Prop-only beginner cycle

[IronGame]

I've chosen to do a Prop-only beginner cycle - a bit of an odd choice, but I have my reasons:

1.) It's out of the system fast, so if anything goes wrong I can catch it and treat it early.
2.) The possibility of permanent HPTA shutdown. A REMOTE possibility, I know, but I am already aware of two cases of this, and I'd like to minimize it as much as possible. If I notice any alarming testicular atrophy, I can stop the prop and start Clomid/Nolva immediately.

I don't mind the injections. That's life. Cypionate and Enanthate are attractive, but until I know exactly how my balls will react to alot of exogenous test in my system, I perfer to use a short-acting ester.

I have questions:

1.) As far as I know, the correct dosage is 100mg eod. Is this correct? Is there a "magic number?" The magic number for cyp and enanthate is usually 500mg/week, so I assume prop has some "ideal" dose for beginners.

2.) I'm VERY concerned about mitigating the possibility of permanent HPTA shutdown, so I want to use ancillaries/PCT drugs DURING my cycle, if that would do the trick. So, clomid? Nolva? Both? HCG is not an option for me, neither is arimidex .

3.) Since I'm using prop, do I still need 10 weeks of it? I doubt it, since it begins to act very quickly and I'll see gains much sooner than with longer acting esters. How long should my cycle be?

4.) Costs. I'll probably need moer vials of prop, but prop is cheaper, as far as I know.

I'd appreciate thoughts, comments.

[bignatt]

1) its better to shoot prop everday you could do 75mg or 100mg
2) dont take pct drugs during your cycle unless its nolva 10-20mg ED to combat gyno pct stands for post cycle therapy you do it after your cycle
3) yes i would still do 10 weeks 8 weeks at the least
4) as far as costs it matters who your source is

[IronGame]

The reason I mentioned PCT drugs during a cycle is to prevent testicular atrophy. I don;t know if Tribulus can do anything against the potency of an injectable.

[bignatt]

if your bolls shrink up they usually go back to there original size trib wont prevent testicular atrophy hcg can but you already said that is not an option......i honestly wouldnt worry about it just set your cycle up rright and you most likely wont have any problems

[Consistency]

You are coming to alot of conclusions without really knowing what you are talking about. To prevent atrophy use 4g of tribulis a day during cycle. HPTA shutdown is gonna happen when you use test prop for atleast 4 weeks. However this is not permanent, if you do proper pct with clomid and nolva everything will be working again properly in about 3-4 weeks. Also use nolva at 10mg ed during cycle.

Use prop at 75mg ed thats 525mg a week.

[bignatt]

[QUOTE=To prevent atrophy use 4g of tribulis a day during cycle.[/QUOTE]
I had no idea

[Consistency]

[QUOTE=bignatt]

I had no idea

it works for most people....

[Duke of Earl]

I dont think prop will shut you down any more or less than the longer esters - you will probably see testicular atrophy on any AS - and you wont know if any permanent damage has been done until months after you finish your cycle........so you need to make a choice to go for it & accept the risks ( & try to minimise them ), or not bother at all - because the sort of damage you're talking about can't be diagnosed till way after you've finished your cycle anyhow..

Are you sure you can deal with ED shots - i'd do a trial run with some B12 or something for a week just to be sure - I did a prop cycle as my first & had to switch to Test E after a couple of weeks cos of the fv<kin ED shots....

If you do choose prop I'd still run it 10 weeks (+) cos although it kicks in quicker than say Enanth it also goes quicker -

Why cant you use Adex? You may still need it with prop.........tribulus @ 4g ED helps keep you nuts plump which may (not sure) help keep your natty test ticking over. Some say yo can use clomid during cycle to keep your nuts active....

You may need to run slightly more Prop than you would Enanth (gram for gram) cos its' short halflife means your blood test concentrations dont build up as high as with the longer ester tests......I dont think it'll be significantly cheaper at all ( may even work out more expensive ).

Prop does rock, but it's a pain in the arse to me - I still use it sometimes tho - to kicksatrt & end my cycles. I'd say go with Enanth for a first....

[bignatt]

i appreciate the info i guess ill have to add that into my next cycle

[bigrthanu]

Just my two cents but ive had pretty good results on my first cycle with 50mg E/D injections, my stats are 5' 11" 230 bf around 10%,I'm also taking 10 mgs/day of tamoxifen .Put on about 10 lbs now over almost 4 weeks and i m not bloating at all. I think it is more important to eat lots of protien and train hard. IMO one doesnt really need that much test in your first cycle, and prop kicks in pretty fast, so if you have the patience for e/d injections youll love it, good luck

[IronGame]

I checked with my source, and 10 weeks of prop will be alot cheaper than 10 weeks of enanthate (he has no access to cyp right now.)

1 vial of prop = good for 20 injections, 100mg each. So, I'll get two vials, which will cover me if I want to go for a full 10 weeks. 100 mg EOD seems about right, unless someone has a better idea. I'm not afraid of poking, though. It might be a b*tch to plan ot injection sites, tho, but big deal. Glutes and quads should do fine.

I'm looking for something to use during my cyle to TRY to maintain some kind of testicular size. Tribulus is one choice, but I'm also told that it doesn;t stand a chance against exogenous test. Still can't hut to mega-dose the sh*t. I have access to plenty of it, and good quality for very cheap. I'm taking 4grams a day right now, actually. I feel it's working very well for my libido (on top of my already uncontrollbale sex-drive, lol.) I see that some guys here are using it with some success. I guess mega-dosing it helps. Following the bottle instructions doesn't do FA for me.

Some people say that Clomid during a cycle is useless because it needs a low level of androgens in your system to work. Nolvadex seems to be preferred during cycle and also works as PCT, but I'm noy sure if that will be enuogh. Maybe I can get my hands on some A-dex after all. It's OK, though, if I'm not comfortable wit it, I can always stop the prop and deal with stuff right away. We'll see how I react . . . .

Thanks for the advice so far, guys.

[Duke of Earl]

You can get letro from the board sponsor......trib (5g ED) works well for me on Test E

good luck bro

[Consistency]

HCG will bring the boys back to normal for sure

[almostgone]

.... 100 mg EOD seems about right...
Thanks for the advice so far, guys.

You'll have more stable blood levels and less sides with ED injections, and I'd go at least 75mg ED....JMO, but good luck .....