Why not use prop to bulk? heres the deal I am very gyno prone and prop seems the best test to take in my position with 20mg of nolva daily. +tren
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Why not use prop to bulk? heres the deal I am very gyno prone and prop seems the best test to take in my position with 20mg of nolva daily. +tren
Theres no reason it won't be as good as Enth or Cyp... It does hit faster.
People recommend a longer ester like the above two for a first cycle (which is usually a bulker) because theres injections 2x per week instead of 7
I've ran prop, cypionate, and tren before, but I have gyno from puberty and until I can get the **** no good glands removed I need as little estrogen as I can. I wish you did'nt need test in a cycle but you do so prop seems the best for me. I don't mind the injections ed and Also like prop because of the low bloat.
IMO you can't bulk with prop unless you use insane daily dosages. That's not what it's for. You'll gain quality lean muscle mass however, which will look better if you already have some size.Quote:
Originally Posted by ddoublevision
I like to compare prop with tren. Although they don't have many similarities, they both yield the same type of gains. Quality muscle with little to no water retention.
Just my 2 cents.
What would you suggest for a very gyno prone individual? Test cypionate 600 mg a week with nolva 120,000mg a week?+tren
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddoublevision
Are you being ironic? :rolleyes:
If your a gyno prone individual you can do any cycle you want combined with nolva, proviron, clomid, arimidex, etc...etc
There's always a way. :cool:
personally i feel that prop is a great AAS to bulk. Im actually using it for my first cycle now and im two weeks into it today and have gained 8lbs. all of it being lean. Ive got veins popping out of my arms like crazy now. I personally think its a great AAS if you want to gain at most 20lbs. This does depend on the diet you are on and how hard you train, cardio included. The only downside is that the ed injections can be a bytch. But do whatever you like, cuz i would recommend it. Maybe add some Eq with it to get a little bit more. Im using Winstrol at the end of my cycle to cut up and completely dry me out, joints included <---unfortunately. Do as you like bro.
Well I run everything with tren and was thinking of a prop, tren, winny cycle but I have decided to try dnp and cut out the winny.
QUESTION: WHAT would be better for the gyno prone me?
20mg nolva ed throughout cycle + pct
OR!!!
10mg nolva weeks 1-10 and 20mgs during pct + 25 mg proviron weeks 1-10
just try 10mg/ed of nolva then if you think you can use more then you can bump to 20mg/ed. ya 22mg during pct should be good enough
should I have proviron on hand?? or just the nolva
I know the standard protocol - but my case is'nt really standard
proviron u can have on hand, but you shouldnt need to take unless you feel the need to. i would just use the nolva tho. i think you should be fine
i used prop at 700mgs a week for my first cycle and i gained around 30-35lbs. i went from around 190-195 to 225. i ate like a mofo.. i am 3 weeks into pct and i am down to 215 and holding strong so tech i gained 15-20lbs from it. i liked it but ed injections are a mutha sometimes
Quote:
Originally Posted by hung-solo
How long did you run it Solo?
if your that gyno prone why not run an AI the whole time? try letrozole @1.25mg every day combined with your nolva, should clear up most of the bloat and destroy any excessive gyno from the AAS.
And prop can be used to bulk just as, if not more effectively than enanthate, or other logn esters. No matter what way you look at it, the hormone is what helps with muscle mass not the ester. Sure each ester has its benefits and drawbacks, but all in all, testosterone is testosterone once its active in your blood!
Ed injects aren't bad if you roatate sites. I use my quads, calfs, delts, biceps, glutes, and traps. that makes for 12 sites, so i basically hit each site once every 2 weeks. Not so bad
Luckily, i got good Stuff, BD prop so im only spot injecting in three places for a rotation. Glutes, delts, and quads. I have no problem with it at all. i go 75mg/ed. a good recommendation for ed shooting for a first time is that i take a really hot shower, then once out of the shower stretch for about ten minutes. this way the muscle tissue is warm and loosened. after inject i massage the area all over for like 5 minutes. no pains so far.
wow hung-solo thats nice gains, once you dropped to 215 were they all hard lean gains? since im only two weeks into mine how vascular looking did you get. did you notice more veins bulging? being only two weeks i have already got tons of veins coming through my arms. what i really want tho is veins out from my abs. thats why im using winstrol at the last 6 weeks to help out with drying me out. let me know hung how it all worked out for ya.
i like to reserve prop for cutting cycles and enanth for bulkers. but i see no reason why prop couldn't yeild good results when stacked properly. as for the nolv, i'd to 20 mg ed just ot be safe. the fact that you are gyno prone should be enough reason to cover all of your bases. make sure to take bromo or b6 for the tren too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toenail Juice Z
This couldnt be more inaccurate. You say prop isnt for bulking then what exactly is it for? Test is test regardless of the ester when it comes to the science portion of the argument. Prop per ml is 72% test whereas Enanthate is 62% test therefore meaning that 100mg of Prop ed is more overall test per week than 500mg of Test E (typical standard doses).
You said that you will gain quality mass from prop. Why would anyone not want to gain quality mass regardless of bulk or cut? This logic is assanine to me. You can use Test E gain 25lbs and 15lbs is of muscle whereas you could easily gain a solid quality 20lbs from prop without that sh*tty bloated look and let down of weight during PCT that comes from Test E.
You compare Prop to Tren? Have you ever used tren? Trying to compare the two compounds is like saying Creatine has the same effects as AAS. It couldnt be further from the truth. Tren has the most incredible pumps, strength gains, size increases, and overall feeling of invincibility that Test cant begin to match. Chemically these two compounds are far from similar as you alluded.
Good to hear someone else is doing prop for a first cycle.
Prop or tren is all I have access to, so for now, a prop only cycle is what I have planned for my first go 'round sometime next year.
Prop is 84% test, I believe cyp is 72%.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheChosenOne
Only reason I wouldn't: it hurts! I'm only using it again to cut...and the ED injects aren't great fun either IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by ddoublevision
Quote:
Originally Posted by joevette
I guess we were both slightly off on our percentages.Quote:
Originally Posted by BassKiller
Prop doesnt have to hurt. I cant understand why some make their prop with so much BA. Prop can be made just as painless as EQ/Test E/Deca etc. I used prop everyday in the same injection spot for 12 weeks this summer. Yeah I know probably stupid not to rotate injection spots because the scar tissue on my ass is ridiculous, but it was pain free so I didnt care at the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeremy34
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddoublevision
Proviron won't do any harm to your gains. In fact it will improve them since it is an androgen. It also helps IMO to keep the wate retention down, and improve muscle hardness. IMO it's a must to take with (during) any cycle, whether bulking or cutting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheChosenOne
If you had read my post more carefully, you would have understood.
BTW, what I higlighted in bold should answer you questions without the need for me to write anything further. :rolleyes:
Here I go again :wg:
IMO you can't bulk with prop unless you use insane daily dosages (Testoviron for example only contains 50mg/ml)That's not what it's for. You'll gain quality lean muscle mass however, which will look better if you already have some size.
I like to compare prop with tren. Although they don't have many similarities (Compound Wise) , they both yield the same type of gains. (and I never said the exact same gains. :lol: ) Quality muscle with little to no water retention.
Do I have to spell everything out for ****s sake? Don't just read beyond the lines. It's an ignorant attitude! :p
And yes, I have used tren, so i'm also talking from MY personal experience which can differ from person to person!