Originally Posted by The Baron
That's just dumb. Don't mess with winny. Don't mess with clen. Don't bother with ECA. You don't need it. Count your total calories and total grams of protein and slowly reduce total calories until you lose a pound per week. Adjust calories as necessary.
At 17, you should have just lurked here for a couple of years, absorbing knowledge. Then you could have stealthily milked all the accumulated wisdom and expertise to be found on the board, and by the time you are 30 or so, and ready for gear, you would know your stuff backwards and forwards. Now, it is likely you will be banned.
Nobody wants to hear this at your age. It sounds paternalistic and elitist. But you should not be using ANY illegal chemicals. The only good thing I can think of about the steroid control act is it is all inclusive, and all you have to do is avoid any illegal substance and it is unlikely that you will do very much harm to your body.
Anyone who uses gear before age 25 or so should have their head examined. Your testosterone is already through the roof, 3 times as high as mine is now, at 46. When you use AAS, your natural production is shut down. Part of your gear is simply replacing what the gear itself stopped. When you cycle off, it takes several weeks at minimum to recover, and in that time you have essentially zero testosterone, for practical purposes. If you don't know what you are doing, recovery can take months. So you used illegal drugs that could have landed you in jail and cost you a lot of money and exposed you to public censure and social pariah-hood and needless health risks and possible career limitations later in life, to shut down your natural production of free, legal, safe, private testosterone, in an effort to gain the appearance that you could have gotten naturally, with the gear (your own testosterone) that you THREW AWAY.
Clen can be dangerous stuff! I am talking DEADLY here! If you don't know WTF you are doing, you can find yourself walking around on the verge of heat exhaustion. BP will rise, body temp will rise, you will lose sleep and have uncontrollable tremors. Do you want that? ECA has a milder effect in the usual doses, but you can still get heat exhaustion if you are active in warm weather. Oh, I forgot about the cramps... they can be nasty.
Bottom line...
(1) You are too young.
(2) You don't have a clue yet as to how to use this stuff.
Address both areas of want before you consider messing with this stuff.