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  1. #1
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    First journey to the other side!

    Hey all, here is my first cycle. I've been researching for roughly the past 2-3 years looking at different ideas, gaining knowledge and all that good ****. I have been lifting hard for the past 6-7 years since high school and am now 21. During this time I have increased all my lifts dramatically (bench up to 315 or so).

    I lift four days a week (Sun-legs, Mon-chest, Wed-back/shoulders/traps, Fri-arms) and do cardio the other 3. Also train abs Tues and Sat. I have used 1-AD and M-1T before with good results. I am roughly at 9-10% bf, 5'11", 190-195ish. I can see the top two abs pretty well, but the stubborn bottom two and love handles are givin me ****.

    My goal with my first cycle is to put on a little lean mass, but really to cut down a few bf % while keeping the muscle. With that in mind, here it is....


    Weeks 1-12 Test Enan 250 (Quality Vet) 50mg/ew (250 mg Mon-250 mg Thurs)

    Weeks 8-12 Stan (Winny) (Quality Vet) tabs (10 mg) 50 mg/ed

    Weeks 1-12 Nolva 10 mg/ed

    PCT
    Weeks 14-17 Nolva 20 mg/ed
    Weeks 14-17 Clomid (separate dosing schedule)
    Weeks 12-13, 16-17 Clen (start at 10 mg and work up from there)

    Cost
    3 vials of Test E = $116.10 after 10% discount
    200 caps of Winny = $243 after discount
    100 tabs of Clen = $67.50 after discount
    60 tabs Nolva = $72 after discount
    72 tabs of Clomid = $94.50 after discount

    Just under $600 total...what do you guys think?

    What do you guys think? I've got my source lined up (worked with him before) so I know he's legit. Just waiting for my student loan to come in ;0

    If there's interest, I'll keep an on-line log. If you guys want anything else, let me know. Also, thanks to everyone for helpin out and adding their .02 worth in my previous threads.
    Last edited by jlardinois; 12-15-2004 at 10:37 AM.

  2. #2
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
    Mesomorphyl is offline Smart Ass Member
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    Change winny to 10-14 and run right up to pct.

  3. #3
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    I was thinking, it would be cheaper to get the Liquid Clen from ARR for only $60 (30 mL 200 mcg/mL) for the 4 total weeks I'd be on Clen.

  4. #4
    Ejuicer's Avatar
    Ejuicer is offline Anabolic Member
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    If you're trying to add muscle mass do it in one cycle. If you're trying to take off bf do it in another. I dont like the idea of combining bulking and cutting cycles.
    You should take advantage of your first cycle and try to get the best results possible with bulking up imo.
    I would take the extra bf off with some cardio, diet and maybe some clen and use your first cycle on a test only bulker.

  5. #5
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    EJuicer...it isn't a big deal if I gain muscle mass. I'd like to stay rougly around the same weight while shredding up. In my second cycle, I want to focus on gaining more lean body mass. I have my priority straight and know what I want to look like. Not trying to sound pig-headed, but maybe I didn't explain my goal correctly which wouldn't be the first time. I already have pretty good size for my frame, height, and bf %.

  6. #6
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    I also decided that I will order 2 bottles of Tamox, 2 bottles of Clomid, and 1 bottle of Clen for my cycle from ***** to help support the boards.

  7. #7
    Ejuicer's Avatar
    Ejuicer is offline Anabolic Member
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    If dropping a few % bf and maintaining muscle mass is all the you are trying to do you can easily accomplish it with diet, cardio and clen . Clen is anti-catabolic and will help you hold on to lean muscle mass while dieting.
    You would be better off using that approach and saving the juice for bulking when you are ready for it.

  8. #8
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    Good point, but I thought it was widely understood that a Test cycle was great (obviously) for retaining muscle while cutting.

  9. #9
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    I know a lot of other people who were looking to cut up and add lean body mass with the same cycle on these boards and the consenus is that this is a great cycle for this goal. I am not a famed "newbee" but I am relatively new to actively posting instead of just reading. Thanks EJuicer.

  10. #10
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
    Mesomorphyl is offline Smart Ass Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlardinois
    Good point, but I thought it was widely understood that a Test cycle was great (obviously) for retaining muscle while cutting.
    it is and 400-500mg is a decent dose. diet will be key, cardio and clen are nice to have also, and get some l-dex or letrozole to keep estrogen at bay with your nolva as well. You have done some research. good job

  11. #11
    Ejuicer's Avatar
    Ejuicer is offline Anabolic Member
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    It is, but why waste your first cycle which will most likely merit the best gains of any cycle you will do when you can just save it and do an all out bulker when you're prepared.
    You are also already at a low bf % so it wont be that hard to take off a couple % bf since you're not exactly going to have to take off a lot anyways. Clen would easily do the trick.

  12. #12
    bmwrob is offline Member
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    Good choice. I am aslo a low-dose guy who has great results (Of course not as good or as big as high-doses, but that is not how I wanna look either). Stick to your guns and go for it.

  13. #13
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    I appreciate all the advice and input. Concering L-dex/Letrozole ...I heard that there were a bunch of high risk sides and that it shouldn't really be used unless absolutely necessary. I remember reading a pretty big thread on it somewhere, I'll try to find it..have you heard about this?

  14. #14
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    bump..anymore comments?

  15. #15
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
    Mesomorphyl is offline Smart Ass Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlardinois
    I appreciate all the advice and input. Concering L-dex/Letrozole...I heard that there were a bunch of high risk sides and that it shouldn't really be used unless absolutely necessary. I remember reading a pretty big thread on it somewhere, I'll try to find it..have you heard about this?
    they are anti aromatise, which stops conversion by aromatise into estrogen, you might want to start these a week ahead of schedule to build up levels. I have heard nothing that bad about any of these, if you like go proviron .

  16. #16
    jlardinois is offline Junior Member
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    One more thing...I'm thiking about going to Prop instead of Enan. I've been debating this for a long time...obviously, the difference is every day shots. Is it THAT much more painful than Enan shots and how much more difficult does it get to stick yourself in the last few weeks (10-12) with scar tissue from prop compared to enan?

    Winny will stay the same regardless but PCT and Clen may be moved up obviously if I switch to Prop. Gimme feedback please.

  17. #17
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
    Mesomorphyl is offline Smart Ass Member
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    First timer stick with e, or cyp. Also, are you saying the winny will stay the same in your timeline? It can help while your test levels are dropping to do stanzolol up to pct. And add an AI even if it is proviron .

  18. #18
    GREENMACHINE's Avatar
    GREENMACHINE is offline Are you green enough?
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    yOU ONLY NEED 36 CLOMID UNLESS THEY ARE ONLY 25MG.
    YOU NEED TO RUN NOLVA THROUGHOUT.

    Quote Originally Posted by , here it is....

    Weeks 14-17 Nolva 20 mg/ed
    Weeks 14-17 Clomid (separate dosing schedule)
    Weeks 12-13, 16-17 Clen (start at 10 mg and work up from there)

    [U
    Cost[/U]
    3 vials of Test E = $116.10 after 10% discount
    200 caps of Winny = $243 after discount
    100 tabs of Clen = $67.50 after discount
    60 tabs Nolva = $72 after discount
    72 tabs of Clomid = $94.50 after discount

    .

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