First Cycle - Small Bulk/Cut - Possibly Primo/Winstrol

[Cmore]

I am a 24 year old recent college graduate. I have played sports all my life and have stayed in fairly decent shape. I have been lifting for approximately 10 years. I am 5'8", weigh around 135 pounds, and have 11% body fat. I still play ball most all year round and continue lifting, but have not been able to move beyond the plateau I have reached. I would like to put on 10-15 pounds of lean, ripped muscle. I am trying to determine what type(s) and cycle would be best for me. So far I have narrowed it down, but not limited it to, Primobolan and Winstrol . I am looking for something that will give those 10-15 pounds, with the least amount of side effects. I do not want to bulk up much, just a little, so I am hoping smaller doses of some lesser potent type(s) will do the trick. So far this is the cycle that I have put together, but as I am not very experienced or necessarily knowledgeable, please give any input and assistance:

Primobolan Winstrol Clomid
Week 1: 100 mg
Week 2: 100 mg 150 mg
Week 3: 100 mg 150 mg
Week 4: 100 mg 150 mg
Week 5: 100 mg 150 mg
Week 6: 100 mg 150 mg
Week 7: 100 mg 150 mg
Week 8: 150 mg
Week 9: 100 mg/day
Week 10: 50 mg/day


Most places advise a 2 - 3 week Clomid use, most of the time 3. With a smaller cycle, and smaller doses of less potent types, is the Clomid needed, and if so, would as much be needed? I eat healthy and already eat 6-7 smaller meals a day and snack in between. I will of course be upping this to make sure I take in enough calories and protein. I also am interested in possibly a pure Winny cycle, but would like to know if that is enough to get the results I am interested in. If there is any more information I have left out or whatnot, let me know. Any help and comments are welcomed and appreciated. Thanks.

[kman]

Test

[kman]

stick around here for awhile and research, and when you think you got it research some more. Sorry to be such an ass, but if I had known what I do now, when I started I would have gained a ton, my first cycle..

[longhorn814]

youve been lifting for 10 years and only weigh 135 lbs? You need a much more solid base before touching gear. Since you say you dont want to bulk up much, just eat more. You say you eat 6-7 times a day, but do you actually know how many calories you eat everyday? You need to count them. If you want to pack on weight, diet is way more important than whatever aas you take. You could easily put on 10-15 just by eating 4-5K clean calories a day for a few months. Besides the cycle you laid out isnt very good. For primo to be effective you really need to do at least 500mg/wk, probably more and Winny should be 50mg everyday. A good first cycle when youre ready would be 500mg/wk of test e for 10-12 weeks. I would definitely work on your diet some more first. Go checkout the stickies in the diet forum, they will help a lot

[anabolicbruce]

Bro, everyone is going to tell you to take test. You can achieve your goals with minimal sides taking low androgenic /mild anabolics.(as long as diet is in order!) scrap the strol and stick with primo at 200mgs/week adding in 20mgs anavar and 100mcgs clen the last 6 weeks. Add in the pct and train hard, you WILL see results. (my avatar is me on anavar/clen/HGh) it can be done!!!

[anabolicbruce]

youve been lifting for 10 years and only weigh 135 lbs? You need a much more solid base before touching gear. Since you say you dont want to bulk up much, just eat more. You say you eat 6-7 times a day, but do you actually know how many calories you eat everyday? You need to count them. If you want to pack on weight, diet is way more important than whatever aas you take. You could easily put on 10-15 just by eating 4-5K clean calories a day for a few months. Besides the cycle you laid out isnt very good. For primo to be effective you really need to do at least 500mg/wk, probably more and Winny should be 50mg everyday. A good first cycle when youre ready would be 500mg/wk of test e for 10-12 weeks. I would definitely work on your diet some more first. Go checkout the stickies in the diet forum, they will help a lot

Like Longhorn said, it really is all about the diet. Get this in order before you do anything!

[kman]

Bro, everyone is going to tell you to take test. You can achieve your goals with minimal sides taking low androgenic/mild anabolics.(as long as diet is in order!) scrap the strol and stick with primo at 200mgs/week adding in 20mgs anavar and 100mcgs clen the last 6 weeks. Add in the pct and train hard, you WILL see results. (my avatar is me on anavar/clen/HGh) it can be done!!!

What can be done?, imagine how you would have looked it you used some prop in that cycle. Bad advice for a newbie, His first cycle he can gain so much, and you steer him away from test. Do you want him to go limp?

[Cmore]

Yes, I've been lifting for 10 years and only weigh 135 pounds. Genetics play a big role. My entire family is built very lean and I have a hard time putting on weight, no matter what my exercise/eating routine is. I have tried vitamin supplements, creatine, and several other mass/weight gainers. None have worked. Working out 3-4 days a week for 1.5-2 hours each workout, plus eating lots of calories and protein, the most weight I ever reached was 140. My metabolism is very very high, so my body burns most of what I eat even with me sitting still. Thanks for the replies and advice. Just giving more information so that the information I receive back can continue to be good.

[anabolicbruce]

What can be done?, imagine how you would have looked it you used some prop in that cycle. Bad advice for a newbie, His first cycle he can gain so much, and you steer him away from test. Do you want him to go limp?

I would never steer anyone in the wrong direction. I work at an HRT clinic and have blood results to prove minimal HPTA shutdown in low dose lw androgen steroid administration. Although everyone is different, MOST people can achieve a lean athstetic physique with minimal sides using this method. Just my opinion.

[kman]

I would never steer anyone in the wrong direction. I work at an HRT clinic and have blood results to prove minimal HPTA shutdown in low dose lw androgen steroid administration. Although everyone is different, MOST people can achieve a lean athstetic physique with minimal sides using this method. Just my opinion.

Telling a newbie to take 100mcgs of clen for 6 weeks is bad advice IMO.

[kman]

Yes, I've been lifting for 10 years and only weigh 135 pounds. Genetics play a big role. My entire family is built very lean and I have a hard time putting on weight, no matter what my exercise/eating routine is. I have tried vitamin supplements, creatine, and several other mass/weight gainers. None have worked. Working out 3-4 days a week for 1.5-2 hours each workout, plus eating lots of calories and protein, the most weight I ever reached was 140. My metabolism is very very high, so my body burns most of what I eat even with me sitting still. Thanks for the replies and advice. Just giving more information so that the information I receive back can continue to be good.

I would take Longhorn's advice. DIET...Get a good PWO drink consisting of dex. and whey protien. If you do cycle 10-12 wks of test enth. would be ideal.

[anabolicbruce]

Telling a newbie to take 100mcgs of clen for 6 weeks is bad advice IMO.

Your, right bro. Just stating what I used. starting with 25mcgs and moving to 50mcgs after identifying your tolerance would be the smarter way to go. Thanks for the correction.

[longhorn814]

since you have such a hard time gaining weight, you definitely need to run test to put on some weight. That will give you the 10-15 lbs you want w/ proper PCT. It really comes down to diet though. Primo and winny probably wouldnt give you much weight either.

[kman]

Your, right bro. Just stating what I used. starting with 25mcgs and moving to 50mcgs after identifying your tolerance would be the smarter way to go. Thanks for the correction.

No problem bro, lookin swole in the avatar to...

[DrugsrGood]

Yes, I've been lifting for 10 years and only weigh 135 pounds. Genetics play a big role.

There is no possible way your genetics are stopping you at 135.

[Cmore]

My genetics are not stopping me there. Not completely. I did make it to 140, but to gain even that small amount was very hard. I know it's not easy, not looking for an easy way, but I believe a light/small/less potent, whatever you want to call it, cycle would give me the extra boost I have been looking for. I am interested in gaining those pounds, but I am also looking for types that have fewer or fewest side effects. Generally when I am in the best shape, weightlifting makes me cut like hell and I gain very little size. Part of this is due to my body type and part due to my weight lifting program and routine. I need something to let me gain some size, but retain the ripped/cut like hell look, yet bigger...
Thanks to everyone who has posted and given advice. This is great. If anyone has sample cycles/types they suggest for me, please add those as well. As you can see from my first example cycle, being a newbie, I haven't the best ideas for a cycle.

[longhorn814]

do you eat like this in the following thread?

UNoffical "How to Bulk" thread and sample diet...

My guess is probably not likely. Eat like this and you'll gain weight. I can not stress enough how important diet is. The side effects from test are very minimal at moderate doses for most people too

[Cmore]

Anabolicbruce, you suggested Anavar . I looked into it and it sounds good as well, at least from what I have read so far. What do you and anyone else think of this type of cycle:

Primobolan for 7 weeks at 200 mg/week
Anavar for 7 weeks at 20 mg/day

Or should it be more weeks? Also should both be started at the same time and for the same length of time? Would recommend Clomid to finish up? 300 mg 1 day after finishing, then 100 mg/day for a week and then drop to 50 mg/day for the last week?
Thanks again.

[anabolicbruce]

Anabolicbruce, you suggested Anavar . I looked into it and it sounds good as well, at least from what I have read so far. What do you and anyone else think of this type of cycle:

Primobolan for 7 weeks at 200 mg/week
Anavar for 7 weeks at 20 mg/day

Or should it be more weeks? Also should both be started at the same time and for the same length of time? Would recommend Clomid to finish up? 300 mg 1 day after finishing, then 100 mg/day for a week and then drop to 50 mg/day for the last week?
Thanks again.

IMO I would run the Primo for 10 weeks and the var for the last 6. But PLEASE get the diet in tune. High protein, low glycemic, with healthy fats. The fat will be a good way to increase the calories. Use Flax, almonds, natural PB. 4 years ago I was 180lbs and now I am close to 230 at 8%. Diet was 90% of acheiving this. I only use anabolics when preparing for a show. Make goals for yourself and think longterm, when the cycle ends your gains do not have to end. Eat like a machine!

[Cmore]

Anyone have some suggested sites that have lists of high protein/high calorie foods, or any good diets to use? I have the one that was posted a couple replies earlier, any other suggestions? Thanks.

[judge_dread]

Man Primo at 100mgs is a waste of money, u must up the dose at 300mgs for 10 weeks and Anavar 20mgs ED for 6 weeks...Run proper PCT 1,5-2 weeks after last Primo shot (Nolva would be pretty ok for a cycle like that).U may as an other bro suggested run some Clen too at the end.I am sure this will give u lean muscle gains.
P.S Diet has to be good too...80% is diet 10%workin out and 10% roids.

[***xxx***]

u don t need no steroids , u need to start eating! go to the diet forum. even my dog is bigger than u. **** and all he gets is twice a day MEAT!