Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 40 of 45
  1. #1
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345

    SERIOUS question: falling for the internet GF, always a bad idea?

    I think since the advent of IM, we've all been there at one point...a friend of a friend passes off your screen name to someone they know who they think might enjoy talking to you and before you know it, a good chunk of time has gone by and you've found yourselves talking at great length nearly every night. Inevitably, the desire to move beyond IM comes up for both. My problem with this is as follows: on IM and email, you are able to selectively choose what you wish to say in a way that is impossible in your traditional forms of conversation, and thus normally see the selected best of the other person and they with you. That being said, can anything but dissapointment result from actually meeting in person, seeing as how for a few months you've seen nothing but the best of one another? Discuss amongst yourselves.

  2. #2
    BDTR's Avatar
    BDTR is offline Retired
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    10,343
    I met my current GF online believe it or not. All our expectations were met oddly enough, but it normally doesn't work out like that. I think dragging on an online relationship before meeting is a bad idea because you both build eachother up in your heads and are destined for disapointment, but if you just casually meet someone, talk to them for a bit and then say "hey lets meet up", expectations aren't extremely high and it makes it a lot easier.

  3. #3
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by bdtr
    I met my current GF online believe it or not. All our expectations were met oddly enough, but it normally doesn't work out like that. I think dragging on an online relationship before meeting is a bad idea because you both build eachother up in your heads and are destined for disapointment, but if you just casually meet someone, talk to them for a bit and then say "hey lets meet up", expectations aren't extremely high and it makes it a lot easier.
    I understand that you haven't developed your theory to the point of scientific formula or anything, but what would you say is a rough cutoff for the "meet or don't meet" deadline?

  4. #4
    BUYLONGTERM's Avatar
    BUYLONGTERM is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Posts
    8,071
    Quote Originally Posted by mass junkie
    lmao....funny you should say that....im talking to 3 chicks right now that are all drunk.....anybody care to join?

    HELL YA, what IM? I will share my gals if you share yours....

  5. #5
    BDTR's Avatar
    BDTR is offline Retired
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    10,343
    Depends... I talked to her 4 days online, then 2 days on the phone then went out to meet her the next day. I'd never let it go longer than 2 weeks though, if two people aren't willing to meet by then, it'll just be weird.

    This is assuming you both live in the same state etc..

    Quote Originally Posted by BigGreen
    I understand that you haven't developed your theory to the point of scientific formula or anything, but what would you say is a rough cutoff for the "meet or don't meet" deadline?

  6. #6
    bigol'legs's Avatar
    bigol'legs is offline Quadzilla
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    MT
    Posts
    5,066
    Quote Originally Posted by mass junkie
    check your pm's bro
    :sad:

    mass

  7. #7
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by bdtr
    Depends... I talked to her 4 days online, then 2 days on the phone then went out to meet her the next day. I'd never let it go longer than 2 weeks though, if two people aren't willing to meet by then, it'll just be weird.

    This is assuming you both live in the same state etc..
    I see....well, that makes the score: Don't Do It - 1, Do It - 0

    We are in the same general area of the country, and within i'd say 60 miles of one another, but have been talking for about a month and some change now. We've both at one time brought up in a very round about way the idea of getting together, but never in a real direct way. I quite honestly started chatting to her because she struck me as interesting. I never had any intention of meeting her whatsoever. FEMALES: stop reading here...please.

    The reason being, I have a gf who has been my gf for almost six years now (and as a young guy, that pretty much makes her THE girl I've been with since my voice changed) and have been looking for a little bit now to move on (i'm not going to go into the story here, but a few guys on here know the deal). Anyway, this IM girl, while not my dream girl by a longshot, seems to have all the qualities I've found lacking in the gf i'd like to drift apart from....it just seems to perfect an opportunity. Yes i'm a jerk...happy now?

  8. #8
    BDTR's Avatar
    BDTR is offline Retired
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    10,343
    If you're going to do anything, make your intentions known and go meet up with her, quit stalling.

  9. #9
    mass junkie's Avatar
    mass junkie is offline banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    on the net
    Posts
    8,835
    Quote Originally Posted by bigol'legs
    :sad:

    mass
    get your ass on messenger

  10. #10
    bigol'legs's Avatar
    bigol'legs is offline Quadzilla
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    MT
    Posts
    5,066
    Quote Originally Posted by mass junkie
    get your ass on messenger
    hehe sorry bro im at work... but ill be home in a little

    and to stop my SERIUOS postwhoring..

    Big Green.. I think it takes something out of the "wierdness" of meeting someone.

  11. #11
    hoss827's Avatar
    hoss827 is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Somewhere in cyberspace..
    Posts
    1,292
    **** mass send me the PMs. I'll share if u share hehe!

  12. #12
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by hoss827
    **** mass send me the PMs. I'll share if u share hehe!

    Dammit...this thread is not a street corner for Mass to pimp out his IM girls...this is a thread for me to cathartically examine my station in life.

  13. #13
    mass junkie's Avatar
    mass junkie is offline banned
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    on the net
    Posts
    8,835
    My bad BG.........except my apology....but you had it coming...saying that ps2 is better than Xbox

  14. #14
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by mass junkie
    My bad BG.........except my apology....but you had it coming...saying that ps2 is better than Xbox
    I'm just joking anyway....i figure the more responses this gets, the better it'll look to people tomorrow and the more feedback i'll get. Pimp away, just remember, my pimp hand is strong and I require a 10% fee fo' doin bizness on m' cornha.

  15. #15
    bigol'legs's Avatar
    bigol'legs is offline Quadzilla
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    MT
    Posts
    5,066
    Quote Originally Posted by BigGreen
    I'm just joking anyway....i figure the more responses this gets, the better it'll look to people tomorrow and the more feedback i'll get. Pimp away, just remember, my pimp hand is strong and I require a 10% fee fo' doin bizness on m' cornha.
    Bro.. trust me! you dont want these girls mass is pimpin...

  16. #16
    hoss827's Avatar
    hoss827 is offline Banned
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Somewhere in cyberspace..
    Posts
    1,292
    Yeah....Sorry BG. I'm just a horny 16 y.o with the raging test. You know that!! . But yeah, I dont think meetin up with a girl off the internet would be bad IMO. I say go for it bro! And mass send me those PMs hehe

  17. #17
    the_rebirth's Avatar
    the_rebirth is offline Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Posts
    773
    Quote Originally Posted by bdtr
    Depends... I talked to her 4 days online, then 2 days on the phone then went out to meet her the next day. I'd never let it go longer than 2 weeks though, if two people aren't willing to meet by then, it'll just be weird.

    This is assuming you both live in the same state etc..
    i agree with you.. i have met my last 4 gf's online.. and only this one that i have now is all good dont wait longer then 2 weeks cause it will be WIERD.. trust me on that..

    ~Ricky

  18. #18
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by Ricky
    dont wait longer then 2 weeks cause it will be WIERD.. trust me on that..

    ~Ricky
    It's too late for that (well over two weeks now)...i never even entertained the thought of her being anything other than someone who was a blast to chat with until a few days ago when I really started thinking that my current relationship is about ready to end.

  19. #19
    Swellin Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by BigGreen
    ...That being said, can anything but dissapointment result from actually meeting in person, seeing as how for a few months you've seen nothing but the best of one another? Discuss amongst yourselves.
    In answer to this question, I have one word for you.....Spontaneity.

    The first thing to come to mind is alot more intriguing than a well prepared rebuttal. Creativity, honesty, and spontaneity are attributes than can only be judged fairly, by a live interaction.

    Another reason to meet her...later this will haunt your internal dialogue...."I shoulda....."
    Do it now. If it doesn't work out....you have lost nothing. If you don't try...<<<insert applicable cliche here>>>

  20. #20
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by swellin
    In answer to this question, I have one word for you.....Spontaneity.

    The first thing to come to mind is alot more intriguing than a well prepared rebuttal. Creativity, honesty, and spontaneity are attributes than can only be judged fairly, by a live interaction.

    Another reason to meet her...later this will haunt your internal dialogue...."I shoulda....."
    Do it now. If it doesn't work out....you have lost nothing. If you don't try...<<<insert applicable cliche here>>>
    Very true....in person rejection, however polite, is always a difficult pill to swallow, however rarely or frequently it happens to you. Never having met, however, how bad can a NO be?

  21. #21
    Swellin Guest
    I can only imagine that over the past month, you have "felt each other out," and have an idea of what to expect. You also have an online chemistry, which will or will not be duplicated in person. The aura exuded by this chemistry will permeate the meeting....whether that aura is pleasant or not...

    Both of you will likely feel the same results of that aura. Either good or bad, it is likely that both of you will feel the same. You are obviously a student of people, and this might be a somewhat uncomfortable situation...if the engagement ensues without the right sparks. In the event this happens, the engagement can be cut short and the further awkwardness can then be limited to online interaction...something that is easily dropped.

    Take the shot, unless you prefer the fairy tale version...complete with no physical interaction. Isn't that the penultimate pay-off of any relationship...physical interaction (not necessarily sex, simply interaction...sex is the pinnacle)?

  22. #22
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by swellin
    I can only imagine that over the past month, you have "felt each other out," and have an idea of what to expect. You also have an online chemistry, which will or will not be duplicated in person. The aura exuded by this chemistry will permeate the meeting....whether that aura is pleasant or not...

    Both of you will likely feel the same results of that aura. Either good or bad, it is likely that both of you will feel the same. You are obviously a student of people, and this might be a somewhat uncomfortable situation...if the engagement ensues without the right sparks. In the event this happens, the engagement can be cut short and the further awkwardness can then be limited to online interaction...something that is easily dropped.

    Take the shot, unless you prefer the fairy tale version...complete with no physical interaction. Isn't that the penultimate pay-off of any relationship...physical interaction (not necessarily sex, simply interaction...sex is the pinnacle)?
    Nice reply...now I somehow have to find the courage (completely regardless of the situation described in the thread...it is just a tangent if ever there were one) to begin the dismantling of an almost six year relationship without causing pain to someone who means a great deal to me in so many ways. Anyone EVER had to go ahead with that. Aside from the little two month junior high and early high school relationships, she is the only gf i have had and I the only real bf she has ever had...we've been together since my senior year of HS and her junior year.

  23. #23
    Swellin Guest
    I do not envy that situation in the least!

    Human nature dictates that sheer comfort prolongs many relationships past any useful life.

    It is so difficult to let go of that branch, before reaching for the next one...much easier to hold two and drop one. As such, I would test the new waters before completely leaving the sanctuary of the old. If you need a defense against guilt....this new situation might shed new light on your current arrangement. You may have an epiphany concerning your current relationship, thus, realizing an even greater attraction. It might be a stretch, but it can serve as a weak defense.

    At any rate...good luck!

  24. #24
    BigGreen's Avatar
    BigGreen is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    12,000 feet above it all
    Posts
    4,345
    Quote Originally Posted by swellin
    I do not envy that situation in the least!

    Human nature dictates that sheer comfort prolongs many relationships past any useful life.

    It is so difficult to let go of that branch, before reaching for the next one...much easier to hold two and drop one. As such, I would test the new waters before completely leaving the sanctuary of the old. If you need a defense against guilt....this new situation might shed new light on your current arrangement. You may have an epiphany concerning your current relationship, thus, realizing an even greater attraction. It might be a stretch, but it can serve as a weak defense.

    At any rate...good luck!
    We think alike in some key ways.....pretty frightening.

  25. #25
    BASK8KACE is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    2,396
    Quote Originally Posted by BigGreen
    I think since the advent of IM, we've all been there at one point...a friend of a friend passes off your screen name to someone they know who they think might enjoy talking to you and before you know it, a good chunk of time has gone by and you've found yourselves talking at great length nearly every night. Inevitably, the desire to move beyond IM comes up for both. My problem with this is as follows: on IM and email, you are able to selectively choose what you wish to say in a way that is impossible in your traditional forms of conversation, and thus normally see the selected best of the other person and they with you. That being said, can anything but dissapointment result from actually meeting in person, seeing as how for a few months you've seen nothing but the best of one another? Discuss amongst yourselves.

    BigGreen,

    I though of penpals when you wrote this. Although IM'g is an edited conversation, well-described by you above, it's still a representation of the person.

    I noticed that if you keep in touch with someone long enough, or know them well in the first place, IM's become far more relaxed, become less edited, and reveal the true person.


    Here's my vote:
    If this is a fantastic, cherished relationship--one like no other, then meeting's not going to screw it up. If it's just a fun, light-hearted relationship that doesn't make any deep impact on your life, then leave the meeting for when you're both 50 or 60. Otherwise, meeting the person sooner might screw up the fantasy.

  26. #26
    bermich's Avatar
    bermich is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    4,690
    I hooked up with 7 girls from the internet a few years ago when the chat room thing was still kinda new.
    I made sure that before I went to see them they showed me a pic first. Even before the phone conversations I would have seen a pic first.

    3 of them ended up being my gfs. I still keep in touch with a couple of them. I think each one lasted about six months. The other four I just slept with on occasion. Not a bad way of hooking up with a girl since you can figure out likes and dislikes before wasting any real time.

    I heard a couple talked for a year and a half and were in love over the phone. They decided to meet at the airport. He came down the ramp and the SECOND the girl saw the guy she knew there was NO ATTRACTION, even after talking about the most intimate secrets on the phone it came down to actual chemistry physically.
    Weird how two bodies can create chemicals inside you when you are around someone.

    Thats why it physically hurts when you break up. Your body is used to those chemicals and becomes adicted to them. The body releases stimulating chemicals to the brain like an afirdiziac (cant spell the word)
    It is either there or it isnt. Talking for a year wont help create the chemicals or seeing a picture. It has to do with physical contact.

  27. #27
    bermich's Avatar
    bermich is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    4,690
    AND YES sometimes meeting can screw up the online relationship. You have a perceived image of the person and when that image is different than the one in your head you feel dissapointed or let down. The next time you two talk on the interent it might not be the same.

    A lot of people are different in person than on the phone. Actions and body movement make send false messages or even shy and insecure actions can lead to turn offs.

  28. #28
    motocross308's Avatar
    motocross308 is offline New Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    32
    i met my wife online ....

  29. #29
    motocross308's Avatar
    motocross308 is offline New Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    32
    As a side note .. if you havnt been brutally honest , then dont go !
    hell , i told my wife about gear before we even met in person .

  30. #30
    Danielle's Avatar
    Danielle is offline Female Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    New Yorker
    Posts
    1,561
    Quote Originally Posted by BigGreen
    I think since the advent of IM, we've all been there at one point...a friend of a friend passes off your screen name to someone they know who they think might enjoy talking to you and before you know it, a good chunk of time has gone by and you've found yourselves talking at great length nearly every night. Inevitably, the desire to move beyond IM comes up for both. My problem with this is as follows: on IM and email, you are able to selectively choose what you wish to say in a way that is impossible in your traditional forms of conversation, and thus normally see the selected best of the other person and they with you. That being said, can anything but dissapointment result from actually meeting in person, seeing as how for a few months you've seen nothing but the best of one another? Discuss amongst yourselves.

    have you spoken on the phone with her yet?......i personally, never started a realtionship with someone over the computer..........but if your intertested in her, i say go for it.......i know a few couples that have meet online......
    Strength does not come from winning. Your struggles develop your strengths. When you go through hardships and decide not to surrender, THAT IS STRENGTH

  31. #31
    Babyweight's Avatar
    Babyweight is offline Female Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Fla
    Posts
    1,297
    I heard a couple talked for a year and a half and were in love over the phone. They decided to meet at the airport. He came down the ramp and the SECOND the girl saw the guy she knew there was NO ATTRACTION, even after talking about the most intimate secrets on the phone it came down to actual chemistry physically.
    Weird how two bodies can create chemicals inside you when you are around someone.

    Thats why it physically hurts when you break up. Your body is used to those chemicals and becomes adicted to them. The body releases stimulating chemicals to the brain like an afirdiziac (cant spell the word)
    It is either there or it isnt. Talking for a year wont help create the chemicals or seeing a picture. It has to do with physical contact.[/QUOTE]
    Is this someone you knew or something you read?
    A very interesting point. Someone I've known online for now over 2 years, that I am just dying to meet, and I'm not quite sure it will ever happen, but.....if so...that would be so dissappointing..
    But I honestly believe completely in chemical attraction. And there is no way you can sense this online...but when something feels so real online and on the phone... one can't imagine that it wouldn't be that perfect in person...
    makes you really wonder.

  32. #32
    KeyMastur is offline VET
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    7,424
    Quote Originally Posted by Babyweight
    I
    A very interesting point. Someone I've known online for now over 2 years, that I am just dying to meet, and I'm not quite sure it will ever happen
    have no fear darlin, for one day we will meet.

  33. #33
    KeyMastur is offline VET
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Posts
    7,424
    on a more serious note, i actually met up with someone off the internet this past week. and it had only been a few weeks that we've been talking. she actually wanted to call me on the first night of IM just to say goodnight. i gave her my digits and she called. we talked for another 10 min or so and then i let her go. we continued to chit chat on IM and phone for the next few weeks - more phone than IM.

    anyways, i met her. pictures did her no justice. she was absolutely gorgeous. for those interested, i can show you. (for a fee, j/k). we went to dinner (PF Changs), chatted it up. then i took her home - didn't want to be that guy that didn't get the hint ya know. when i pulled in the driveway, she asked if i was tired. i told her no. so i reversed out and we went to Sam's Boat (sorry i didn't call you major). chatted there for a few more hours. took her home about 12:30 or so. we are so alike, but don't have the same interests, which i find is good. she does like to workout, she doesn't like sports except football, she's smart. she's sarcastic which is good b/c i'm always that way. it was fun.

    all in all, great night. talk to her a lot on the phone. going to meet up with her again. didn't make a move on her. i'm a gentleman like that.

    oh yeah, and i live in houston and she lives in baton rouge (well, lafayette). she came over with her parents to visit some family. told them she was going out with a guy she had met at school that lived in houston.

  34. #34
    Babyweight's Avatar
    Babyweight is offline Female Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Fla
    Posts
    1,297
    Quote Originally Posted by KeyMastur
    have no fear darlin, for one day we will meet.
    Well Key....... what cha wait in for sweets.....
    well, since we're not on the serious note....
    Ya think things will work with your new interest??? It's always hot in the beginning...but then what?
    I'm seriously at a loss right now in my situation....

  35. #35
    chicamahomico's Avatar
    chicamahomico is offline Respected Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Hoss's Moms bedroom
    Posts
    2,769
    Big Green, I would be far more worried about 'dismantling' your six year relationship than pursuing this new online one. And more importantly, is she hot?

  36. #36
    bermich's Avatar
    bermich is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    4,690
    Its ALWAYS great in the beginning. Everything is new and exciting and you have SO MUCH to talk about. A month later, youve heard and told everything. The phone conversations become that awkward silence for 10 minutes until one person decides to say good bye from the phone.

    The only thing the internet can help with as far as relationships go is: You can determine each others interests before going out. You can not determine how you will be together until that time comes.
    You two WILL meet eventually so why wait.

    Its like the first injection. You wait 2 hours with the needle in your hand. You syke yourself up and almost do it then puss out. You know you are gonna eventually inject yourself, so why wait two hours in fear and worry. Just get it over with. If it works out great. If it doesnt work out, stay friends and you wont have wasted a year wondering in fear and nevousness.

    In my opinion. The reason a person waits to meet someone is fear that he wont meet that persons expectations. Send that person YOUR WORST picture. If he she still wants to meet then great.

  37. #37
    tatty's Avatar
    tatty is offline Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    canada
    Posts
    612
    Quote Originally Posted by bermich
    Its ALWAYS great in the beginning. Everything is new and exciting and you have SO MUCH to talk about. A month later, youve heard and told everything. The phone conversations become that awkward silence for 10 minutes until one person decides to say good bye from the phone.

    The only thing the internet can help with as far as relationships go is: You can determine each others interests before going out. You can not determine how you will be together until that time comes.
    You two WILL meet eventually so why wait.

    Its like the first injection. You wait 2 hours with the needle in your hand. You syke yourself up and almost do it then puss out. You know you are gonna eventually inject yourself, so why wait two hours in fear and worry. Just get it over with. If it works out great. If it doesnt work out, stay friends and you wont have wasted a year wondering in fear and nevousness.

    In my opinion. The reason a person waits to meet someone is fear that he wont meet that persons expectations. Send that person YOUR WORST picture. If he she still wants to meet then great.
    Wow, definitely a good way of looking at it bermich. If I were in your position, and I have been before, I would just go ahead and meet up. What's the worst that can happen? Just don't stall and give yourself reasons for not meeting up. The worst thing to do would be procrastinating until she doesn't want to venture down that road anymore...

  38. #38
    bermich's Avatar
    bermich is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Posts
    4,690
    The only problem with my encounters is I was just interested in the sex. That was my primary objective. Finding out that the girls were compatible and fun to hang with was a bonus.

    You just meet with intentions of friends and dont worry about anything else.
    This thread reminds me of the BLIND DATE show. 80 perecnt of the time, the two people are not compatible and the date is a waste of time for both.
    The other 20 percent know right off that they are both gonna get laid that night.

  39. #39
    BASK8KACE is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Posts
    2,396
    I get your point, Bermich.

    ---and I'd like to add:
    The producers of Blind Date purposely mismatch couples in an attempt to force a conflict. The last thing the producers want is to see is a couple getting along well. The producers considere it "boring TV" if there's no conflict. Actually, I'd be far more interested to watch a couple get along exceptionally well in order to learn what works well for other couples.

  40. #40
    allsaucedup's Avatar
    allsaucedup is offline Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    829
    bro it kind of sounds like you are using this new chick as an excuss to end your current relationship. Before you start anything new or even go meet this girl you should probably decide what to do with the g/f. not flaming just saying consider feelings of both ladies before you make your mind up.

    Hey Vet how is old sams boat did you go to the one on richmond, have not been there in a few years

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •