Would like knowledgable, open-minded opinions

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07-31-2004, 06:37 PM
jeremys

Would like knowledgable, open-minded opinions

Say a 17-18 year old really had their **** together. Training for 5-6 years, diet has been perfect (or at least good enough to make awesome gains) for the last 3-4 years, and they compete in (and love) bodybuilding/powerlifting (mainly powerlifting but w/ freaky physique goals. Never miss a training day (even squats and leg days) unless injured and have true dedication and knowledge. Started puberty in 4th grade so physiologically (and phsychologically due to experience) advanced for their age.

Would it be a safe time for them to start? Remember that they want to be the king of their sport, its their true passion in life. If it's gone, nothing else matters.

Maybe some of their competitors get an early edge from starting earlier in their lives..(Pro bodybuilding comes to mind but maybe nobody knows for SURE when the pros started. Markus Ruhl started at 19, correct?)
07-31-2004, 06:40 PM
nitro884

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeremys

Say a 17-18 year old really had their **** together. Training for 5-6 years, diet has been perfect (or at least good enough to make awesome gains) for the last 3-4 years, and they compete in (and love) bodybuilding/powerlifting. Never miss a training day (even squats and leg days) and have true dedication and knowledge. Started puberty in 4th grade so physiologically (and phsychologically due to experience) advanced for their age.

Would it be a safe time for them to start? Remember that they want to be the king of their sport, its their true passion in life. If it's gone, nothing else matters.

Maybe some of their competitors get an early edge from starting earlier in their lives..

I still say to young to do gear, but when i was 18 i didnt listen , thats why i am prolly 5'6 tall
07-31-2004, 06:41 PM
Big_Diesel

Id would say closer to 18 would be best. The reason is your not done growing yet and steroids can stunt your growth. :eek:
07-31-2004, 06:43 PM
jeremys

OK, add in the fact that they are taller than both their parents by at least a couple inches and haven't grown in height in 5-6 years. And they are happy with their height (5'9).
07-31-2004, 06:45 PM
mass junkie

What does your diet and training regimine look like...and when is the last time youve noticed any noticible size gains?
07-31-2004, 06:47 PM
BodyMechanic

nobody in here is going to tell you what you want to hear and that is to do it.All they will do is give you advice probably try to convince you not to do it because you shouldn't but the bottom line is you are going to do whatever you want to do anyway. So research as much as possible and then decide if you are ready on your own.
07-31-2004, 06:49 PM
Big_Diesel

Good advice.....I still hate your back pose........J/K :blush:
07-31-2004, 06:50 PM
Lozgod

I would never advocate anyone using AAS before their time, BUT I can understand dedication to advancement in your competitive spirit. I just wish you the best and would have to say get educated as much as possible and you wouldnt be the first to juice at 18.
07-31-2004, 06:50 PM
UrbanLegend

It sounds like you want us to say "Yes, its okay." Every teenager who comes to these boards thinks they are the exception, that it would be okay for them to start early......

My question is why? What is the hurry? Bodybuilding is not an instant gratification endeavor, and surely you realize this having been doing it as long as you have. Have you hit a plateau? You made no mention of this in your first post. It sounds to me like you are impatient and immature, and that type of individual should not be using steroids at any age.

IMO: No, it would be best if you wait a few years.
07-31-2004, 06:53 PM
BodyMechanic

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big_Diesel

Good advice.....I still hate your back pose........J/K :blush:

well i didn't claim to be a good poser.
07-31-2004, 06:56 PM
Big_Diesel

No dude ,on the real ,your back looks good, not as good as those front delts though........ :eek:
07-31-2004, 06:57 PM
jeremys

training is (for the hypothetical person)

monday - raw bench (5 work sets) , 3 and 2 board press (sets of
3), decline/incline bar/DB bench, 2 tricep exercises

tuesday - squats (5+sets), (optional box squats, sets of 3), Good mornings (3-4 sets) hack
squats (4-5 sets), SLDL/hamstring machine curls (2
sets), calves - 5 sets

wednesday - BB rows (5 sets), T bar rows (5 sets)
pullups/pulldowns (5 sets), side delts (3 sets), face pulls (3 sets),
shrugs (100 reps w/ increasing weight or 4 sets 10
heavy)

friday - max bench/shirted bench technique work (many sets), 5
and 4 board press (sets of 3..these board presses are
HEAVY), 4-5 sets of pushdowns or another tri exercise, 5
sets of barbell/EZ bar curls, 2 sets of hammer curls

Diet depends on goals. Let's say they are looking to get leaner yet stronger and bigger (and it's working)

wake up - 9 egg whites w/ 2 yolks, oatmeal
meal 2 - beef and veggies/metamucil
meal 3 - beef/chicken/tuna and veggies/metamucil
meal 4(preworkout) - oatmeal + whey or egg whites
meal 5(post workout) - MRP
meal 6 - beef/chicken/tuna and veggies/metamucil
meal 7 - Peanut butter and cottage cheese/milk
07-31-2004, 06:59 PM
UrbanDawg

At the risk of parroting -- you sound like your mind is made up but you asked for opinions so your getting another one.

You are too young and it is unlikely that you have no more growing to do. In fact i would say most people grow somewhat after high school.

As has also just been said - you are too impatient and are thinking like a kid who has to have it now. Waiting is part of exercising discipline.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeremys

Say a 17-18 year old really had their **** together. Training for 5-6 years, diet has been perfect (or at least good enough to make awesome gains) for the last 3-4 years, and they compete in (and love) bodybuilding/powerlifting (mainly powerlifting but w/ freaky physique goals. Never miss a training day (even squats and leg days) unless injured and have true dedication and knowledge. Started puberty in 4th grade so physiologically (and phsychologically due to experience) advanced for their age.

Would it be a safe time for them to start? Remember that they want to be the king of their sport, its their true passion in life. If it's gone, nothing else matters.

Maybe some of their competitors get an early edge from starting earlier in their lives..(Pro bodybuilding comes to mind but maybe nobody knows for SURE when the pros started. Markus Ruhl started at 19, correct?)
07-31-2004, 07:00 PM
Big_Diesel

Keep it up, keep talking to all these knowledgable guys, keep readin then youll know when its time.
07-31-2004, 07:01 PM
jeremys

Quote:

Originally Posted by UrbanLegend

It sounds like you want us to say "Yes, its okay." Every teenager who comes to these boards thinks they are the exception, that it would be okay for them to start early......

My question is why? What is the hurry? Bodybuilding is not an instant gratification endeavor, and surely you realize this having been doing it as long as you have. Have you hit a plateau? You made no mention of this in your first post. It sounds to me like you are impatient and immature, and that type of individual should not be using steroids at any age.

IMO: No, it would be best if you wait a few years.

remember that this is hypothetical :)

No plateau has been hit and juicing would start ONLY when gains slowed down (who knows..that could take a couple years. Don't want to sell themselves short ya know?)

Getting sick of the natural (slim and flat) physique though.

Bodybuilding for recreation/health is just that. Competitive powerlifting with physique goals and looking forward to being the BEST and reaching their goals...is different.
07-31-2004, 07:02 PM
jeremys

They would have absolutely NO problem at all waiting, if they weren't selling themself short by losing an edge on future competitors or their own potential. And who knows maybe they wouldn't be by waiting. Or they could be. That's mostly what I'm asking. You don't get another chance at life, gotta win the first/only time through.
08-01-2004, 07:59 AM
shorty2big

I can understand wnating to use and grow bigtime. I still think it's way to early. I would wait until at least 21 or so. Just make sure that you think about it bro. You'll do what you want. just make sure that you weigh all the risk to benefit ratios and make an educated decision. You stil have plenty of time man.
s2b
08-01-2004, 09:37 AM
jeremys

Thanks for the opinion shorty2big, looking pretty big in your avatar. In the end, the person in question will make their own decision. I'm looking for the CORRECT info that wont let them themself short by either not being their absolute best in their prime by waiting too long, or by peaking too early in their life and/or getting health problems (besides the temporary high cholesterol/liver values, etc.
08-02-2004, 01:18 PM
jeremys

bump
08-02-2004, 01:24 PM
Diesel

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeremys

OK, add in the fact that they are taller than both their parents by at least a couple inches and haven't grown in height in 5-6 years. And they are happy with their height (5'9).

That would mean the person (you) have not grown at all since you were 12???

D
08-02-2004, 01:26 PM
Pale Horse

The whole problem with this situation is that anyone with a brain knows that their competition (at least some) have to be using. To that end they are losing an edge but at what price? Only you/they can answer that. So they lag a bit for a couple of years if it is indeed a real love of the sport they will stick around. But who knows for sure?
08-02-2004, 01:27 PM
Lozgod

I think everyone is on the same Accord. You should wait. You could bump this 1,000,000 times and still get the same answers.
08-02-2004, 02:26 PM
jeremys

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel

That would mean the person (you) have not grown at all since you were 12???

D

Haven't grown since 12, no.
08-02-2004, 02:32 PM
beeffreak6

U should wait but i know alot of guys who are younger than u who use So u need to make a educated decision and go with it sounds like u will so test its the best!
08-02-2004, 02:34 PM
jeremys

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1victor

The whole problem with this situation is that anyone with a brain knows that their competition (at least some) have to be using. To that end they are losing an edge but at what price? Only you/they can answer that. So they lag a bit for a couple of years if it is indeed a real love of the sport they will stick around. But who knows for sure?

So you think being on for more years is an advantage, correct? I'm not willing to kill myself over it, I'm beating pretty much everybody in my age group naturally. I just want to eventually set the bar high, push way past the 'limits' (ronnie coleman, scot mendelson, etc).

I know an 18 y/o who is 6'1 or somewhere there, 300 lbs in the off season. He's going for his pro card (bodybuilding) already. He's got 27 inch arms in the offseason at about 10-12% and lats and legs to match. ~685 lb raw bench, ~1000 lb raw squat

He would be an example. Is starting relatively early in life like this helpful in becoming a pro. Maybe Arnold would be another example. Seems he started in his late teens, and now look where he is. He had one of the most fun, eventful lives I think a person could have. True happiness.