Please read this...this is the man that the protestors are protecting, any other people who are against the war please considerate this...
Here
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Please read this...this is the man that the protestors are protecting, any other people who are against the war please considerate this...
Here
I'm not a very emotional man, but I will admit that brought tears to my eye seeing those children. I can't wait to go home and hold my daughter and son.
ditto man, ditto...Quote:
Originally posted by BIG TEXAN
I'm not a very emotional man, but I will admit that brought tears to my eye seeing those children. I can't wait to go home and hold my daughter and son.
:( speechless - I knew about some of that already and it is sadly not the only case - as an example, iraqi prisons have a special room with equipment to strap women down so that they are systematically gang raped as a form of punishment
and just think.... Iraq isn't the only place people live in those conditions. The list is rather long. :( I wish those protestors would go live in countries where there are NO human rights and then we could ask them if they object to war again. I mean, come on, those people in Iraq were kissing American soliders... ripping sadam's pictures off the walls. They're happy about it... we should all be too. Just my thoughts
thats bullshit, hopefully those men who have commited those acts will get what they deserve
tolinka,
Bravo Bro! Bravo! These simple a$$'d idiots in this country that believe this is all about oil need to look at what Saddam's history is! I think the biggest problem with our country here is that even an idiot can voice his opinion. If people looked and read at what his history has been they would see crimes against humanity! Yesterday, he called for Iraqi's and Palistineans to unite and become martyr's. That is man that needs to be removed from this earth! God Bless our troups, my brothers!
torture is widespread in the middle east, including israel my dear friend tolinka i know this first hand,i will not post a detailed account of the torture methods of the mossad, sorry.
hope you condemn this brutal organisation as much as you condemn the iraqi regime, i for one condemn both.
First of bro's thank you for taking a glimpse this, it truly brought a tear to my eye looking at it.Quote:
Originally posted by big palo
torture is widespread in the middle east, including israel my dear friend tolinka i know this first hand,i will not post a detailed account of the torture methods of the mossad, sorry.
hope you condemn this brutal organisation as much as you condemn the iraqi regime, i for one condemn both.
Big Palo- Mossad by the way is the American CIA, or the former KGB...any secret service will torture its enemies...please if you have any other stupid remarks to make, give us a proof of any kind that the Mossad killed innocent people...
As much as I hate starting all this again, anywho:
First off, I don't like the way you make it sound as if I SUPPORT all that shit that is going on. Just because I am against this war, I support the fucking use of gas like that on innocent people? I really doubt A SINGLE person who protests against this war is FOR Saddam. A lot of the protesters are probably against just "war" and don't even know why or what they are protesting.
I'm just gonna say this fast, cuz I've said it over and over again. We ALL want Saddam dead or gone. BUT, if it could be done with better means it should be so. Kill him for all I care, get rid of the regime, THAT'S WONDERFUL, BUT, point is, after you fucken kill Saddam (hey, i'm all for it), and after you execute all of Saddams close buddies (hey, i'm all for it), and after you completely change the regime (hey, i'm all for it), after all that...GET OUT of Iraq. Give the power to the people, make sure it is a good person, if you even want to keep a few military there (close at hand) to watch over the new people in power, that's great. BUT, don't ... DO NOT touch any of the oil. DO NOT make any of the decisions FOR the country.
If the U.S. can do that, and DOES do that, then HELL, I support them 1000000000%
In portland the protestors were carrying Iraq flags.... so... I might be wrong but it seems to me that they're for Saddam and his country. I read this story about an american solider who took down Iraq's flag and put up an American falg but his higher ups made him take it down.. they said ... because we're not taking over Iraq for good.. just temporarily or something like that. Why am I even writing this?
Well just because you saw an Iraqi flag, doesn't mean they support Saddam or the killing of innocent people. You don't know what those peoples beliefs were just by seeing them carry a flag. It's the same old story as saying, you see some KKK members or some American rebels holding up the American flag and therefore, all of the U.S. is like that.Quote:
Originally posted by peam
In portland the protestors were carrying Iraq flags.... so... I might be wrong but it seems to me that they're for Saddam and his country. I read this story about an american solider who took down Iraq's flag and put up an American falg but his higher ups made him take it down.. they said ... because we're not taking over Iraq for good.. just temporarily or something like that. Why am I even writing this?
The flag represents THE ENTIRE country, not Saddam. It is like saying the American flag represents George Bush, or the Canadian flag represents Jean Chretien. Well, it does not, as you obviously know.
I am sorry Terinox - it is one thing to peacefully march in disagreement with our policy - but frankly worthless because the decision is now made and our boys commited - marches should have been done before - but in any case, I do respect that - Carrying Iraq's flag right now is too much tho - lets get real, they are not showing solidarity with the iraqi people
do you think the people who burn the US flag are doing it becaue they are showing anger at every US citizen? No, they are angry with our leadership - so, pleeeeeeeaaaaaase lets get into the real world - I can listen to reasonable arguments of all sides - but call a spade a spade - like iraqi ministers saying no one was hit when we bombed saddams house - is the US giveing disinformation as well? sure... but not stupid enough to deny the obvious :rolleyes: I do agree that burning flags or carrying can represent a whole people but its obvious IMO in this case it does not....
Excellent Post!Quote:
Originally posted by tolinka
Please read this...this is the man that the protestors are protecting, any other people who are against the war please considerate this...
Here
Terinox you seem so worried about the oil. And that we are there just for it. I'm sure that is a small part of the reason. Oil is money and it makes the world go round. Even if we don't take over the oil but now we have Iraq as an freind and get oil cheaper great. But why doesnt france russia and germany don't wha tus to go in. Money. Germany and France biggest export country is Iraq. Russia just got caught selling night vison to Iraq last month. Turks want control of the northern oil fields. And wanted billions to use their country for our troops. But AMERICA is the bully for money. LOL
Every country I suppose has their reasons, I never said Russian, France, etc, are great countries. No body knows the entire story. Personally I think this is wrong, it is getting out of hand, too many innocent people ON BOTH sides will die.
After this war is over, analyze the situation, and then wait 5 years, and analyze it again, and see where we are then. Just don't forget everything that has happened and everything that the U.S. has claimed.
Not to mention, New York was the city hit worse by the 9/11 and STILL there are THOUSANDS of protesters against this war. They of all people should be the most against this war. So I mean are ALL these protesters just plain wrong?
No, just plain stupid - there are many people so seeped in their version of reality that they are incapable of seeing objectively, no matter what evidence is presented - these exist on both sides - btw: not referring to you ter
There are also many who are supremely ignorant - I would like to hear the opinon of the "human shields" who went over to Iraq before the war and Saddam wanted to put them next to his missiles. :rolleyes:
Terinox i didnt mean to seem like i was picking on you but like you said you are the only one here speaking up with that side. Nobody really wants war not even the US gov but sometimes it is needed unfortanitly thats life
No no, no picking, it's all good bro. I understand all your views and where you are coming from, and respect all your beliefs :)Quote:
Originally posted by gixxerboy
Terinox i didnt mean to seem like i was picking on you but like you said you are the only one here speaking up with that side. Nobody really wants war not even the US gov but sometimes it is needed unfortanitly thats life
sorry tolinka i think its wrong to ask me to prove mossad kill pple, u know i cant prove it, doesnt mean it is not true.can u prove they havent? NO!
can we prove osama was behind 9/11?, no, there is alot of circumstantial evidence but nothing concrete, but yes we believe he did it, so do i.
so dont start calling pple stupid because their remarks expose the truth.
you havent been in situations were proof is what u see first hand and not what is written down in a newspaper you buy at your local news stands 2 weeks later, if it is considered "imporatnt" enough to even make the news.
i dont flame pple on this board, i reply, it might not be what u like , but i dont call anyone names,please stick to being mature in future.
I am all for Freedom of Speach this is what I fought for when I was in! I support the constitution! I also realize that the soldiers who died yesterday do not want to hear that we shouldn't be there! The soldiers that are in Iraq's jails do not want to hear how some High School kids and college students and people who are not and have not fought for this and ALL of the worlds countries do not believe in the war. They want to hear we support you and nothing else! NOTHING ELSE! We as Americans, Canadians, Israeli's, English, even the ****** French, ALL of US! Unfortunatley, the USA likes to try and fix the worlds' ales and tries to be the World's cop, agree or not, if we are fighting for Prevention then what is happening is right. If we can prevent Saddam from killing and torchering any more people then what we are doing is right. Is it right that he uses innocent people as shields? No, but that is what he is about and if you can't see that well open your eyes look at the thread and see what he did to those and tons of other people!
Oh, don't forget about 9-11! I haven't and never will! Maybe that's me just being a Patriot! and someone who fought for all of us on this board!
GOD BLESS MY BROTHERS ON SEA, AIR, LAND AND THOSE WHO LOST THERE SOULS SO WE DON'T END UP ON A WEB PAGE ABOUT AND UNHUMANE ACT!
Terinox- Yes I do agree that the President is worried about oil, but a very big reason for it is that the US country will have to put in more money to rebuild Iraq if they destroy their own wealth...
big palo- i dont even want to reply htis, but oh well. first off- i dont see what the mossad has to do with this post. i posted it to show people of saddams crimes. mossad is just and intelligence agancy just like CIA...so why is it when i brought up CIA and KGB...you didnt say anything back? is it cause you realised that there is absolutely no connection or even relevence between the Saddams crimes(that are proven) and the Mossad (intelligence ageny= CIA...) please enligthen me with some more of your great ideas
ripsid- i agree with you 100%
tolinka i did answer your question. u posted ur post for 2 reasons, one to let pple know of sadams evil, and two, with reference to alot of ur other posts, to create an anti islamic/arabic feeling, i merely was pointing to the fact that israel practises this, and yes mossad is classifies under israel, and if u wanna get technical, fine, but let me say troture is not limited to the secret service abut also the IDF, and if u say thats bull,dont expect me to reply, cause i dont like people who deny facts. an u reckon u know ur shit?, ur lucky ur even getting a reply, the truth is i didnt realise ur only 19! uve got a long way to go before u even start to become knowledgeable, let alone critical of others older than you , shit bro!
Can we prove osama was behind 9-11?YES,YES,YES!When the man comes out on video talking how all there careful planning paid off and was even a greater success than he'd hoped for WTF?Hell the way I see it the world see's us as the bad guy so I think we should dust the A-bomb off and blow these fuckers a new lake and show the whole fucking world just why you don't fuck with the U.S.!!Then turn our backs on the world,they don't do shit for us anyway but cost us money....help us,we can't run our own country,help us,we need your military protection,help us,we're starving and it's your responsiblity to feed us.After this a whole lot of shits gonna change!!Quote:
Originally posted by big palo
sorry tolinka i think its wrong to ask me to prove mossad kill pple, u know i cant prove it, doesnt mean it is not true.can u prove they havent? NO!
can we prove osama was behind 9/11?, no, there is alot of circumstantial evidence but nothing concrete, but yes we believe he did it, so do i.
so dont start calling pple stupid because their remarks expose the truth.
you havent been in situations were proof is what u see first hand and not what is written down in a newspaper you buy at your local news stands 2 weeks later, if it is considered "imporatnt" enough to even make the news.
i dont flame pple on this board, i reply, it might not be what u like , but i dont call anyone names,please stick to being mature in future.
So we should allow Saddam to stay, so he can kill a ton more people in the future? Some sacrifices have to be made in order to keep another nazi regime from developing. This guy is a cold-blooded killer! How can anybody not oppose someone who is such a threat to peace? How can you say you support peace but not the means to accomplish it. I think there are a lot of people that really need to rethink their opinions!Quote:
Originally posted by Terinox
Personally I think this is wrong, it is getting out of hand, too many innocent people ON BOTH sides are dying.
SB
Look i've said this before. I am all for getting rid of Saddam. BUT for some reason a lot of you guys think that once Saddam is out of the picture, all your problems are settled. You DO know how 9/11 happened, and how so many people were involved. Bombing or even nuking one country WILL NOT "scare them off" or "teach them not to fuck with the U.S." but it will only get them more aggressive. You think Osama did all that shit from Afghanistan? And by bombing the hell out of the Afghani country, now they will quite with the terrorist activites? I wouldn't be surprised if not a single thing that happened on 9/11 did not occure OUTSIDE of Afghanistan. These terrorists are all over the world, and we have to make sure we deal with the problem on a wider scale. For all we know, there is a huge terrorist attack being planned in Russia, Brazil, Iceland, ANYWHERE for that matter! Do what is necessary with Iraq (keeping in mind the people) but this will NOT solve the major risk that threaten the world.Quote:
Originally posted by superbeast
So we should allow Saddam to stay, so he can kill a ton more people in the future? Some sacrifices have to be made in order to keep another nazi regime from developing. This guy is a cold-blooded killer! How can anybody not oppose someone who is such a threat to peace? How can you say you support peace but not the means to accomplish it. I think there are a lot of people that really need to rethink their opinions!
SB
Terrorism isn't going to disappear. This war will eliminate one of its backers though. We don't plan on ending terrorism by ousting Hussein. We plan on saving thousands of lives. If Saddam didn't have plans of offensive military actions in the future, he would've disarmed when he was asked to. We are only going to give back Iraq to the people. Saddam wasn't going to just disappear on his own. Even if we let him die of old age, his sons would follow in his footsteps. The regime needed to be ended now and thanks to the U.S. and Britain, the world will be a safer place.
SB
Ok i see that you are getting all huffy and puffy here. First off, i'm not 19, but 18(go ahead and say i dont know anything). You can ask anyone on this board if I am trying to make anti muslim posts here. I'm all agains racism, I'm jewish and because of that I'm not going to discriminate people over their religion or nationality or anything else. Yes maybe i'm only 18, but I know my shit. I never denied that Mossad tortured people, but I do say that the Israeli government didnt kill thousands of its own people or bomb planes or kill athletes in Munich. I'm not saying that all this was made by Saddam, but every one eles perfectly knows that he has alot of involvment in terrorism. I can tell though that you are a great Muslims supporter and I have nothing agains it, but I can also tell that you despise Jews and the country of Israel if you brought up the Mossad in this topic. Which has no relevence! So please am I worthy of your greatfulness? so you could please reply to my unknolwedgeble anti mislim/arabic post?Quote:
Originally posted by big palo
tolinka i did answer your question. u posted ur post for 2 reasons, one to let pple know of sadams evil, and two, with reference to alot of ur other posts, to create an anti islamic/arabic feeling, i merely was pointing to the fact that israel practises this, and yes mossad is classifies under israel, and if u wanna get technical, fine, but let me say troture is not limited to the secret service abut also the IDF, and if u say thats bull,dont expect me to reply, cause i dont like people who deny facts. an u reckon u know ur shit?, ur lucky ur even getting a reply, the truth is i didnt realise ur only 19! uve got a long way to go before u even start to become knowledgeable, let alone critical of others older than you , shit bro!
This post is self explenatory, it just shows you what Saddam has done. He has been a ruler for 29 years if I'm not mistaken and its time to go, he has to much power in the middle east and no mind. For god's sake, he dropped bombs on his own people!!!
So please am I worthy of your greatfulness? so you could please reply to my unknolwedgeble anti muslim/arabic post?
1st off. I agree with Terinox.
2nd - Just because I have protested this war doesnt mean I am for the chemical attacks. And the last I checked, they happened 15 years ago. Not that that makes it right, but if its such a big deal, why didnt we do something about it earlier...like maybe the 1ST TIME WE WERE IN IRAQ?!?!?! no excuses there. You cant just choose to use evidence when its convinient for you.
3rd - I will contine to protest the war because it is my right as an american. Anybody who calls me unpatriotic or a 'bad' american is simply ignorant. I suppose I would never make a good soldier, not based upon my fighting ability but because I refuse to follow orders blindly. Just because BUsh says 'IRAQ IRAQ' doesnt mean I HAVE to agree with him or follow him there. I use my head, thats why its there. I urge everybody to THINK! Dont just accept what people tell you, challenge yourselfs.
peace
symatech
symatech,
I'm not trying to start anything here, but I'm trying to let you know how THEY the soldiers feel.
Everyone has freedom of speach in the USA. Nobody is taking it from you, but (I'm a vet and I know how the armed forces feel) they don't want to hear that back home where they want to be people are against them. You believe it's the war, but when you're knee deep into it and people are shooting at you, it's personnal! We take it personnal, we may not agree with why we were called to battle but you know what an order is an order. You follow orders! I can say no to hitting someone with the butt of my m16, but I can't tell the Pres to piss up a rope.
All, I'm saying is just think how OUR guys feel. Remember Vietnam, we don't want the samething to happen and unfortunately it's going down the same road.
GOD BLESS MY BROTHERS! GOD BLESS OUR ARMED FORCES!
Ripsid, I understand your point completely. And this is not vietnam. Our country supports our troops. We do not support the war! Now, I know not all of our guys want to be there because I know a few guys there who did not want to go.
As for me, well, i suppose thats where a good soldier and I differ. I will never follow orders blindly. I refuse to fight for things I dont believe in. Period. not debatable. I am not a tool of our government -or any government- and never will be. NOw i am NOT saying that our troops are tools. and some of them believe in what they are doing. All im saying, is that me personally...well, by now i hope you all understand what Im trying to say. And by the way, Im no coward. It has nothing to do with a fear of dying...just want that cleared up because I know thats what lots of you are thinking.
peace
Hey Syma, you know I respect you, but I have to say that when you said: And the last I checked, they happened 15 years ago. Not that that makes it right, but if its such a big deal, why didnt we do something about it earlier...like maybe the 1ST TIME WE WERE IN IRAQ
Its not only the last 15 years, after the Gulf War, Iraq, US and the UN came to an agreement(if i'm not wrong) that Iraq had to disarm all of its long range and mass destruction weapons. A few years back ago the UN thought that Saddam was about 5 years away from developing a nuclear bomb, but after they said the inspectors there, it was 6 months!
The guy was given 12 years to disarm his weapons, and he ignored the UN. The UN are to scared to do anything about it, so this is where Bush stepped in. He does their dirty job. Again, I say this post wasnt about this war, but it was about Saddam's crimes, and when I said protestors consider this, I didnt mean accept it, I just asked you to read it and think about it....
You have the right to protest and to share your views, just please dont block the traffic when I'm driving...
ok I know I'm not on this board often but I have one thing to say and you take it as it is....
"Freedom is the sole possiason of those who dare to fight for it"
And this is just my opinion but those people that protest the war ok fine its freedom of speech, but the people who protest the war and hate Bush dont deserve to live in this great nation of ours. I dont what freedom of speech rights you have, in a hard time like this YOU STFU AND SUPPORT YOUR COUNTRY 110%!!!! Just remember that those people out there are good for nothing but hold a dame sign, and would never never put themselves in harms way or shed one drop of blood to defend this nation and what it stands for!!!!
P.S. And I myself and joining the Navy and then go to SEALs
Dude, that is EXACTLY what I am hoping will happen. It's all about the people here, and getting rid of the assholes! I just hope it ALL goes that way exactly, and by the book. I saw a great documentary on Iraq on BBCNEWS it was great. About the 70's and 80's. And oil REALLY helped their country, and they were becoming advanced, etc, but Saddam fucked it up, wars fucked it up, etc... And then Iraq goes and invades Iran, and over 1 million people die cuz of that asshole! I wish nothing more then him to be shot in the head! BUT, like I said, as civilized as possible, and giving the country back to the people is the number one priority.Quote:
Originally posted by superbeast
Terrorism isn't going to disappear. This war will eliminate one of its backers though. We don't plan on ending terrorism by ousting Hussein. We plan on saving thousands of lives. If Saddam didn't have plans of offensive military actions in the future, he would've disarmed when he was asked to. We are only going to give back Iraq to the people. Saddam wasn't going to just disappear on his own. Even if we let him die of old age, his sons would follow in his footsteps. The regime needed to be ended now and thanks to the U.S. and Britain, the world will be a safer place.
SB