how to eat while on the following cycle...

**dazbo** · 04-23-2005, 11:16 AM

Hi

I am going to be starting my second cycle of the below -

wk 1-10 = Test Prop @ 150mg EOD
wk 3-10 = BD VAR @ 40mg ED
PCT will be clomid and nolva starting 3 days after last shot.

I may also be including the Clen that I have during the cycle.

My question is, my stats are -

age 23
weight 195lbs
BF approx 12%
height 5'10"
Arms 18"
waist 30"
anything else ?!??

I plan on dropping my BF to single digits, while also increasing as much muscle mass as possible - especially LBM. Vascularity and strength would also be good to go up !

So, what type of diet would i need to have to achieve the above ?? Just basic cal amounts and macronutrient details will do but details would be great.

My maintenance calorie level is approx 3900cals but I am not sure whether, while on this cycle, I can increase my cals to ABOVE maintenance, whilst STILL LOSING BODYFAT.

thanks

Darren

**SwoleCat** · 04-23-2005, 11:40 AM

U want fries w/that?

Seriously, visit the diet forum and spend some time reading/researching before you begin anything, as diet HAS TO BE #1.

~SC~

**dazbo** · 04-23-2005, 01:56 PM

I was hoping I'd have a good answer from you of all people SC !!!

**dazbo** · 04-23-2005, 02:26 PM

Didnt realise you had some more writing after the smiley face !! lol

Anyway, I beleive I know enough about diet to sort out the nutritional needs I might need while on this cycle - especially considering I dont work in that field (Although would like to). The problem is, I am NOT SURE of the nutritional amounts that I will need. Once I do, I can sort out my foods and plan when and what to eat etc from there. I find the diet forum plans are aimed too much on particular foods that I would be unlikely to eat/be able to eat and a lot of the stuff is american brand names which I dont know what they are as I live in the UK.

So, if you can help me out then I would appreciate it SC. Thanks

**dazbo** · 04-23-2005, 05:17 PM

bump

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 10:59 AM

im starting to lose faith in these steroid .com forums now!!

**AandF6969** · 04-24-2005, 11:11 AM

You pay a nutritionist/dietician to write customized diets for you.

OR

You come up with your own proposed diet and have us critique it for free.

It's like that.

A 40/40/20% of Calories from Carb/Protein/Fat ratio is a good rule of thumb to start off with.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/berardi41.htm
http://www.ntwrks.com/~mikev/chart1.html
http://www.fitday.com

**FrkyBgStok** · 04-24-2005, 11:38 AM

i am sorry you are losing faith, but we are here to help you, not do everything for you. SC is right.

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 12:01 PM

my diet, as I have stated in other posts, consists of the 40:40:20 ratio with around 300g of prot and 2900 cals - this is at the moment, off cycle trying to cut a little.

The question I am asking, and Im not being lazy, is how should things change whilst on the var/prop cycle in order to gain as much LBM as possible whiole dropping my fat % into single digits ???

Pleeeeeaase!

thanks

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 02:08 PM

bump - just what do you guys do while doing the above ??????

**Thegr8One** · 04-24-2005, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by SwoleCat

U want fries w/that?

Seriously, visit the diet forum and spend some time reading/researching before you begin anything, as diet HAS TO BE #1.

~SC~

tottaly agree there's alot of awesome info in the diet forum and you can get many more views there as well

**Dj Reversal** · 04-24-2005, 02:11 PM

throw some fina in there and just eat clean... i think if your keeping your ratio's like that, and seperating your fats and carbs you will lose weight.
I am probably going to run 3000 calories on my cycle. im not looking to put on alot of mass, but maybe some quality muscle, get hard, shredded, and vascular.

Fina
Prop
Eq
Var
masteron

Mark

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 02:32 PM

Thanks mark for a better reply. Noone seems to listen!! arrggghh !!

Anyway, so if you're going to be eating 3000 cals and NOT wanting to put on too much mass, maybe if I eat, say 4000cals which is slightly above maintenance, but not too much so as to gain any fat and not have the cutting properties I want.

I must admit, Ive never seperated my fats from carbs as Ive never seen any evidence of it working any diff to not doing so, BUT, I think I may rearrange my diet so I can do this and see how it goes. I understand why (Blood sugar increase from carbs with fat intake can cause fat storage etc) and it kind of makes sense in theory so I guess its worth a try.

Ive never really looked into fina but I will check that out now.

thank you for your help

Darren

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 02:35 PM

Just found out that fina is to prevent hair loss. Is there a reason why you would say include that mark ?? My last cycle of sus/deca /dbol I never had any hair loss probs from that. Dont get me wrong, I really dont want it, but unless you think I have a good chance of losing hair from this cycle then let me know!

I thought Var was mild on the hair loss and didnt think prop was much of a prob compared to others.

Thanks

**heckler45_2000** · 04-24-2005, 02:54 PM

Bro cutting while on cycle Ive had some good results on a CKD diet. I believe you should look into it hope this helps.

**thick one** · 04-24-2005, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by dazbo

Just found out that fina is to prevent hair loss. Is there a reason why you would say include that mark ?? My last cycle of sus/deca /dbol I never had any hair loss probs from that. Dont get me wrong, I really dont want it, but unless you think I have a good chance of losing hair from this cycle then let me know!

I thought Var was mild on the hair loss and didnt think prop was much of a prob compared to others.

Thanks

fina=tren "fina"steride is used to decrease dht-hairloss

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 03:21 PM

thanks guys

**dazbo** · 04-24-2005, 04:26 PM

right Ive read all of this - http://www.thinkmuscle.com/articles/...genic-diet.htm

Sounds pretty good so I am going to put it into practice. I will do 5 days extremely low carbs and then 2 days really high carbs. I will keep my training the same rather than changing to their recommended training. Hopefully it wont effect strength increase too much.

I will try to make sure Im getting around 3200cals per day on days 1-5. day 1-5 will also work out at around 375 grams protein, 200g carbs, 100g fats (50:20:30 prot:carbs:fat cal % approx). Days 6-7 will work out at approx 4350cals, 750g carbs,225g prot, 50g fat.

This way, I will get an average of just over 3500cals per day which is slightly below maintenance.

Ideally I would have liked to have my avg cals per day around 4000cals but I cant figure out how I can do that whilst keeping to really low carbs during the week - without having to try to include too much fat??? I dont have any probs with lots of fat but I dont know what foods I could eat that would allow me to have a high fat content while also having protein. Nuts is all I can think of but thats not really gonna make a meal ?!!!

If someone can make sense of the above - can they let me know what they think please ??

thanks

**dazbo** · 04-25-2005, 02:18 AM

bump

**dazbo** · 04-26-2005, 11:53 AM

so im not going to get any help am i ............

**longhorn814** · 04-26-2005, 12:01 PM

read the diet forum bro, lots of good advice there. The best way to learn is to try it yourself and see what works. Everybody's bodies are different so you need to customize your diet to what works best for you. What works for one person wont always work for another. Cardio will be important for dropping bf into single digits too

**ChefJ** · 04-26-2005, 12:14 PM

What else do you want to know??

**biggen** · 04-26-2005, 12:19 PM

yeah you can figure this one out for yourself good luck

**dazbo** · 04-26-2005, 02:15 PM

Heres the question I have then, try to put it simple if I can -

While using VAR, I know you can have a calorie deficit and still grow a little and lose BF, BUT, I want to gain not just a little, but a fair bit of LBM if possible - hence the addition of prop EOD. So, would I be wasting the prop (Which is there primarily to increase mass) IF I consume less than Maintenance cals, or will I still grow enough if Im on less than maintenance calories ??

Basically, I dont know how much the two will allow me to grow. My very first cycle was a V.Low dose of prop/deca for 10 weeks and although I consumed over 5000cals the majority of it, I only gained BF, and now that Ive dieted down to drop that BF, I weigh exactly what I weighed before the cycle. So basically I gained nothing from that one. I DONT want that to happen again though - so thats why Im worried about how much to eat.

**longhorn814** · 04-26-2005, 02:26 PM

you want us to take the cycle for you too?

Seriously, it sounds like you should spend more time figuring out a diet that works for you before taking more gear. Spend more time in the diet forum, but like I said what works for one person wont necessarily work for someone else. Trying to bulk and cut at the same time is very difficult. Pick one or the other

**AandF6969** · 04-26-2005, 02:29 PM

Trial and error is the best way... if you can gain LBM on maintenance calories, great, if not, then up the cals a little bit until you are gaining.

**dazbo** · 04-26-2005, 02:30 PM

thats it I give up !!

Thanks for the replies so far though. Ill just do what ever I think is best. Ill consume around 4500 cals per day, keeping carbs los as possible and only having them PWO. That way, I dont think I can go wrong keeping my meals prot/fat only. I know what diet works for me to cut, Ive been doing it off cycle for the past couple of months with great results to the point I now have my 6 pack back !!!

Anyway, Ill let you know how the cycle goes when Ive finished it - I start it on the 9th May for 10 wks - test prop 150mg EOD and VAR@ 40mg per day.

Thanks

Darren