know," she says. She remembers interviewing a 30-year-old man, who said that when he was 9, his mother had an affair, but his father assured him that they would stay together. The man said: "I learned from my father that anything worth having is worth fighting for." When lunch is over and the wine wears off, most women will admit that if they were the prize in a fantasy duel between an imperfect but loving husband and a handsome stranger, they'd root for the husband every time.

With Vanessa Juarez, Holly Peterson, Karen Springen, Claire Sulmers, William Lee Adams and Raina Kelley

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5359395/site/newsweek/

[Devil Dog74]

Of course one should expect to stay in love - why else get married? However, if one equates superficial gestures like a $4.95 bouquet of flowers and compliments on their choice of shampoo with true love they are a dingbat. I don't think there is a "nice" way of putting it. Besides, they deserve scorn. They are hypocrites.
The dingbats in this article are falling back on awfully lame rationalizations for their infantile behavior.

Of all the causes you cite the only one I agree with is selfishness = infidelity. I don't think ignorance, insecurity, or neglect are valid excuses for breaking the pact of trust two people make when they marry. That is not to say that selfishness is any excuse in and of itself, obviously - there simply is no defensible excuse for infidelity.

The closest you can come to an "excusable" reason for breaking trust is when trust has already been broken. For example - the classic "revenge fling" some people have when they discover their partner has cheated.
But even that falls under the category of selfishness. If a person cannot remain faithful to their mate for the knowledge of having been duped, they should do the proper thing, take the high road, and leave the relationship with their integrity intact.

[Devil Dog74]

This is why marriage licences should be made renewable every few years, like dog licences.

[Devil Dog74]

So it is better to remain in a loveless marriage? Marriage today is rather meaningless with such a ridiculous divorce rate (even higher for second time "newlyweds"!).

And if you didnt catch it, my post was intended as sarcasm - a comment on the relative worth of marriage today. Not a realistic assertion.

It, however, still doesn't change my opinion on the lost purpose of marriage.

If 2 people really love each other, then a piece of paper will never make any difference. The institution of family has always existed, with or without "marriage". In Australia, a recent census revealed over HALF of Aussies were born out of wedlock. I assume it is along similar lines in the US as well (guessing here). And to suggest that since they didnt have a piece of paper legally and religiously binding them in marriage, then the institution of family will somehow crumble? That's absurd!

Love, dedication, and commitment exist beyond the self-righteous bestowings of a priest, or some legally binding form. And it always will.

[spywizard]

This is why marriage licences should be made renewable every few years, like dog licences.

i agree with that...........

[Devil Dog74]

Some women are prone to always cheat just like some men are, while some only have a fling with one person, but then decide they will never do that again. An old survey said 30% women cheat and 50% men cheat. I've recently read that it's more like 50% men and 50% women these days.

[NoobJuice]

fukn sluts

[Commando_Barbi]

fukn sluts

Nice response. Did you take a lot of time to think that one up?

[Pale Horse]

Noob, do we have a double standard? It used to be that if your wife cheated you killed her , beat the crap out of her or threw her ass on the street with nothing, that was our leverage. ERA blew that one for us.

Now women can be seen in their true colors. They used to stand for purity, virtue, unconditional love etc.... Now they are not much better than men and we are pigs even if we aren't cheaters.

[Commando_Barbi]

A guy cheats..he's THE MAN.

A woman cheats..she's a slut.

When a man cheats...it's because she doesn't pay enough attention to me, she nags me, she doesn't take care of herself anymore, she's not the pretty young thing I married, BLAH BLAH BLAH. Other men feel sorry for you....you were justified.

When a woman cheats...it's because he doesn't pay enough attention to me, he's not sensitive to my feelings, he doesn't have that lean, muscular body he had when we met and he turns me off.....BLAH BLAH BLAH.... Whoops...look....she's still a SLUT!

Yep I'd say a double standard exists.

[Devil Dog74]

your absolutely right it is a double standard

[Devil Dog74]

but instead of man he's the man just call him a man-whore

whatever u can say to make it insulting would work i guess

[rujulus]

I'll take more time on this one...fukn Good girls that cheat on there husband's.

[Devil Dog74]

just for my own personal beliefs: do not take this any offensive

LADY = you gotta work hard for it. It is merited.

WOMAN = Just not on the FIRST date.

WHORE = As soon as you pick her up. It is unmerited

[co2boi]

A guy cheats..he's THE MAN.

A woman cheats..she's a slut.

When a man cheats...it's because she doesn't pay enough attention to me, she nags me, she doesn't take care of herself anymore, she's not the pretty young thing I married, BLAH BLAH BLAH. Other men feel sorry for you....you were justified.

When a woman cheats...it's because he doesn't pay enough attention to me, he's not sensitive to my feelings, he doesn't have that lean, muscular body he had when we met and he turns me off.....BLAH BLAH BLAH.... Whoops...look....she's still a SLUT!

Yep I'd say a double standard exists.

I've never heard of a guy being called "the man" because he cheated on his wife. All of my friends are very much "men's men" and that kinda sh!t disgusts us all. If your marriage is bad enough to cheat, then get a divorce. People get and stay married for the wrong reasons, namely children and / or convenience

Now I will admit, pre-marriage a guy could sleep with 50 chicks and be a bad mofo, but a girl would be labeled a ho / slut. I think that's wrong too. Girls are liberating themselves though...cool beans gurlies.

[Blown_SC]

I personally don't feel there is a double standard.
In my opinion, if you cheat... you're a cheater.
Cheaters are scum IMHO...
Male... female.. doesn't matter to me, or many others.

[UrbanLegend]

A guy cheats..he's THE MAN.

Not everyone has the same set of beliefs......aside from the teenage MTV crowd, I would say the man cheating is just as looked down upon as the female cheating.


IMO if people married for the right reasons then less cheating and divorce would occur. It seems like a lot of the people getting married these days just look at it as an extension of being BF/ GF, not as a sacred union between men and women. Getting a divore is just like breaking up to them, nothing major, assuming they have a pre-nup.....

[Devil Dog74]

unless u have kids...get ready for child support

Teh destroyer of men...

[UrbanLegend]

unless u have kids...get ready for child support

Teh destroyer of men...

That too..........but I was more reffering to young, immature couples, who I have the most day-to-day contact with, and they usually don't have kids right away (within the first few months to a year).

[co2boi]

Not everyone has the same set of beliefs......aside from the teenage MTV crowd, I would say the man cheating is just as looked down upon as the female cheating.


IMO if people married for the right reasons then less cheating and divorce would occur. It seems like a lot of the people getting married these days just look at it as an extension of being BF/ GF, not as a sacred union between men and women. Getting a divore is just like breaking up to them, nothing major, assuming they have a pre-nup.....

yeah I agree, marriage is almost like a game. The guy just does it to hold on to the girl and the girl just wants to wear a pretty dress (over-generalizing here) and neither have a ****ing clue what it's really going to be like or what it means to commit yourself and your efforts to 1 person for the rest of your life. I got lukcy, my wife is my lover and my best friend and I couldn't imagine it being any other way.

[jbigdog69]

There will always be a point in time where your "will" or "willy" will be tested. If the timing is right and no one else will find out....what will you do??? Marriage is hard. Although I have no regrets, there are some real genuine biatches out there who make men miserable. These women hold tha punannie from them and make their men beg for sex. Then if you take that situation and add some test e to the equation. Sh!t, there is no question....bring on the cycle whores!!!! lol

[co2boi]

Oh I forgot, if she cheats on my I will cut her throat

[co2boi]

There will always be a point in time where your "will" or "willy" will be tested. If the timing is right and no one else will find out....what will you do??? Marriage is hard. Although I have no regrets, there are some real genuine biatches out there who make men miserable. These women hold tha punannie from them and make their men beg for sex. Then if you take that situation and add some test e to the equation. Sh!t, there is no question....bring on the cycle whores!!!! lol

yeah, no kidding bro. The 2 biggest relationship killers are sex and finances. You meet a girl and she's doing you 10 times a week, the next thing you know your married and she's wearing a chastity belt. Guys need a girl to make their willy happy

[Commando_Barbi]

Well.. I'm in the Navy. In my job....unfortunately, I see a lot of the cheating, the attitudes with the "guys" on deployment, and the results.

I agree.......a cheater is a cheater. I just don't like the fact that all too often a woman is labeled as a slut...while a guy gets a pat on the back.

Wrong is wrong!

[Devil Dog74]

There will always be a point in time where your "will" or "willy" will be tested. If the timing is right and no one else will find out....what will you do??? Marriage is hard. Although I have no regrets, there are some real genuine biatches out there who make men miserable. These women hold tha punannie from them and make their men beg for sex. Then if you take that situation and add some test e to the equation. Sh!t, there is no question....bring on the cycle whores!!!! lol

[Devil Dog74]

Well.. I'm in the Navy. In my job....unfortunately, I see a lot of the cheating, the attitudes with the "guys" on deployment, and the results.

I agree.......a cheater is a cheater. I just don't like the fact that all too often a woman is labeled as a slut...while a guy gets a pat on the back.

Wrong is wrong!

i've never met guys who patted each other over the back for sleeping with dozens of women while in a relationship...

[Devil Dog74]

yeah, no kidding bro. The 2 biggest relationship killers are sex and finances. You meet a girl and she's doing you 10 times a week, the next thing you know your married and she's wearing a chastity belt. Guys need a girl to make their willy happy

Hmmm i think the should be a law if married spouses wear a cock lock or hang weights to their dick and women wear a chasity belt. that way nobody screws anyone over...

[Pale Horse]

I agree guys these days aren't built like the old days when almost every guy who didn't have a mistress did sleep around 40s, 50s type mentality we don't see it as cool or macho to cheat on our wives. Guys today are more committed to their women in my book than the women to the men. Today a girl knows she's got you by the short hairs once you get married ie: 50% of your stuff plus if she spits out a kid or two your gonna live in a cardboard box for a month or so until you can get your act together. And then be paying out the rear for 2o years,Girls know this and play it to the hilt!

[NoobJuice]

Nice response. Did you take a lot of time to think that one up?

I wouldnt do that to my girl........ period

[Commando_Barbi]

i've never met guys who patted each other over the back for sleeping with dozens of women while in a relationship...

Well that's good. Unfortunatly, in my line of work...I see it.

[Devil Dog74]

I agree guys these days aren't built like the old days when almost every guy who didn't have a mistress did sleep around 40s, 50s type mentality we don't see it as cool or macho to cheat on our wives. Guys today are more committed to their women in my book than the women to the men. Today a girl knows she's got you by the short hairs once you get married ie: 50% of your stuff plus if she spits out a kid or two your gonna live in a cardboard box for a month or so until you can get your act together. And then be paying out the rear for 2o years,Girls know this and play it to the hilt!

Preach on brutha

[Jack87]

Personally i think that's a great idea...

This is why marriage licences should be made renewable every few years, like dog licences.

[twosocks40]

i've never met guys who patted each other over the back for sleeping with dozens of women while in a relationship...

Ever been in the military???


-B

[stitch1967]

Ever been in the military???


-B

Yes, and what I recall is that as much as the husbands and wives that were in the military and on deployment fooled around....no one came close to the debauchery by the spouses left after the military spouses shipped out.

The first night, the frickin' eclubs were packed to the gills with wives (and so husbands) trying to get some "strange".

It swings both ways. And in my dealings, I'll have to say that society forgives a cheating husband little faster than a cheating wife. But times are changing fast....

JMO, Take care of momma or daddy at home and they won't go roaming the streets. And that takes a sh*tload of effort and dedication...and commitment. Other than that there's no reason to worry because if they want to they'll find a way to.....guys who try to keep their gals locked in a closet to keep from cheating just make them want it worse.

[stitch1967]

Well that's good. Unfortunatly, in my line of work...I see it.

Anybody that doesn't, has their eyes closed. Although I'd say it's not as prevalent now days. IMO there's a lot of hypocrits out there now....guys who say shame shame to other men who may cheat, but if given the opportunity would do the same.

It's all about appearances and who gets caught if you ask me.

[goodtobeapimp]

Most women I know have EXTREMELY high standards for a man. Men typically don't. Some women are with guys they don't wanna be with just because they are "supporting them" or sometimes just because they have been together a long time.

Most men will remain happy with small things. While most women want you to build a life for them,and if you fail then they start seeing your flaws more and more. I couldn't tell you how many unhappy couples are linked together because of MONEY. If that's the case I feel NOTHING for any woman like that.

If your dumb enough to get married to someone you don't wanna be with,then you have made your own wrong doing, not anyone elses.

Also, I can't say that ANY of my friends brag about cheating like the stereotypical bullsh*t all women think goes on. I'm not saying they haven't im saying that they dont come down to my house breakdancing with a pa system hooked up announcing it while they are driving down the road like all women tend to think.

If you ask me about cheating, I'll say women are just as bad if not worse. Especially people that are married or in long term relationships. Sex can keep a guy happy most of the time. Money is what keeps women happy.

[Devil Dog74]

Ever been in the military???


-B

Yea currently and alot of my friends got divorced like it was cool...

shame tho cuz they were deployed to iraq and came back single...

[Devil Dog74]

Most women I know have EXTREMELY high standards for a man. Men typically don't. Some women are with guys they don't wanna be with just because they are "supporting them" or sometimes just because they have been together a long time.

Most men will remain happy with small things. While most women want you to build a life for them,and if you fail then they start seeing your flaws more and more. I couldn't tell you how many unhappy couples are linked together because of MONEY. If that's the case I feel NOTHING for any woman like that.

If your dumb enough to get married to someone you don't wanna be with,then you have made your own wrong doing, not anyone elses.

Also, I can't say that ANY of my friends brag about cheating like the stereotypical bullsh*t all women think goes on. I'm not saying they haven't im saying that they dont come down to my house breakdancing with a pa system hooked up announcing it while they are driving down the road like all women tend to think.

If you ask me about cheating, I'll say women are just as bad if not worse. Especially people that are married or in long term relationships. Sex can keep a guy happy most of the time. Money is what keeps women happy.

No wonder why men want to be rich...LOL i'm rich biotch.

[Philliagorillia]

I dont trust anyone after i jsut went thru, im sich of people that get your hopes up then shoot you down and then you think to yourself why did i even waste my time with her. Im sick of relationships, cant trust anyone...

[goodtobeapimp]

No wonder why men want to be rich...LOL i'm rich biotch.

Enjoy yourself!!!!!