Thread: how much Nolv?
07-21-2004, 06:13 AM #1
how much Nolv?
well I have done a mild cycle of (Dbol/10mg with Nolv/10mg Proviron 20mgs) for a month and now gonna do (Dbol/20mg, nolv/20 mg, proviron/20mgs) for another month......before I get badgered for that, I have adolesence gyno so takeing it easy. My friend did the same and got great gains. Anyway, I got nice slow gains too. so after one month gonna do 10mgs of dbol and 10mgs of nolv for about 10 days then I am on pct.
So my questions is this. What should my PCT look like? And should I use Mesterelone with the nolv on and off my cycle?
HOLD YA NOSE AND TAKE A DEEP BREATH, RECESS
MICS 3 TIMES A DAY, 3TIMES A NIGHT IT AL EQUALS, SUBLIMINAL SEQUALS
07-21-2004, 06:16 AM #2Originally Posted by Ridla
WTF?? dude for one the proposed cycle sux ass!!! very ****ty! not flaming you but it really looks bad. how old are you?
07-21-2004, 06:18 AM #3
couldnt agree more with what hung-solo said
you need to do a lot of research bro
07-21-2004, 06:20 AM #4
07-21-2004, 06:23 AM #5
Ridla, ok mate, u could get some nice muscle gains from doing a decent cycle, you wont be looking like mr o standard after one cycle dont worry
07-21-2004, 06:23 AM #6
The Use of Dianabol as a Supplement
The Use of Dianabol as a Supplement
Article by Bransholme (MuscleTalk Member)
This article was originally intended to be a history of the anabolic steroid dianabol and it's usage in bodybuilding, but there is little real evidence of how it was used in previous decades. However, in the course of research, I have come to the conclusion that current use of dianabol as a supplement is not as efficient as it could be. Most of the modern thoughts on dianabol use reflect around myths and irrelevant scientific studies; this article attempts to explain new ways of thinking on dianabol usage using scientific evidence and people's experiences.
Dianabol (or dbol as it's commonly called) is one of the most commonly used oral steroids . Its chemical name is methanedienone or methandrostenolone and there are many different pharmaceutical and generic varieties including Anabol and Naposim. In this article we look at lower dose usage of dianabol as a supplement, as opposed to using pro-hormones or pro-steroids .
Liver Toxicity of Dianabol
The 17 alpha-alkylated properties of methanedienone do make it liver toxic, but this, I believe, is overstated as most of the evidence of its toxicity comes from studies on individuals and not from studies on large groups of dianabol-using bodybuilders. One study on rats (1) showed that regardless of dose or time of administration, dianabol produces changes in enzymatic activity, which leads to hypertrophy of hepatocytes; which basically shows that dianabol is toxic to the liver. But in another study (2) Nerobol (Russian Dianabol) was found to favour a rapid normalisation of functional and metabolic disorders of the liver, which contradicts the earlier evidence. This shows that the whole idea of dianabol being dangerous is in no way as bad as some would make out.
Benefits of Dianabol Use
Dianabol has been shown to increase anaerobic glycolysis (3), which increases lactic acid build up in the body. This is beneficial because lactic acid is used by the muscles to form glycogen, which in turn provides energy in anaerobic metabolism. Lactic acid is also a key chemical in the disposal of dietary carbohydrates, which means you are less likely to get fat while using dianabol.
A study on osteoporosis (4) showed that at a dosage of just 2.5mg per day for 9 months dianabol was more effective than calcium supplementation in reducing osteoporotic activity, it was also shown to increase muscle mass more effectively. Another study on osteoporosis (5) which lasted 24 months, showed just how dianabol works on osteoporosis; dianabol increased total body calcium, and also total body potassium. This may not mean much to you as a bodybuilder, but the actions of calcium are very important to bodybuilders, as it transports large numbers of amino acids and also creatine and these two things are vital in muscle growth. Potassium is also very important, as it assists in muscle contractions, transmitting nerve signals, and insulin release; so it is also a very anabolic substance.
One very interesting study (6), although not significant in bodybuilding terms, showed that dianabol increases the sensitivity of laryngeal tumour cells to radiotherapy, and concluded 'recommending this hormone to be used during radiotherapy of patients with the laryngeal cancer'.
How to Cycle Dianabol
To create a cycle for dianabol that is based around using it more as a supplement than a steroid, we first need to look at the current trend for cycling dianabol and analyse what is wrong with it. An average cycle of Dianabol is usually structured as 25-40mg split throughout each day for 4-6 weeks, either alone or stacked with other steroids.
Firstly a dose of 25mg or more commonly causes water retention. It is well known that dianabol does aromatise quite easily, and most of the water retention is usually attributed to a build up of excess estrogen. However, it is my belief that initially water retention is caused by the body holding on to water due to the effects of dianabol on the body's mineral balance, in particular the potassium/sodium balance. This coupled with the fact that dianabol cause estrogenic side effects, leads to a lot of water build-up, and as there is little we can do about the change in the bodies mineral balance, the only other thing we can do is try to reduce aromatisation, usually with Nolvadex (tamoxifen ) or other anti-estrogens. This is not the only method though, by reducing the dose, less of the drug will aromatise, which leads to less estrogen and more importantly less water retention. Reducing the drug during a cycle would lead to estrogen levels dropping slowly, so we should start the cycle with a lower dose of 10-20mg each day.
Splitting the dosage when you are using a low dose is virtually pointless, as you will get a much smaller peak of the drug. So in this case it is best to take it in a single dose in the morning (preferably with grapefruit juice). Although this will not prevent suppression of natural testosterone , it may lessen it to a certain degree, as your body will still have lengthy periods later in the day when there is little testosterone circulating, and so it may still produce some.
Now if we look at cycle duration, 4-6 weeks seems too short to have any real effect at a low dose, but how can we use dianabol for longer without placing more risk on our liver? The solution is actually quite simple; by taking weekends off from the drug we will give our livers a break from processing the drug. Due to the short half-life any active substances will be out of our system within 24 hours of your last dose, now this may seem like it will cost you gains, but in actual fact it will cost you little or no losses in the long run as even though there is no active drug in the body the effects are still present i.e. extra intramuscular water, and a more anabolic mineral balance. These effects usually taper off over several days. This method will not however, help your natural testosterone to return from its inhibited state, as this process can take considerably longer. If we take weekends off and use a lower dose, we should in theory be able to use dianabol for 10 weeks with no problems. A simple bit of mathematics can show this point best:
6 weeks @25mg each day = 1050mg of Dianabol in total
10 weeks with weekends off @15mg each day = 750mg of Dianabol in total
So as you can see, by using this system your liver will actually process less dianabol than in a conventional cycle, add this to the fact that you can make gains for 10 weeks instead of 6, and with fewer side effects, and you get a very solid cycle.
This Cycle Theory can be applied in many different situations, for instance a beginner could use the dianabol on it's own for 10 weeks and gain very well. A more experienced steroid user could use this alongside an injectable cycle for very good gains too, getting the benefit of the initial quick gains of the Dianabol, with the slower but stronger gains of an injectable.
This cycle may seem to go against many of the current trends of dianabol use, but I believe that by using dianabol as a supplement to good training and nutrition you can make very good gains.
Effects of methandrostenolone on liver morphology and enzymatic activity. Nesterin MF, Budik VM, Narodetskaia RV, Solov'eva GI, Stoianova VG.
An experimental study of the hepatoprotective properties of phytoecdysteroids and Nerobol in carbon tetrachloride induce liver lesions. Syrov VN, Khushbaktova ZA, Nabiev AN.
Effects of methanedienone (methandrostenolone) on energy processes and carbohydrate metabolism in rat liver cells. Serakovskii S, Mats'koviak Iu.
Calcium, vitamin D and anabolic steroid treatment of aged bones: double-blind placebo-controlled long-term clinical trial. Inkovaara J, Gothoni G, Halttula R, Heikinheimo R, Tokola O.
Changes in body composition following therapy of osteoporosis with methandrostenolone. Mann V, Benko AB, Kocsar LT.
Radiomodifying effect of methandrostenolone on laryngeal cancer cells. Bordiushkov IuN, Kucherova TI, Kisliakova ND, Vagner VP, Zubkova TV.
Warning! Articles related to the use of illegal performance enhancing drugs are for information purposes only and are the sole expressions
07-21-2004, 06:24 AM #7Originally Posted by Ridla
07-21-2004, 06:24 AM #8
please respond for the PCT question..but thanks for ur feedback bros
07-21-2004, 06:26 AM #9
07-21-2004, 06:28 AM #10Originally Posted by Ridla
LOLOLOLOL!!! go to the pct forum on this web site.. word of advice bro use some testosterone with that.. but if you are destined not to keep what you gain.. which will not be shiit i promise you that.. also why dont you just ajust your diet and get more sleep?? that will work better than your proposed shiitty cycle imo
07-21-2004, 06:29 AM #11
ht: 6 ft
Well I fell sick (mainly the runs) when I visited India. I used to weigh about 190. then went down to 145 and now am working my way up.
what U mean by shut down?
07-21-2004, 06:32 AM #12
07-21-2004, 06:32 AM #13
07-21-2004, 06:35 AM #14LOLOLOLOL!!! go to the pct forum on this web site.. word of advice bro use some testosterone with that.. but if you are destined not to keep what you gain.. which will not be shiit i promise you that.. also why dont you just ajust your diet and get more sleep?? that will work better than your proposed shiitty cycle imo
07-21-2004, 06:35 AM #15Originally Posted by Ridla
07-21-2004, 06:37 AM #16shutdown meaning shutdown your testosterone production
07-21-2004, 06:39 AM #17
Will one more month hurt man? I am really making good gains.
07-21-2004, 06:39 AM #18Originally Posted by Ridla
07-21-2004, 06:42 AM #19
[QUOTE=Ridla]Will one more month hurt man? I am really making good gains.[/QUO
didnt know you were already doing it.. you really dont need to run dbol for more than 4-5weeks it is really bad for the liver bro..not to mention other things..go to the pct forum and do a search and see what you can find out man.. this cycle was poorlly thought of and you started something and you dont even know how to finish it.. BAD IDEA!!
07-21-2004, 06:43 AM #20
BUlk is what I am loking for. its been over 2 years now since I lost all that wt.
07-21-2004, 06:48 AM #21Originally Posted by Ridla
1-12wk test enth-- 500mg a week.. you shoot mon and thurs 250mg each day
1-12wk nolva 10-20mg ed
12-pct nolva 20mg ed
pct= clomid, nolva
*** much safer, much better than just dbols...dbols suck big cock man.. DO RESEARCH!! ON PCT AND TEST CYCLES
07-21-2004, 06:48 AM #22
oh yeah EAT EAT EAT EAT EAT!! lots of sleep and a kick ass workout regemine
07-21-2004, 06:52 AM #23
i second what hung said, you will be pleased with the results
07-21-2004, 06:54 AM #24
ok listen bro. What should PCT look like. I searched all over for it could not find anything. its four hours now of searching ...please help me
07-21-2004, 06:56 AM #25
07-21-2004, 06:58 AM #26Originally Posted by map200uk
thanx map for the hand!
07-21-2004, 07:04 AM #27
well I am in India. All I can get is Nolv right now
so U think 20mds should be fine
07-21-2004, 07:05 AM #28
again thatnks for all the help yall
07-21-2004, 07:10 AM #29
[QUOTE=Ridla]well I am in India. All I can get is Nolv right now
so U think 20mds should be fine
shiitt!! you might have just shot yourself in the foot with this whole ideal.. do the best you can to get some clomid. do an internet search and do the best you can.. the only thing i can tell you is drop the dbol continue to run nolva at 20mg ed until you feel signs of gyno, puffy nips and etc, then if you have signs bump it up to 80mg ed until the symptoms subside... thats all i can help you with bro.. next time do an extensive research before you take shiit that can really fukk you up.... just b/c some dumbass did doesnt mean it will do the same for you..good luck
07-21-2004, 07:11 AM #30
he could try a research site, although im not sure of the legality of it all in india obviously
07-22-2004, 01:19 AM #31
07-22-2004, 01:38 AM #32
Try lifting heavy and eating over 4000 calories a day... they work wonders
05-13-2005, 09:44 PM #33New Member
- Join Date
- May 2005
Man Sounds Like Amess. I May Be A Rookie On A.s . But One Thing I Do Know Is Ass Kicking Hardcore Training With Proper Calorie Intake And Rest ,not To Mention Protein Intake Is Totaly Overlooked By Rookies. Foundation., Foundation,foundation.
05-13-2005, 09:50 PM #34Originally Posted by Ridla
wtf! bro, you're 6' 160lbs.!!!
i wouldn't even of thought about juicin until i was around 180.
any gains you get from the dbol you could have gotten natural with a good diet etc..
furthermore, i definately would not have done dbol if i had a small case of gyno
you're better off running a small dose of test with some letro then what you're doing
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