pistol question guys

[Duck of Death]

Go to this link to learn more about the internal workings of the Glock system and especially about the model 36, which is a hell of a defensive firearm!!

http://www.galleryofguns.com/shootin...les.asp?ID=114

[hung-solo]

Go to this link to learn more about the internal workings of the Glock system and especially about the model 36, which is a hell of a defensive firearm!!

http://www.galleryofguns.com/shootin...les.asp?ID=114

i was thinking of the glock 23 .40 cal or the same version of the 9, i dont need a 45 i want something pretty accurate that can hold up in nasty situations , exp rain snow and mud...

[Duck of Death]

The Glock 19 has the identical frame dimensions as the .40 cal 23 and is in 9mm. It is VERY popular for good reason.

[hung-solo]

[QUOTE=Duck of Death]The Glock 19 has the identical frame dimensions as the .40 cal 23 and is in 9mm. It is VERY popular for good reason.[/QUO

so in your opinion go with the glock 19 rather than the glock 23??

[Gearhead007]

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Phillyboy1]

IS it true that HK is not making the two tone any more? I heard this second hand so I'm not for sure.

yes it it true, thtas why i picked up mine

[Duck of Death]

[QUOTE=hung-solo]

The Glock 19 has the identical frame dimensions as the .40 cal 23 and is in 9mm. It is VERY popular for good reason.[/QUO

so in your opinion go with the glock 19 rather than the glock 23??

...shoot them both and I bet you choose the 19. The recoil from a .40 is more unpleasant in my opinion than a .45. The .45 feels like someone pushed your arm - the .40 feels like someone smacked it. The trick is to choose the heaviest caliber that you can CONSISTENTLY HIT RAPIDLY WITH. One hit with a .22 is better than six misses with a .44 magnum! Our courses were filled with guys who brought their .44 mags and .50 desert eagles. They found, with few exceptions, that they could not hit with the speed and predictability of us "wimps" with our 9mms and .45s. No flames intended - this is just what I observed. Oh, also the desert eagles broke all over the place. Cool looking guns, but ****ty reliability.

[Animal Cracker]

I have used the USP at work...I prefer my Sig.

[cjp85]

As far as accuracy goes, most modern pistols are far more accurate than its shooter. Th 40 may be more accurate at farther distances because the 45 is a little bit slower of a round and it drops faster. I just got a Glock 19 and I have a Glock 21. The 45s out of box accuracy is amazing, but I think it has more to do with the fatter grip and my big hands. But still the G19 is far more accurate than I am.
As far as Glocks safety, whats the point of having a manual safety? The only real manual safety is your brain and your finger, if you dont want it to go off, keep your finger away from the trigger. Glocks have what are called passive safeties and disengage when you take up trigger slack automaticly. You could throw a loaded Glock around all over the place and it will NOT go off unless the trigger is pulled.
My advice is call around to some local ranges and see if they rent and try out what your interested in. a Good website to check out is www.glocktalk.com , it has forums for all types of firearms, not just Glocks.
Either way you go, a Glock, HK or Sig, you cant really lose. Just make sure you get lots of range time. Then visit www.natchezss.com or www.ammoman.com and get some bulk ammo to test your gun out. Good luck bro and be safe.

[cjp85]

Also, Im not sure if your into shooting or anything, but most guns that are chambered in .40 cal can be converted to 357 Sig not Mag with just a barrel swap. Some guns use the same magazine too, but its also a good round with ballistics similar to a 357 mag revolver but in a Semi-auto.

[1badcamaro]

Go to this link to learn more about the internal workings of the Glock system and especially about the model 36, which is a hell of a defensive firearm!!

http://www.galleryofguns.com/shootin...les.asp?ID=114

the thing about the G36 i dont like is that it only has a 6 round magazine.

[ironfist]

Most guys are probably gonna tell ya to get the glock...I have the H+K tactical .45 and I love it...Wouldn't trade it for any other pistol...

[Phillyboy1]

Most guys are probably gonna tell ya to get the glock...I have the H+K tactical .45 and I love it...Wouldn't trade it for any other pistol...

i completely agree, sorry i dont like glocks and there fake ass safetly. thts not a safetly. just dont like that idea. and yes there have been tons of accidental shootings with police officers drawing their glocks and shooting themselfs in the legs. ill find the statistics for ya today, its not a bunch of BS. glocks do go off accidentially and it happens alot with officers

[hung-solo]

thanx guys.. you guys have answered a lot of my questions...... one last question, the sigs, arent they heavy framed like the 1911's?

[Duck of Death]

i completely agree, sorry i dont like glocks and there fake ass safetly. thts not a safetly. just dont like that idea. and yes there have been tons of accidental shootings with police officers drawing their glocks and shooting themselfs in the legs. ill find the statistics for ya today, its not a bunch of BS. glocks do go off accidentially and it happens alot with officers

...I would be VERY interested in statistics which show that a finger was NOT in the trigger guard when the Glock went off. LEOs are notorious for shooting themselves due to a lack of proper drawing technique (Its true, their training sometimes is less than optimal. A LOT of LEOs that took John Farnams courses could not hit the broad side of a barn and had to be corrected REPEATEDLY for keeping their finger in the trigger guard when drawing, reloading, and clearing stoppages). One incident sticks out in my mind - a Michigan police officer who conducted himself at the start of the course as if he "knew it all". He was one who incessantly kept his finger on that **** trigger and even said to one of the range instructors, "Why do we keep drilling about keeping our trigger finger in register? Its just a waste of time.".
Well, at one point during a rapid-target engagement drill, He had to reload rapidly after a string of fire. He pulled an extra mag, slapped it home, and racked his slide. BOOM!! The unexpected discharge kicked up dirt in front of him and he stood there, befuddled. Obviously, his finger was ON the trigger and DEPRESSED when he racked his slide. Mr. Farnam walked up to him and said, "That's why."

ALL modern auto-loaders are designed NOT to discharge unless a finger depresses the trigger. I will give anyone here $100.00 if they can get a Glock to go off by throwing it in the air, shaking it, or otherwise messing with it without depressing the trigger (putting it in a microwave is not allowed).
Think about it - if you were an LEO and you pulled a stupid stunt like shooting yourself in the leg cause you had your finger where it shouldnt be, would you fess up knowing you were going to get the razz from your buds forever?? Its easier to tell your Captain, "Duh, it wuzznt me!! Dat mean old Glock just went off all by itself!! It must be possessed!!"

[Phillyboy1]

...I would be VERY interested in statistics which show that a finger was NOT in the trigger guard when the Glock went off. LEOs are notorious for shooting themselves due to a lack of proper drawing technique (Its true, their training sometimes is less than optimal. A LOT of LEOs that took John Farnams courses could not hit the broad side of a barn and had to be corrected REPEATEDLY for keeping their finger in the trigger guard when drawing, reloading, and clearing stoppages). One incident sticks out in my mind - a Michigan police officer who conducted himself at the start of the course as if he "knew it all". He was one who incessantly kept his finger on that **** trigger and even said to one of the range instructors, "Why do we keep drilling about keeping our trigger finger in register? Its just a waste of time.".
Well, at one point during a rapid-target engagement drill, He had to reload rapidly after a string of fire. He pulled an extra mag, slapped it home, and racked his slide. BOOM!! The unexpected discharge kicked up dirt in front of him and he stood there, befuddled. Obviously, his finger was ON the trigger and DEPRESSED when he racked his slide. Mr. Farnam walked up to him and said, "That's why."

ALL modern auto-loaders are designed NOT to discharge unless a finger depresses the trigger. I will give anyone here $100.00 if they can get a Glock to go off by throwing it in the air, shaking it, or otherwise messing with it without depressing the trigger (putting it in a microwave is not allowed).
Think about it - if you were an LEO and you pulled a stupid stunt like shooting yourself in the leg cause you had your finger where it shouldnt be, would you fess up knowing you were going to get the razz from your buds forever?? Its easier to tell your Captain, "Duh, it wuzznt me!! Dat mean old Glock just went off all by itself!! It must be possessed!!"

try just doing a goggle search for "Glock accidental discharge"


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv...lice4page1.htm

this ones nice, who ever said i was just worried about me shooting myself? sorry but if a kid grabs my gun while its in the house, id much rather trust my real safety then this BS trigger safety
http://www.glockworld.com/gwo_edit.htm

[palme]

...I would be VERY interested in statistics which show that a finger was NOT in the trigger guard when the Glock went off. LEOs are notorious for shooting themselves due to a lack of proper drawing technique (Its true, their training sometimes is less than optimal. A LOT of LEOs that took John Farnams courses could not hit the broad side of a barn and had to be corrected REPEATEDLY for keeping their finger in the trigger guard when drawing, reloading, and clearing stoppages). One incident sticks out in my mind - a Michigan police officer who conducted himself at the start of the course as if he "knew it all". He was one who incessantly kept his finger on that **** trigger and even said to one of the range instructors, "Why do we keep drilling about keeping our trigger finger in register? Its just a waste of time.".
Well, at one point during a rapid-target engagement drill, He had to reload rapidly after a string of fire. He pulled an extra mag, slapped it home, and racked his slide. BOOM!! The unexpected discharge kicked up dirt in front of him and he stood there, befuddled. Obviously, his finger was ON the trigger and DEPRESSED when he racked his slide. Mr. Farnam walked up to him and said, "That's why."

ALL modern auto-loaders are designed NOT to discharge unless a finger depresses the trigger. I will give anyone here $100.00 if they can get a Glock to go off by throwing it in the air, shaking it, or otherwise messing with it without depressing the trigger (putting it in a microwave is not allowed).
Think about it - if you were an LEO and you pulled a stupid stunt like shooting yourself in the leg cause you had your finger where it shouldnt be, would you fess up knowing you were going to get the razz from your buds forever?? Its easier to tell your Captain, "Duh, it wuzznt me!! Dat mean old Glock just went off all by itself!! It must be possessed!!"

[Gearhead007]

ssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

[Jdawg50]

try just doing a goggle search for "Glock accidental discharge"


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv...lice4page1.htm

this ones nice, who ever said i was just worried about me shooting myself? sorry but if a kid grabs my gun while its in the house, id much rather trust my real safety then this BS trigger safety
http://www.glockworld.com/gwo_edit.htm

I totally agree with you bro.
I have 3 pistols that all have saftey's on them, no BS glock saftey's. I know my guns really good. I am one of those statistics. I shot myself with a glock, and I'm no dummy around guns. I have a .45 bullet in my left leg, because of that dumb ass trigger saftey. If I had been trying to get the slide off of one of my guns with the other kind of saftey I would never have had to deal with a fVcked up leg for 2 years. Glocks are sucky ass plastic pieces of crap.

[Phillyboy1]

I totally agree with you bro.
I have 3 pistols that all have saftey's on them, no BS glock saftey's. I know my guns really good. I am one of those statistics. I shot myself with a glock, and I'm no dummy around guns. I have a .45 bullet in my left leg, because of that dumb ass trigger saftey. If I had been trying to get the slide off of one of my guns with the other kind of saftey I would never have had to deal with a fVcked up leg for 2 years. Glocks are sucky ass plastic pieces of crap.

yep they are, a trigger safety is not a safety. its that simple

[Animal Cracker]

Well Glocks arent crap- just a different gun for a different situation..it wasnt designed as same as an HK, Spingfield or the like..they serve their purposes. That being said, I still prefer my Sig!

[Phillyboy1]

Well Glocks arent crap- just a different gun for a different situation..it wasnt designed as same as an HK, Spingfield or the like..they serve their purposes. That being said, I still prefer my Sig!

yep your right, glocks to have a purpose, to shoot the person holding them as they are trying to draw it out of the holster, or to go off when someones kid is playing around and decides to find out what the bump in the middle of the trigger is for. personally, IMO glocks are junk. yes they do look cool or good, but other then that they are junk and a safety hazard

[Jdawg50]

yep your right, glocks to have a purpose, to shoot the person holding them as they are trying to draw it out of the holster, or to go off when someones kid is playing around and decides to find out what the bump in the middle of the trigger is for. personally, IMO glocks are junk. yes they do look cool or good, but other then that they are junk and a safety hazard

Amen
you should see the xray of my left leg. Glocks are crap.

[Duck of Death]

yep your right, glocks to have a purpose, to shoot the person holding them as they are trying to draw it out of the holster, or to go off when someones kid is playing around and decides to find out what the bump in the middle of the trigger is for. personally, IMO glocks are junk. yes they do look cool or good, but other then that they are junk and a safety hazard

Please tell us why the Glock has become the overwhelming choice for Law enforcement departments across the nation. Please tell us why the FBI has recently adopted the 10mm Glock as their choice for advanced agent duties.

From the post you cited:
"D.C. police officials repeatedly studied the phenomenon of accidental discharges, invariably concluding that there was no fundamental problem with the Glock itself – as long as users were properly trained."

Yes, folks, training is the operative word. Train properly (just like in the gym), and your Glock will serve you faithfully and safely. Ignore safety precautions (like trying to get the slide off of a loaded pistol) and you may shoot yourself. I got news for you all - folks shoot themselves all the time with ALL KINDS of handguns. In Pennsylvania a while ago, a guy bought one of those bogus trigger blocks (a piece of plastic that goes into the trigger guard and is designed to be pressed out when the moment of truth is nigh) and installed it in his Mossberg 12 ga. Shotgun. He loaded it up with a FALSE sense of security that that block was "safe". He went to put the weapon in his closet and placed it on the floor rather forcefully, butt end first. The shotgun proceeded to discharge, blowing this gentleman's head into wall paint. Moral: ALL guns are loaded, ALL of the time. Safeties aint SAFE - no matter what you want to believe. Follow the rules below to avoid becoming a statistic:
1) ALL guns are loaded - ALL of the time!
2) NEVER point the muzzle at anything you arent willing to see destroyed.
3) NEVER put your finger on the trigger until you have OBTAINED a sight picture AND decided to fire.

Its that simple - and complex.

[Phillyboy1]

Please tell us why the Glock has become the overwhelming choice for Law enforcement departments across the nation. Please tell us why the FBI has recently adopted the 10mm Glock as their choice for advanced agent duties.

From the post you cited:
"D.C. police officials repeatedly studied the phenomenon of accidental discharges, invariably concluding that there was no fundamental problem with the Glock itself – as long as users were properly trained."

Yes, folks, training is the operative word. Train properly (just like in the gym), and your Glock will serve you faithfully and safely. Ignore safety precautions (like trying to get the slide off of a loaded pistol) and you may shoot yourself. I got news for you all - folks shoot themselves all the time with ALL KINDS of handguns. In Pennsylvania a while ago, a guy bought one of those bogus trigger blocks (a piece of plastic that goes into the trigger guard and is designed to be pressed out when the moment of truth is nigh) and installed it in his Mossberg 12 ga. Shotgun. He loaded it up with a FALSE sense of security that that block was "safe". He went to put the weapon in his closet and placed it on the floor rather forcefully, butt end first. The shotgun proceeded to discharge, blowing this gentleman's head into wall paint. Moral: ALL guns are loaded, ALL of the time. Safeties aint SAFE - no matter what you want to believe. Follow the rules below to avoid becoming a statistic:
1) ALL guns are loaded - ALL of the time!
2) NEVER point the muzzle at anything you arent willing to see destroyed.
3) NEVER put your finger on the trigger until you have OBTAINED a sight picture AND decided to fire.

Its that simple - and complex.

come on bro i know your not that dumb, the glock has become the weapon of choice because they are cheap. our government likes to keep bills low, do you think they wanna shell out the good money for a HK or a Sig? hell no, not big ol US of A. are government likes to cut corners, if you wanna go sprouting out facts, why dont you take a look at what guns the rest of the world uses for its police or military. ill bet ya 100 bucks it aint a glock.

and sorry but it isnt simple. look at the cost of the HK, sig or any other gun. all way more expensive then your plastic cheap toy called a glock. our country gives contracts to the lowest bidder, its kinda scary when you think about it. so of coarse glock gets choosen. its really scary when the get the lowest bidder on planes and tanks though.

your not changing my opinion. glocks are peices of junk. oh yeah and just to let ya know, the real military and people who need the best do not use the glock, they use sigs, HK's and berreta. i personally hate the way a berreta looks so id never own one but id take half of one of them over a full glock

take a look and learn:
http://www.hkdefense.us/

http://www.hkdefense.us/pages/military-le/fedops.html

http://www.hkdefense.us/corporate/history.html

but yeah your right, the government must love the glock lol, your talking about law enforcement, they search for anything cheap. when the military gets involved they look for something good, and they sure as hell dont look at glocks

[cjp85]

Id give a thousand dollars to someone who could get a Glock to go off without pulling the trigger or microwave or something. The safety on the trigger of Glocks is a safety, it keeps the trigger from going back if dropped, and it cant be depressed from the side. But when it all comes down to it, a kid with a loaded gun versus a kid with a loaded gun with a safety doesnt make it safe. YOUR FINGER AND BRAIN ARE THE ONLY SAFETIES!!! Glocks werent made to have a manual safety, theyre combat pistols, pull the trigger and it does what it does, dont pull the trigger and it doesnt. And the reason law enforcement uses Glocks is because they are **** reliable and do not cost and arm and a leg. They are by no means a cheap pistol. Plus there isnt a simpler autoloader design. If law enforcement wanted to save money they would probably go to Springfields XD line, but at the sacrifice of having to trust a whole different gun.

[cjp85]

The only reason military doesnt use Glocks is because it doesnt have double-strike capability and Glock never submitted their pistol to the trials in the 80's. Also Gaston Glock the owner refused to give up pattent rights upon a military contract. Also, all Glocks are assembled in the US with imported machined parts. The reason HK is so expensive is because of labor costs in Germany and value of the dollar to German currency. Equally great firearms though.

[hung-solo]

well i know glocks arent crap, but the safety imo does suck.. glocks for the price is a steal! i have actually seen here in my town police dept there own tests ,mud water, salt and etc and the glock is mostly accurate and reliable everytime. hell i saw one frozen! shot like a champ.. but in that class i also saw that if pulled the wrong way from the holster you do have a risk of shooting yourself or the ground next to ya... so with that being said i narrowed it down to the sig 229 .40 or the hk compact... i can get the sig for 500$ with only 5% wear... with a one year warranty.. seems like a deal to me

[Phillyboy1]

well i know glocks arent crap, but the safety imo does suck.. glocks for the price is a steal! i have actually seen here in my town police dept there own tests ,mud water, salt and etc and the glock is mostly accurate and reliable everytime. hell i saw one frozen! shot like a champ.. but in that class i also saw that if pulled the wrong way from the holster you do have a risk of shooting yourself or the ground next to ya... so with that being said i narrowed it down to the sig 229 .40 or the hk compact... i can get the sig for 500$ with only 5% wear... with a one year warranty.. seems like a deal to me

thats a awesome deal, get the sig asap. id jump on that one too

[cjp85]

well i know glocks arent crap, but the safety imo does suck.. glocks for the price is a steal! i have actually seen here in my town police dept there own tests ,mud water, salt and etc and the glock is mostly accurate and reliable everytime. hell i saw one frozen! shot like a champ.. but in that class i also saw that if pulled the wrong way from the holster you do have a risk of shooting yourself or the ground next to ya... so with that being said i narrowed it down to the sig 229 .40 or the hk compact... i can get the sig for 500$ with only 5% wear... with a one year warranty.. seems like a deal to me

That one year warranty is just what they tell people. I know people with some of the first Sigs imported into the US and Sig still covers anything that goes wrong with them. Theyre a good company and that 229 is said by many to be their most accurate pistol. Good luck, and check out sigforum.com

[Duck of Death]

thats a awesome deal, get the sig asap. id jump on that one too

..Not to burst your bubble once again, but allow me to inform you that the Sig Sauer Pistol, like the Glock, has NO external safety. It's odd that you recommend a pistol so highly that does not have what you seem to regard as an absolute must for a pistol purchase. The "safety" lever on a Sig is merely a hammer decocking lever designed to safely lower the hammer after chambering a round. It neither disconnects the trigger nor blocks the firing pin. Therefore, like a Glock (or any pistol as far as I am concerned), the weapon must always be considered loaded and dangerous.
You also seem to contradict yourself as to why the government and law enforcement choose various pistols. You say that price is the overwhelming consideration, yet some departments choose Sig over Glock. The US government chose the Beretta 92F (a VERY expensive pistol), over all comers.
Oh, and one more thing - cops have been shooting themselves for years, even with their old .38 special revolvers (with NO external safety, I might add).

[Jdawg50]

..Not to burst your bubble once again, but allow me to inform you that the Sig Sauer Pistol, like the Glock, has NO external safety. It's odd that you recommend a pistol so highly that does not have what you seem to regard as an absolute must for a pistol purchase. The "safety" lever on a Sig is merely a hammer decocking lever designed to safely lower the hammer after chambering a round. It neither disconnects the trigger nor blocks the firing pin. Therefore, like a Glock (or any pistol as far as I am concerned), the weapon must always be considered loaded and dangerous.
You also seem to contradict yourself as to why the government and law enforcement choose various pistols. You say that price is the overwhelming consideration, yet some departments choose Sig over Glock. The US government chose the Beretta 92F (a VERY expensive pistol), over all comers.
Oh, and one more thing - cops have been shooting themselves for years, even with their old .38 special revolvers (with NO external safety, I might add).

It still has and external hammer, which is as good as a safety in my eyes. At least you know if the hammer's back... unlike a glock.

[Phillyboy1]

..Not to burst your bubble once again, but allow me to inform you that the Sig Sauer Pistol, like the Glock, has NO external safety. It's odd that you recommend a pistol so highly that does not have what you seem to regard as an absolute must for a pistol purchase. The "safety" lever on a Sig is merely a hammer decocking lever designed to safely lower the hammer after chambering a round. It neither disconnects the trigger nor blocks the firing pin. Therefore, like a Glock (or any pistol as far as I am concerned), the weapon must always be considered loaded and dangerous.
You also seem to contradict yourself as to why the government and law enforcement choose various pistols. You say that price is the overwhelming consideration, yet some departments choose Sig over Glock. The US government chose the Beretta 92F (a VERY expensive pistol), over all comers.
Oh, and one more thing - cops have been shooting themselves for years, even with their old .38 special revolvers (with NO external safety, I might add).

well the sigs ive seen have safeties. maybe that model he's talking a doesnt have one, actually i dont know i havent even looked it up.

your the one stating that the glock was the most used by the police departments, not me. maybe some departments dont worry about money and there for get the sig or beretta and not the glock. your not gonna change my opinion, i dont like glocks, i dont like any gun with out a external safety. ALL OF GLOCKS DONT HAVE SAFETYS. IF A GUN MANUFACTURE MAKES ONE MODEL WITH OUT ONE, THEN I DONT LIKE THAT MODEL, IF ALL THE GUNS THEY MAKE DONT HAVE ONE I DONT LIKE THE MANUFACTURE. i could honestly give a crap what make it is. there are two things i look for first on a gun after i choose a name, and its a decocker and a real safety

[Phillyboy1]

It still has and external hammer, which is as good as a safety in my eyes. At least you know if the hammer's back... unlike a glock.

thank you

[Duck of Death]

.. OK, guys. it's obvious that we just dont see eye to eye on what makes a pistol desirable or not for personal defense. I just hope that none of you ever rely on a pistol with a true "safety" to be sterilized merely because that little lever is "on". I also hope that Hung-Solo seeks out the counsel and advice of those who have a good amount of experience with ALL weapons systems instead of just one or a few and truly understand their workings and function.
H&K, Sig, Glock, Beretta, Kimber, etc. - all fine pistols and all have their adherents. I will restate that Hung-Solo needs to shoot them all to find his "soul-mate". Second step is to purchase a REAL holster, manufactured for the pistol, which covers the trigger guard. Many wannabe ganstas have blown their berries off carrying a pistol in their front waistband ("Mexican" carry). Third step is to get some realistic, quality training so as not to delude you about your capabilities. Good Luck!

[The Baron]

.50 Action Express, its bad ASS.

IMI is the shiznat when it comes to handguns. Nothing touches the stopping power of that for a repeating handgun! I have a small conversion kit for that gun, with another pistol as well. It includes the .50 you see, plus a .44 magnum version of the same gun, but with new upper recievers to make the tube 4" longer, and another upper to make them both carbine rifles!

The whole kit was about $4,500.

I'm getting horny just thinking about that!

That .50 bore is pretty intimidating! It's like looking up satan's @sshole! You know it is time to cool your jets when you are looking up that pipe!

For practical carry, though, I like a compact .45, preferably single action colt clone style. Hard to beat the Colt Defender for the money. It is basically an officer's model, rounded an bobbed out for carry. My personal favorite is the paraordnance P-10, which is even smaller and carries a 10 rd mag and one up the snoot. I hate glocks. I have no use for any dbl action semi. I find the colt acp style gun much more familiar and intuitive and safer. No double action pull crap either. Plus there are LOTS of after market parts for repair or customization. The 45 is a great street defense round.

[cjp85]

It still has and external hammer, which is as good as a safety in my eyes. At least you know if the hammer's back... unlike a glock.

Untrue, the trigger on a glock can only be in the foreward position when the weapon is cocked, if the trigger is back all the way and you can tell by looking at it, the weapon isnt cocked.

[hung-solo]

thanx for the insight guys! very helpful..

[cjp85]

thanx for the insight guys! very helpful..

So what are you gettin? I have a couple Glocks and my friend has a USP and some Sigs. After that pic jcstomper put up I really want a USP in stainless. JC, how does your 9MM shoot?

[Phillyboy1]

So what are you gettin? I have a couple Glocks and my friend has a USP and some Sigs. After that pic jcstomper put up I really want a USP in stainless. JC, how does your 9MM shoot?

it shoots great, it has some kick that isnt normal for a 9mm because of the light weight, but other then that is it seemless, and is accurate as hell IMO