synthetic car oils

**9000rpm** · 02-03-2005, 02:28 PM

Originally Posted by Juggernaut

I've a 68 vette.......350, roller rocker, two holly DP'ers (850's) tunnel ram intake....had to put a franklin 10" rear end on her....kept twisting the u-bolts. I'm thinking of getting a roots blower for her....just for giggles.

****, that would be a beast. I'd like to get a '69 to early 70's Camaro and install a blown engine. Maybe one day.

**hung-solo** · 02-03-2005, 02:30 PM

note to thieves, leave the cd player please! take everything else

**Hed** · 02-03-2005, 02:35 PM

9000rpm, you gotta remember too that the LS1 engine in the SS wasnt designed to be at the peak of its performance coming out of the factory like the S2K motor was. YOu yourself said they were some of the best flowing heads ever made.

The LS1, and any v8 for that matter, is way detuned for insurance, emissions, etc. If GM wanted, and they have actually, they could throw a few camaros out of the factory that have 700+ hp n/a. Its been done, but in limited numbers, and they sell for a ****load of money.

**needmorestrength** · 02-03-2005, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by Hed

9000rpm, you gotta remember too that the LS1 engine in the SS wasnt designed to be at the peak of its performance coming out of the factory like the S2K motor was. YOu yourself said they were some of the best flowing heads ever made.

The LS1, and any v8 for that matter, is way detuned for insurance, emissions, etc. If GM wanted, and they have actually, they could throw a few camaros out of the factory that have 700+ hp n/a. Its been done, but in limited numbers, and they sell for a ****load of money.

Exactly.. for around 1500-2000 dollars I can up my camaro more then 100 hp.. and lets not forget handling...unless you've driven a camaro, you going to be very suprised in how they handle

**Juggernaut** · 02-03-2005, 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by 9000rpm

****, that would be a beast. I'd like to get a '69 to early 70's Camaro and install a blown engine. Maybe one day.

I've a close friend that has a 69 maro.......that freakin car is B.A.D. assed. The engine in that thing is tight......has a high pitched metalic sound to it....when you can hear it over the thundering pipes. Out of the hole you can't reach the dashboard from the g's. hahahahaha

Mine is not that tight but she holds her own.....he beat me by three cars last time we raced....****er.

**9000rpm** · 02-03-2005, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by Hed

9000rpm, you gotta remember too that the LS1 engine in the SS wasnt designed to be at the peak of its performance coming out of the factory like the S2K motor was. YOu yourself said they were some of the best flowing heads ever made.

The LS1, and any v8 for that matter, is way detuned for insurance, emissions, etc. If GM wanted, and they have actually, they could throw a few camaros out of the factory that have 700+ hp n/a. Its been done, but in limited numbers, and they sell for a ****load of money.

Oh I totally agree. But bone stock, they are very far from anything impressive at all. The torque is great, but that's it.

The F20C is almost at it's peak from the factory. That highest NA S2000 I've heard of is around 250hp at the wheels. Now the supercharged S2000's put down 300 to 310hp to the wheels with no other mods but the blower. I know of about 4 or 5 supercharged S2000's with around 400 to 425hp after more head work and other mods such as a piggy back ecu, exhaust, etc.

**9000rpm** · 02-03-2005, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by needmorestrength

Exactly.. for around 1500-2000 dollars I can up my camaro more then 100 hp.. and lets not forget handling...unless you've driven a camaro, you going to be very suprised in how they handle

The same can be said for the S2000. The vortech kit can be had for about $2500 if you look in the right places.

And I have driven Cameros before. It's not far from driving a truck around corners. They have tons of body roll.

**needmorestrength** · 02-03-2005, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by 9000rpm

The same can be said for the S2000. The vortech kit can be had for about $2500 if you look in the right places.

And I have driven Cameros before. It's not far from driving a truck around corners. They have tons of body roll.

are you serious? to each their own I suppose but with the F frame they handling it great for a v8! If I am to spend the money on a super or turbo charger its going to be after everything else is done, why have forced induction when there is no need?

**9000rpm** · 02-03-2005, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by needmorestrength

are you serious? to each their own I suppose but with the F frame they handling it great for a v8! If I am to spend the money on a super or turbo charger its going to be after everything else is done, why have forced induction when there is no need?

Have you ever driven an S2000 on a course? It is like driving a gocart. You point it and it goes there.

**Sta11ion** · 02-03-2005, 03:53 PM

I dont what to get into a arguement with you but the s2000 is $33000 with 162 Pounds of torque, the mustang gt is $24500 with 320 pounds of torque. Also at what RPM do you have to rev your motor to get that 205 hp in your car almost 6000rpm. Meanwhile the mustang reaches its power at 3400 rpm. On top of that you have a additional $9000 dollars to play with the car. You can get a supercharger, suspension, brakes, skirts etc with that much upgrade. I know you like your car and when someone affends its you jump up to defend it but everyone likes differnet things. Just remeber this, horsepower is what sells the car but torque is what wins the race.

**needmorestrength** · 02-03-2005, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by 9000rpm

Have you ever driven an S2000 on a course? It is like driving a gocart. You point it and it goes there.

Well I should hope so its the size of one

lol jj.. I have driven the 350z my bro had and yea I agree there something about those cars..then he got the Z06 on his lot.. no comparisson that thing blew the 350 outta the water.. to each their own..we could be here all day

**needmorestrength** · 02-03-2005, 03:56 PM

Originally Posted by Sta11ion

I dont what to get into a arguement with you but the s2000 is $33000 with 162 Pounds of torque, the mustang gt is $24500 with 320 pounds of torque. Also at what RPM do you have to rev your motor to get that 205 hp in your car almost 6000rpm. Meanwhile the mustang reaches its power at 3400 rpm. On top of that you have a additional $9000 dollars to play with the car. You can get a supercharger, suspension, brakes, skirts etc with that much upgrade. I know you like your car and when someone affends its you jump up to defend it but everyone likes differnet things. Just remeber this, horsepower is what sells the car but torque is what wins the race.

yup

**9000rpm** · 02-03-2005, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by Sta11ion

I dont what to get into a arguement with you but the s2000 is $33000 with 162 Pounds of torque, the mustang gt is $24500 with 320 pounds of torque. Also at what RPM do you have to rev your motor to get that 205 hp in your car almost 6000rpm. Meanwhile the mustang reaches its power at 3400 rpm. On top of that you have a additional $9000 dollars to play with the car. You can get a supercharger, suspension, brakes, skirts etc with that much upgrade. I know you like your car and when someone affends its you jump up to defend it but everyone likes differnet things. Just remeber this, horsepower is what sells the car but torque is what wins the race.

I agree with you that everyone likes different things. And yes, if you are a car nut as I am, if someone talks smack about your car, you defend it as if it were your children.

The S2000 is pricy, but your are buying a track ready race car out of the box. The Mustang GT is ready to drive fast in a straight line out of the box. The mustang can be modified to handle very well, but it will never be on par with the S2000 in handling unless you completely rebuild the chasis. By then it is pretty much a custom built car and not a Mustang anymore.

Now the new mustang I think will handle very well. It's chasis is based upon the same as the Lincoln LS. And the LS is a great handling car for its size. It even handles better than the BMW 5 series cars.

**9000rpm** · 02-03-2005, 06:43 PM

Originally Posted by needmorestrength

Well I should hope so its the size of one

lol jj.. I have driven the 350z my bro had and yea I agree there something about those cars..then he got the Z06 on his lot.. no comparisson that thing blew the 350 outta the water.. to each their own..we could be here all day

I'll never compare my car to the C5 and C6 vette. It's not even in the same ballpark. But with a $6000, 10psi turbo system it is.

**Hed** · 02-03-2005, 10:10 PM

My 4th gen fbody handles absolutely amazing. The S2000 does handle slightly better, but my car does handle like an absolute champion. After seeing all the **** suspension under the car, i know why......

**DanDoola** · 02-04-2005, 01:05 AM

Originally Posted by 9000rpm

You sound like the typical SS owner.

I'm sorry to break this to you, but 325hp from a V8 isn't that great. BMW gets 330 from their straight six in the M3. Face it, your car is a redneck rocket. Sure, I know you will beat me in a drag race, but not by much. Maybe 1 to 1.5 car lengths. That's just a few tenths of a second. So why should I be impressed? The S2000 can run the 1/4 mile in 13.8 seconds. What does the SS do it in, 13 flat? Maybe a 12.8 or 9? Weak,......especially for a V8. The sad thing is, my car is a 2.0liter four cylinder, yours is a 5.7liter V8, and you can only beat my car by that little of a margin.

Now, take the battle to any road course, whether it be a wide open one with large straights, or a tight and technical one. I will make you look like you are driving a dump truck around it. And please don't try to dispute this, you will just look dumb.

It's pretty well known that the LS1 is WAY underrated. As I stated earlier, with a catback and lid, I put down 325 TO THE WHEELS. But f horsepower. It's the track times that count. 12.995 with 2.0 60' (I need to work on my launching techniques). Assuming you run a 13.8, that is whole lot more than 1 to 1.5 car lengths, more like 7-8. That is far from a small margin. That is HUGE! For the extra $6,000 or so you spent on your car (which I normally don't like to say during one of these arguments), I could get the highest flowing heads around, a real agressive cam to compliment it, tuned and installed and put down 500-550 hp. Your car, without a power adder, is already nearly maxed out.

Curb weight is 3433 by the way. No need to google, here ya go: http://www.intellichoice.com/reports...pecs/type/used

2002 Camaro SS slalom speed: 63.9 mph
2003 S2000: 65.0 mph

Now you tell me, what's more impressive? A fat american running 63.9 or a high powered piece of rice running a 65.0. That s2000 slalom speed is nowhere near impressive. But I guess I look real dumb trying to prove this right?

Saying that a Camaro SS will whip you in a straight line, but you'll keep up with a z28 or Firebird (you'll do fine against a GT), just goes to show how little you know. The SS and WS6's are nothing more than appearance packages. The hood scoops are hardly functional on an SS, a little more so on the WS6. The motors in the z28/Firebird are IDENTICAL to those found in the SS/WS6 variants.

But as stated earlier, to each his own. I would personally never buy a foreign car and you would probably never buy a "modern" American muscle car. In the end, it all boils down to the simple fact that we love our cars, and there is never anything better out there. I give you props for knowing so much about your own car, and it is nice. My blood just boils when I here statements like "American cars suck", etc, etc. Didn't mean to offend anybody with the rice comments BTW.

Have you ever seen that red S2000 that's been in a lot of the import tuner mags as of late? The name of the guy that owns it is Bashar? He comes to my pizzaria all the time. Great guy that has a beautiful car. Before he went SC I coulda prolly spanked him, but he's got a lot done now and I give him mucho props for the outstanding job he did with that car. I'll try to find a link to it in case you're interested.

Here ya go: http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/521634/4

**needmorestrength** · 02-04-2005, 07:26 AM

Originally Posted by DanDoola

It's pretty well known that the LS1 is WAY underrated. As I stated earlier, with a catback and lid, I put down 325 TO THE WHEELS. But f horsepower. It's the track times that count. 12.995 with 2.0 60' (I need to work on my launching techniques). Assuming you run a 13.8, that is whole lot more than 1 to 1.5 car lengths, more like 7-8. That is far from a small margin. That is HUGE! For the extra $6,000 or so you spent on your car (which I normally don't like to say during one of these arguments), I could get the highest flowing heads around, a real agressive cam to compliment it, tuned and installed and put down 500-550 hp. Your car, without a power adder, is already nearly maxed out.

Curb weight is 3433 by the way. No need to google, here ya go: http://www.intellichoice.com/reports...pecs/type/used

2002 Camaro SS slalom speed: 63.9 mph
2003 S2000: 65.0 mph

Now you tell me, what's more impressive? A fat american running 63.9 or a high powered piece of rice running a 65.0. That s2000 slalom speed is nowhere near impressive. But I guess I look real dumb trying to prove this right?

Saying that a Camaro SS will whip you in a straight line, but you'll keep up with a z28 or Firebird (you'll do fine against a GT), just goes to show how little you know. The SS and WS6's are nothing more than appearance packages. The hood scoops are hardly functional on an SS, a little more so on the WS6. The motors in the z28/Firebird are IDENTICAL to those found in the SS/WS6 variants.

But as stated earlier, to each his own. I would personally never buy a foreign car and you would probably never buy a "modern" American muscle car. In the end, it all boils down to the simple fact that we love our cars, and there is never anything better out there. I give you props for knowing so much about your own car, and it is nice. My blood just boils when I here statements like "American cars suck", etc, etc. Didn't mean to offend anybody with the rice comments BTW.

Have you ever seen that red S2000 that's been in a lot of the import tuner mags as of late? The name of the guy that owns it is Bashar? He comes to my pizzaria all the time. Great guy that has a beautiful car. Before he went SC I coulda prolly spanked him, but he's got a lot done now and I give him mucho props for the outstanding job he did with that car. I'll try to find a link to it in case you're interested.

Here ya go: http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/521634/4

My boy sticking up for the V8's

the only down side is the extra gas we use

**DanDoola** · 02-04-2005, 12:14 PM

I can't help but to stick up for American V8's (err, make that Mexican and Canadian V8's

), it's in my blood. My dad retired from GM after 30 years. IMO, there's no replacement for displacement.

Believe it or not, my Camaro gets better gas mileage than my '04 Impala. I average 25 highway, 19 city. That's not too bad.

Hey hung-solo, have you decided on what you're going to do? There seem to be a lot of car guys on this board, but you might want to check out some automotive forums for a better response. Good luck.

**9000rpm** · 02-05-2005, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by DanDoola

But as stated earlier, to each his own. I would personally never buy a foreign car and you would probably never buy a "modern" American muscle car. In the end, it all boils down to the simple fact that we love our cars, and there is never anything better out there. I give you props for knowing so much about your own car, and it is nice. My blood just boils when I here statements like "American cars suck", etc, etc. Didn't mean to offend anybody with the rice comments BTW.

Have you ever seen that red S2000 that's been in a lot of the import tuner mags as of late? The name of the guy that owns it is Bashar? He comes to my pizzaria all the time. Great guy that has a beautiful car. Before he went SC I coulda prolly spanked him, but he's got a lot done now and I give him mucho props for the outstanding job he did with that car. I'll try to find a link to it in case you're interested.

Here ya go: http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/521634/4

I didn't know that the SS & WS6 were just appearance packages. I have raced stock Z28's and have been pretty much even with them. They have beat me a majority of the time, but it has never been by more than 1.5 car lengths. Now Mustang GT's aren't a problem at all. They can be beaten by a stock S2000.

I do admit that American V8's can be made extremely powerfull with little more tham $5000. But the price of the car doesn't come into comparison. I paid $21,000 for my S2000 in 2003 and it had 26,000 miles on it. I got a great deal.

But this arguement really has no end. I think guys might fight over their cars before they would fight over their girls. Maybe not all guys, but maybe guys like us.

I also didn't mean to offend anyone about the american V8's suck either. I think I was just kinda in a bad mood that day. As for the ricers, I agree. I hate people that get civics and try to make them fast and put so many led lights on them that they look like a god**** rolling christmas tree.

It makes those of us that don't do all that disstastefull crap to our cars look bad too. Now I have seen a few civic hatch backs that have over 500hp.

But they are far and few between.

Anyway, if I had a garage full of cars like Leno, I'd probably have a blown SS or a Cobra in there.

**9000rpm** · 02-05-2005, 01:44 PM

BTW, that new Z06 that will be out soon is going to be crazy! 500hp and 500ftlb torque NA!!!!!!!! That thing will be beating up on Vipers.

I will own one some day.

**9000rpm** · 02-05-2005, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by gsxxr

i have one in my shop right now. we are making a blower kit for it along with a water injection system for intercooling

Are you talking about the new C6 Z06 that isn't even out yet? Or the C5 Z06?

**DanDoola** · 02-05-2005, 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by gsxxr

yes i know we get cars from Gm 6 month to a 1.5 years befor so we can start R&D.

That must be torture trying to keep all that new car info on the hush, hush. Although if I had a job like that, I wouldn't spill my guts in a Vietnamese torture camp.

**Hed** · 02-05-2005, 08:34 PM

gsxxr, im callin BS on this one. if you can give me a pic of this new C6 ZO6 with a sign that says like "ar" in the picture or something like that, ill believe you........and then probably find where you live, and pray in your direction every night, like mecca.

that handbuilt 427 is something that is in my dreams at night. i cant even wait to hear one with exhaust........

but i want a pic, just one, or some kind of proof.

***G-1000*** · 02-05-2005, 09:03 PM

Bro I wish I could do that. The only time we can do pics are after the car is released to the public. Trust me when the car is done and you see a 750hp monster you will sh-it. Let’s put it this way we are the ones that helped Callaway build his twin turbo and also the ones that supercharged his c12 along with Rick Moroso personnel vette.

start to do you searching

***G-1000*** · 02-05-2005, 09:11 PM

This is a dyno sheet of an ls1 with a stock motor that I built. And rember this is rear wheel hp with pumped gas...

***G-1000*** · 02-05-2005, 09:13 PM

Originally Posted by Hed

gsxxr, im callin BS on this one. if you can give me a pic of this new C6 ZO6 with a sign that says like "ar" in the picture or something like that, ill believe you........and then probably find where you live, and pray in your direction every night, like mecca.

that handbuilt 427 is something that is in my dreams at night. i cant even wait to hear one with exhaust........

but i want a pic, just one, or some kind of proof.

there is no need for me to Bull Sh-it

**needmorestrength** · 02-05-2005, 11:18 PM

Originally Posted by gsxxr

This is a dyno sheet of an ls1 with a stock motor that I built. And rember this is rear wheel hp with pumped gas...

What exactly did you do to the engine? lol give me some ideas

***G-1000*** · 02-06-2005, 08:13 AM

We are specializing in supercharging and turbo charging systems. We also manufacture supplemental fuel and water injection systems. Along with that we build high performance engines and custom suspensions. We do majority domestic cars and trucks but have done quit a bit of imports. My personnel hobby is sport bikes.

**Hed** · 02-06-2005, 12:45 PM

huge HP jump....

gsxxr, ever hear of the guy who has the 9 second daily driven turbo LS1 trans am?

***G-1000*** · 02-06-2005, 01:06 PM

the only ta i know if that runs in the 9s is some guy with a twin turbo making like 1000hp
but it does not run on pumped gas.

**9000rpm** · 02-06-2005, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by gsxxr

This is a dyno sheet of an ls1 with a stock motor that I built. And rember this is rear wheel hp with pumped gas...

That's not a stock LS1.

That motor definetely has some work done to it.

I won't all out call BS on you about the new Z06, but I do have my doubts. I'm sure you can understand.

But let me ask you this. Why the hell does GM continue to insist on using leaf springs in the rear of the vette? That just seems old and ghetto to me. Now they are at least some sort of composite, but come on. This is 2005, why would they not go with coils all the way around like other high performance cars?

But I do have to admit, the car still handles like a Ferrari on a track.

***G-1000*** · 02-06-2005, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by 9000rpm

That's not a stock LS1.

That motor definetely has some work done to it.

I won't all out call BS on you about the new Z06, but I do have my doubts. I'm sure you can understand.

But let me ask you this. Why the hell does GM continue to insist on using leaf springs in the rear of the vette? That just seems old and ghetto to me. Now they are at least some sort of composite, but come on. This is 2005, why would they not go with coils all the way around like other high performance cars?

But I do have to admit, the car still handles like a Ferrari on a track.

sorry i might not have made this clear. the motor is stock but it has my supercharging system fuel system and with water injection intercooling also full exhaust.

this dyno run was at 16psi i.a.t 230. if the dyno fan was not broke and i got the i.a.t down to 160 0r 150 it would have made like 540hp

on the cars we do motor work i make over 675hp at the wheel

***G-1000*** · 02-06-2005, 06:01 PM

The leaf springs cheep and light. If you adjust the leaf it can work real nice for on the street. If you are running the car on a track its batter to have coil over shock and springs. You have to remember most of the cars that roll off the show room floor are not race.

**9000rpm** · 02-08-2005, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by gsxxr

You have to remember most of the cars that roll off the show room floor are not race.

Yes I know, this is the only thing I HATE about corvettes. Most owners are in their late 40's or 50's and are not interested in road racing or auto cross what so ever.

It is definetely a shame for such a great car to go to waste.

**co2boi** · 02-08-2005, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by jc3

Synthetics are great oils. I personally would only run them in a very high performance vehicle (high horsepower or torque). Also, I would only use them on a new motor as an older one will already have some wear and been coated and run on regular oil. If you do have a new high performance motor you should contact the people who put the block together for you and ask their opinion of what to run. A lot of the time, it's more the weight of the oil that is important. On a side note, most all the different car oil companies out there are made my the same 3 or 4 companies so watch your price when shopping around...more expensive doesn't = better oil. I am by no means an expert, but my father owns a shop and all my uncles and cousins have been working on cars since before the great depression.

No, no. Never use synthetic oils with a new engine, they are so slippery the engine won't break in properly. At least wait 4 - 5k miles. Blends are better too, especially if your oil is lubricating something other than the engine...like a clutch.

**9000rpm** · 02-08-2005, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by gsxxr

sorry i might not have made this clear. the motor is stock but it has my supercharging system fuel system and with water injection intercooling also full exhaust.

this dyno run was at 16psi i.a.t 230. if the dyno fan was not broke and i got the i.a.t down to 160 0r 150 it would have made like 540hp

on the cars we do motor work i make over 675hp at the wheel

That's pretty good. But a turbocharged S2000 with a motor with lower compression pistons (9.5:1), makes from 400rwhp to 600rwhp at 18 to 21psi.

Here is they guy that I was talking about that has gotten the highest hp yet that I know of. This is his dyno of his car making 559rwhp at 19 or 20psi. And he's also over 300ftlb's of torque.

http://chrisdrivesafastcar.com/gallery-view.php?ID=128

He is supposedly building a new turbo system for his car and he's aiming for 700+rwhp.

Now keep in mind this is a 2.0 liter 4 banger.

**9000rpm** · 02-08-2005, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by co2boi

No, no. Never use synthetic oils with a new engine, they are so slippery the engine won't break in properly. At least wait 4 - 5k miles. Blends are better too, especially if your oil is lubricating something other than the engine...like a clutch.

Don't tell Porsche or Ferrari that.

Their engineers must be stupid or something.

**GetinBig** · 02-08-2005, 11:39 AM

I have done studies at work and Reseached the Oils and Mobile-1 is the best.

That is all I will run im my cars after I got done finishing the tests.

Amsoil is also good but not as good as Mobile-1

***G-1000*** · 02-08-2005, 01:01 PM

I have built a lot of performance motors making 500hp and more. In my cars I take out the motors and refresh them every 2 years. I have run Mobil 1, red line; Amsoil, Royal Purple and Agip oil’s all were full synthetic oils. After looking at the cylinder walls cams and bearing along with the valve stems and seals the Agip oil’s worked the best by far. You can see that the bearing have less wear and scoring and spotting. The cylinder walls still have hatch marks for honing and the seals were not weeping at all. I feel this is the best info on this subject that you are going to get. I also forgot the mention that the superchargers are feed by the engine oils as well. When you take a blower apart that has been spinning at 60,000 rpm for 2 years and see no wear on the gears and carbon seals that is impressive. You also have to take into consideration how the oils will vaporize. You need to look in the intake manifolds and check the pcv valve. This is a big part of making power. If you have to much oil vapors going in the pcv valve due to blow by you will loose a lot of power. Also you will start to see the oil on your spark plugs.