I just got fired from bouncing?

I'm new to this bar, been there a few weeks. I ask for this guys ID while he's seated at the table, he says "**** you bitch"

I said, "Excuse me?"

he said, "**** you bitch, I ain't showing you ****!!"... he was serious

I said "you either show me your ID or leave"

he said "**** you bitch", gave me the middle finger

I yanked him from the booth, grabbed him in a choke and dragged him out of the bar. Very common. Nothing over-the-top, I didn't choke him out I just maintained control of him. And the other bouncer yanked him by the neck when he tried to squirm at the door. Tons of witnesses. This is probably the least violent incident there has been as of yet.

So today I run into the guy who runs security, and who got me the job, at the gym. He told me in a nice way that I was fired... because the guy who I threw out took pictures of his bruised neck, hired a lawyer and threatened to sue the bar... unless they fire me, in which case he would drop all the charges.

So I'm fired, for doing my job. Correctly.

Has this happened to anyone else? Is it normal? I know life's unfair... it isn't that big of a deal.

But it's an awesome job, the pussy is incredible and the violence can be pretty fun stuff. And I got paid well too. **** it.

you can sue the bar for wrongful termination.

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Originally Posted by chrisAdams

you can sue the bar for wrongful termination.

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indeed

i know man, it really is... i don't deserve it bro

i was just doing my job

That pussy should have just taken get tossed out on his ass
like a man... I hate pussy ass mutha phuckers like that... Bet
you would like to run into him in a dark ally... I know that's
how i would be feeling...

i hate bitches that act all tough then when **** happens they turn around and do **** like that. you'll catch him around.
still ****ty u lost ur job tho

Also, if the bar admits that they fired you because a "threat" from someone sueing...

im pretty sure thats illegal.

Dude...you did your job.....dont back down!

plenty of other bars out there that need pricks thrown out of

very sad...

similar thing happened to big-g..

i told him to threaten the owner of the bar and threaten to sue him too. he didn't.

A.A.

Bar jobs with the exception of cash cow positions are a dime a dozen, even in good places. As long as you are in it for women and action and not $$$ you should be able find another job asap if you want one.

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Originally Posted by mass junkie

plenty of other bars out there that need pricks thrown out of

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Reluctantly.. I agree... :bcool: lol...

Definitely not cool bro, but you'll be able to get another in no time... ;)

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Bar jobs with the exception of cash cow positions are a dime a dozen, even in good places. As long as you are in it for women and action and not $$$ you should be able find another job asap if you want one.

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Hopefully, but this job paid real well... $15 an hour PLUS they make waitresses clean, when the last people leave I go home. Doesn't get too much better.

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similar thing happened to big-g

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I guess this is relatively common?

Hopefully I'll be able to get another one, thanks for all the kind words guys

You don't use force unless absoultly nessasary. You would have been fired from any place that I ever bounced at for this type of behavior, so next time something like this happens radio the other guys u work with and go at him as a group...9 times out of 10 they'll get up and walk out...

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Originally Posted by MBaraso

You don't use force unless absoultly nessasary. You would have been fired from any place that I ever bounced at for this type of behavior, so next time something like this happens radio the other guys u work with and go at him as a group...9 times out of 10 they'll get up and walk out...

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I agree,

I usually don’t grab guys until they are either aggressive toward me, other bouncers or other patrons.

When in this type of situation, I usually explain to the patron that either he is going to show me his ID or he will have to show it to the police, further explaining that if we have to call the police they will be taking him to jail for Criminal Trespassing. We won’t call the police, but sometimes the bluff works. If it doesn’t work, I get several bouncers there and again explain that he has to go, if he doesn’t I would help him up, if he resists or starts fighting with me, then I would restrain him and remove him from the establishment.

Never handle a problem patron alone, always have at least a couple of other bouncers there with you. That works in your favor in two ways, one you have help incase his buddies show up and decide to jump you, and two that gives you witnesses that will be on your side.

You didnt technically do anything wrong but you could have handled the situation differently.

Anyone who bounces knows its better to approach problems (drunks/assholes) in groups as a team (at least 2 bouncers)

I got into trouble for putting a guy in a choke and dragging out when, at closing time (lights on music off cleaning up), he kicks over a trash can right in front of me and starts laughing at me. My managers are already dealing with 2 other lawsuits and didnt want another.

When a guys got 3-5 bouncers and the DJ (our Dj used to be a bouncer and is 285 lbs) in their face theyll usually leave very quietly.
I know sometimes its a hassle to go get other guys to help handle something you can very easily but it the smart thing to do.

Anyway, I know it sucks because WOMEN LOVE BOUNCERS (probably more than bartenders) I think its the whole power thing.
****, thats the only reason I still do it, cause I aint getting paid much

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Originally Posted by chrisAdams

you can sue the bar for wrongful termination.

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Yep. And to be honest, with an employer like yours, that would turn its back and not support their employee it cant be the best of jobs.

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Originally Posted by Bigen12

I agree,

I usually don’t grab guys until they are either aggressive toward me, other bouncers or other patrons.

I get several bouncers there and again explain that he has to go, if he doesn’t I would help him up, if he resists or starts fighting with me, then I would restrain him and remove him from the establishment.

Never handle a problem patron alone, always have at least a couple of other bouncers there with you. That works in your favor in two ways, one you have help incase his buddies show up and decide to jump you, and two that gives you witnesses that will be on your side.

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Two very important points Bigen12 brings up. Maybe former Peace Officer?

Legally, you can only use force necessary to stop the threat, and since I teach combat and restraints, I'll ask the questions that usually come up in legal circles.

What is your training level? Are you professionally trained (martial arts, boxing, former navy seal) or are you just naturally gifted (Tank Abbott).
I am assuming this guy was drinking, and you weren't, which makes you highly vulnerable to lawsuit. Although he probably deserved it, this part sucks.
Training level is one of the first questions a judge would ask if you were standing in front of the man. Reason? I'll make a simple picture. If you were a boxer, and a guy came at you, it is reasonable that your self defence would include a left hook to the face. You don't know anything else. You used what you knew.

However, most professionals are trained in an escalation of force (and I'm not talking gun arts here). Step one: You ask for compliance (this is why you should have 2-3 guys with you, because it stops alcolhol-induced ego). You state out loud (and the judge will NOT like statements like "get up or we'll kick your ass) that he has to leave, you don't want any problems, blah bleeding heart blah, you like his nice suit, please help me help you, blah blah"

Then, think about climbing a ladder, where every step gets worse, until you introduce him to Jesus at the top.

Step 2 You can take ahold of his arm, very nicely, but don't hold on or lift him. Let him know the direction he should go, and leave a loose grip. HE WILL ALWAYS RESPOND (POORLY) TO THIS. And its on!

Step 3: Look for non-lethal restraints, including wrist locks and fingers. Use of 2-3 guys to tackle him will greatly help, as he is on the ground while you get a hammer lock, full nelson, etc. If two to three guys jump on him, he legally can start punching, but like response is not for you three guys to start punching back. Tell the judge you were looking for restraining techniques.
(note: Use of a chokehold is not considered basic restraint, as when someone is being choked, they respond, instintively, with more violence) Use a chokehold when every thing else fails, and not in Step 3.

Step 4. You can't restrain him and he's totally uncompliant, and now you fear getting hurt. You also fear escalation into an uncontrolled brawl. You are on the ground, and can "soften" him up with blows, until the time you can restrain him. This is where training is critical to prevent lawsuit. I have literally beat the sh** out of a guy at this point, because my adreneline gets going and you strike him 5 or 6 times too many and forget that your goal here is to RESTRAIN HIM. Control your emotions and go for the restraint. If you end up in a choke after all the others don't work, then tell the judge the moves you made to get to that point.


Step 5 and up (cause I gotta go to work) He reaches for a stick, knife, weapon of any sort. You can use any and all force, including lethal strikes to the throat and bone breaking techniques to stop him.

I love this subject, so I'll come back to this post later.

Just tell me what your training is and I'll help you here. Maybe just to get you a good cover story.

Jimbo

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Originally Posted by Executioner

Hopefully, but this job paid real well... $15 an hour PLUS they make waitresses clean, when the last people leave I go home. Doesn't get too much better.

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Im sorry but this comment made me think youve cleaned up in bars? Its not a bouncers job. I always walk home when the last costumer leaves.


"The force ladder" is an good example jim, we use it over here too.

Always keep your head cool, those 2-3 extra punches you hit in his face can be your bouncer licence going away.

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Originally Posted by Executioner

and the violence can be pretty fun stuff.

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That tells me you're the wrong person for the job. Violence should be a last resort.

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Originally Posted by Executioner

I'm new to this bar, been there a few weeks. I ask for this guys ID while he's seated at the table, he says "**** you bitch"

I said, "Excuse me?"

he said, "**** you bitch, I ain't showing you ****!!"... he was serious

I said "you either show me your ID or leave"

he said "**** you bitch", gave me the middle finger

I yanked him from the booth, grabbed him in a choke and dragged him out of the bar. Very common. Nothing over-the-top, I didn't choke him out I just maintained control of him. And the other bouncer yanked him by the neck when he tried to squirm at the door. Tons of witnesses. This is probably the least violent incident there has been as of yet.

So today I run into the guy who runs security, and who got me the job, at the gym. He told me in a nice way that I was fired... because the guy who I threw out took pictures of his bruised neck, hired a lawyer and threatened to sue the bar... unless they fire me, in which case he would drop all the charges.

So I'm fired, for doing my job. Correctly.

Has this happened to anyone else? Is it normal? I know life's unfair... it isn't that big of a deal.

But it's an awesome job, the pussy is incredible and the violence can be pretty fun stuff. And I got paid well too. **** it.

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Thats bull$hit bro. If your job wont back you up then screw them anyway. You did the right thing.

Whatever you do, don't sue the bar. The job isn't worth sueing for, it wasn't your livelyhood.

1) You'll lose out on money with the legal fee's (which will be very plenty)
2) The bar could easily turn against you and say that they fired you for being a 'hot head'
3) You're gonna lose.

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Originally Posted by sensei_jim

Two very important points Bigen12 brings up. Maybe former Peace Officer?

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Not a former Peach Officer, I started to but when I was going to have to take a 50% cut in pay, I had to let it go. It is just common since to me.

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Originally Posted by sensei_jim

Step 2 You can take ahold of his arm, very nicely, but don't hold on or lift him. Let him know the direction he should go, and leave a loose grip. HE WILL ALWAYS RESPOND (POORLY) TO THIS. And its on!

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Exactly, if they are being a smart ass, this will set them off, no matter how gentle you are, and after that point you are defending yourself.

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Originally Posted by Carlos_E

That tells me you're the wrong person for the job. Violence should be a last resort.

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I understand what you are saying, however when some smart a$$ starts **** and runs their mouth, telling me how bad he, I get a certain amount of satisfaction in restraining them and carrying their dumb a$$ out of the bar. I love those moments; I certainly don’t do it for the money.

I like to look at it like this, there are certain things that you would not do at a person’s house. If you punched holes in the walls, harassed other guests, or started a fight, you would expect to be kicked out. I consider the bar that I work in to be like my house, I will not tolerate any of that bull sh@t.

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Originally Posted by Bigen12

I understand what you are saying, however when some smart a$$ starts **** and runs their mouth, telling me how bad he, I get a certain amount of satisfaction in restraining them and carrying their dumb a$$ out of the bar. I love those moments; I certainly don’t do it for the money.

I like to look at it like this, there are certain things that you would not do at a person’s house. If you punched holes in the walls, harassed other guests, or started a fight, you would expect to be kicked out. I consider the bar that I work in to be like my house, I will not tolerate any of that bull sh@t.

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I get your point. But it bothers me when I see someone say they enjoy violence. Those are the types that go looking for trouble.

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Originally Posted by Carlos_E

I get your point. But it bothers me when I see someone say they enjoy violence. Those are the types that go looking for trouble.

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i love those harda$$s, because they are usually the biggest pussy in the bar, bc they are always tryin to look hard, and we all know ppl who are, dont have to say a word..

Sorry I have to go to work.

My last words on this subject is to let the job go. Its common practice in limitation of liability for your employer to let you go. They can use this as a defense. 20 years ago, I was fired for the same thing you were (my example of getting caught in the moment was true) and from the same type of job in Texas. I was rehired about 6 months later when the injured patron did not sue (because he was arrested for the incident). I was welcomed back with open arms. I have studied lotsa legal liability issues, and firing the offending employee usually ruins the case unless they showed gross negligence in hiring/training you (i.e. they hired a felon and told you to kick anybodys ass who doesn't comply).

Good luck and god speed,

Jimbo

If I ever got into bouncing I would have ripped the cheeky fuxkers head off and then taken him down a dark alleyway where me and my mates would have proceded to kick 10 bells of **** out of him, as for any assault charges.........What assault ? I was with my mates all night without incident

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Originally Posted by shaun_brotherton

If I ever got into bouncing I would have ripped the cheeky fuxkers head off and then taken him down a dark alleyway where me and my mates would have proceded to kick 10 bells of **** out of him, as for any assault charges.........What assault ? I was with my mates all night without incident

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Let's all pray the fruit juice bar never lets you bounce... :eek:

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and the violence can be pretty fun stuff.

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it can be... assuming the person you attack is clearly in the wrong (attacked another bouncer, ect.) ... but I'm far from a loose cannon. Obviously the best thing to do in any situation is to talk people out of resisting physically.

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You don't use force unless absoultly nessasary. You would have been fired from any place that I ever bounced at for this type of behavior, so next time something like this happens radio the other guys u work with and go at him as a group...9 times out of 10 they'll get up and walk out...

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We don't have radios, only one other guy and he was working the door - I should've gotten him, but the guy was real small.... and was getting aggressive real fast. It was to the point where the guy was clearly engaging me - he was small, I am big... getting the other bouncer wouldn't have solved the problem anyway. I decided it was going to get physical either now or later. So I figured the best way to solve it is to catch him off guard, before he had time to prepare.

Anyway, I could've handled it better... but the guys friend came back later, apologized for him being such an idiot and paid for the broken stamp pad.

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Whatever you do, don't sue the bar. The job isn't worth sueing for, it wasn't your livelyhood.

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and don't worry about that, I'm still 18, that isn't an option and the job was fun while I had it

Take this as a life lesson... whiny people with lawyers get what they want because no one wants to deal with it. Also, he and his lawyer could have got the bar into legal trouble. The best advise for dealing with these people is to play everything by the book and even be super nice to avoid any of this crap. The squeaky wheel gets the oil

You make some good points but IMO there are some big flaws in your post.

This is utter rubbish. The person under the influence has no credibility in a courtroom.

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Originally Posted by sensei_jim

I am assuming this guy was drinking, and you weren't, which makes you highly vulnerable to lawsuit.

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Old wives tale. Please direct me to the section in the criminal code where this alleged two to three man restraint situation gives the person being restrained the right to 'start swinging'. It has nothing to do with the number of people on the guy. It has everything to do with reasonable doubt of your belief that you were in a self defense situation.

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Originally Posted by sensei_jim

If two to three guys jump on him, he legally can start punching....

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Originally Posted by chicamahomico

You make some good points but IMO there are some big flaws in your post.

This is utter rubbish. The person under the influence has no credibility in a courtroom.


Old wives tale. Please direct me to the section in the criminal code where this alleged two to three man restraint situation gives the person being restrained the right to 'start swinging'. It has nothing to do with the number of people on the guy. It has everything to do with reasonable doubt of your belief that you were in a self defense situation.

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In the rush of getting this done quickly, I did not elaborate fully. And you are right. The point I was making assumed a trained professional, taking on a heavily intoxicated person. The judge will look at variables to see if you could of (the one in control) used a hold or move that fit the situation to some degree. If I, for example, used a wristlock to gain control, then applied a kick to the knee, the question would surely come up..."You had control at the wristlock, why did you see the need to (lol) kneecap him". Applying myself to the situation, and since my job in of itself assumes high training, I would have to prove an escalation of force. A bouncer has a bit less presumption of training.

A better example that we might agree on is a drunk woman. Yea, she can gouge your eyes out and hit you with a hi-heel, but try to explain to the judge that you've got a black belt in Jujitsu and the only thing you could think of was to break her wrist. :lol:

Here's the second variable that I left out. If hes a huge beefy fu**er on a couple of beers (lightly intoxicated), then I have reasonable cause to believe that if he gets out of the hold, I'm in deep Kimshee. So the judge would look at him (in the wheelchair) :) and look at me, and then look back, and say "I could see where you had reasonable fear of being harmed." :lol:

P.S. I'm not that big.

Yeah, I was the head bouncer here in the college town where I go to school.One night some crackhead wannabe gang banger mutha fvcker(you know the type)stole my watch out of the employee closet.To make a long story short this stupid fvck trys to sell the watch at the same bar he stole it from(my bar). So one evening he came in and I snatched his scrany ass up And opened the back steal security door with his face and proceed to stomp the fvck out of him , the whole time i kept asking him if a 100 $ fossil watch was worth a trip to the ER. I know this could have been handled in a non-violent manner, but i feel i didi the world a service by teaching this valuable lesson to this punk. I wasn't even on cycle..........so no one tell me I have rage issues.The same legal bs went down at my bar, but it s cool im about to start boucning at a strip bar.............test and tits!

Sensei Jim, thanks for elaborating, I just piped up becasue so many misconceptions about stuff like this are told all the time. Hell, I still meet fools at work who insist that a knife is illegal if it has a blade greater that six inches in length...lol. Bet you've all heard that one before.

First Off That Guy Couldv'e Pressed Charges Against And Had You Arrested. Being A
"Bouncer" Doesn't Give You Law Enforcement Rights. Even If Someone Comes Up And Complains About Someone You Don't Have The Authority To Physically Touch A Person
You're "LUCKY" You Only Got Fired Because If He Knew The Law He Could Have Had You Arrested.You've Been Watching "ROAD HOUSE" A Little Bit Too Much, Buddy !

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Originally Posted by spooty11

First Off That Guy Couldv'e Pressed Charges Against And Had You Arrested. Being A
"Bouncer" Doesn't Give You Law Enforcement Rights. Even If Someone Comes Up And Complains About Someone You Don't Have The Authority To Physically Touch A Person
You're "LUCKY" You Only Got Fired Because If He Knew The Law He Could Have Had You Arrested.You've Been Watching "ROAD HOUSE" A Little Bit Too Much, Buddy !

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Great first post Spoogy11!!