How long does it take to HPTA...

I was wondering are there any guidelines on how long does it take to HPTA to return to normal. Specifically I was wondering that are there any indirect means of finding out when this has happened. I dont know if there are any good indicators but if there are some I would like to hear them (and how reliable is the info they give). I am aware of the fact that there prolly isnt any very reliable methods but maybe something that would hint you sumin..

Oh yeah, maybe this should've gone to PCT section ??

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Originally Posted by stupidhippo

I was wondering are there any guidelines on how long does it take to HPTA to return to normal. Specifically I was wondering that are there any indirect means of finding out when this has happened. I dont know if there are any good indicators but if there are some I would like to hear them (and how reliable is the info they give). I am aware of the fact that there prolly isnt any very reliable methods but maybe something that would hint you sumin..

Oh yeah, maybe this should've gone to PCT section ??

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Well, you should have blood work done.

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Originally Posted by stupidhippo

I was wondering are there any guidelines on how long does it take to HPTA to return to normal. Specifically I was wondering that are there any indirect means of finding out when this has happened. I dont know if there are any good indicators but if there are some I would like to hear them (and how reliable is the info they give). I am aware of the fact that there prolly isnt any very reliable methods but maybe something that would hint you sumin..

Oh yeah, maybe this should've gone to PCT section ??

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varies considerably. generally with good PCT 4-6weeks. Though in cases of nandrolone suppression there have been recoveries, documented clinically, taking up to 13 months.

as a further note- nandrolone is quite chemically similar to the drug used to chemically castrate sex offenders.

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Originally Posted by macrophage69alpha

as a further note- nandrolone is quite chemically similar to the drug used to chemically castrate sex offenders.

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that's scary. i don't like the sound of that at all.

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Originally Posted by punchrf

that's scary. i don't like the sound of that at all.

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its only a little scary. it is a point made to indicate that nandrolone, which is often looked upon as one of the more benign steroids has the potential for severe suppression of the HPTA and impairment of sex drive (not to the extent of chemical castration, but the mechanism and binding underlying are similar).

many people use deca, etc, without too much issue but it has the potential to cause gyno (even with aromatase inhibitor and SERMS), severe HPTA issues and sexual impairment. most users (from reports definitely more than 50%) do experience these sides to one extent or another, its just not severe in most of them.

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Originally Posted by Georgie

Well, you should have blood work done.

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Yeah but not an option for me where I live, thats why asked for any indirect methods. Nandrolone screwing up the HPTA axis that bad?? Kinda makes you think about dropping the deca...

Any one know more on nandrolone effecting the HPTA (the mechanisms etc.. y it so potentially harmful?)

Well i saw on tv a doctor he is an expert on steroids and he said that it takes about 6 months for the hormon system to return to normal after a cycle.

Can T levels be restored in former anabolic steroid users?

The Study: Two hypogonadal former anabolic steroid users were studied. Normal levels of LH are >3.6 IU/L and Testosterone are 300-1000 ng/dl. Former anabolic steroid users often have suppressed levels of both.

The Results: Subject #1 is a 6', 206lb former user of 500-2000+ grams per week of anabolics. His baseline numbers were: LH<1IU/L, Test=191ng/dl. This suject underwent a 32 day treatment of 2500 IU of HCG every 4 days, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. 15 days after treatment his numbers were: LH=5.2IU/L, Test=1072 ng/dl.

Subject #2 is a 5'10", 184lb male who used 400 mg per week of nandrolone. His baseline numbers were: LH<1IU/L, Test=45ng/dl. This subject's 32 day treatment consisted of 2500 IU of HCG every 4 days, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. There was no change. He underwent another treatment consisting of 60 days of 5000 IU of HCG every 4 days for 4 injections, then 2500 IU every 4 days for 4 injections, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. Still, no change. For the next 32 days, this subject received 5000 IU of HCG every other day for 6 injections, then 2500 IU every other day for 6 injections given with 150 IU of menotropins, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex 2 times per day. 15 days after treatment his numbers were: LH=9.8IU/L, Test=507 ng/dl.(20)

Comments: The authors of this paper have presented some very interesting data that the medical community needs to learn from. When dealing with former androgen users, there may be better ways to increase Testosterone than the standard patch treatment (which will only prolong the problem of decreased T production.) Hypogonadal former androgen users need a treatment, not a band-aid. If you need to jump start your Testosterone after an androgen cycle, this combination of HCG, Clomid, and Nolvadex may be just what the doctor ordered. Now, trying to get him to order it is another story!


TAKEN FROM http://www.johnberardi.com/articles/...on/ascmy2k.htm

Thx...

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Originally Posted by gooroo

Subject #2 is a 5'10", 184lb male who used 400 mg per week of nandrolone. His baseline numbers were: LH<1IU/L, Test=45ng/dl. This subject's 32 day treatment consisted of 2500 IU of HCG every 4 days, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. There was no change. He underwent another treatment consisting of 60 days of 5000 IU of HCG every 4 days for 4 injections, then 2500 IU every 4 days for 4 injections, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. Still, no change. For the next 32 days, this subject received 5000 IU of HCG every other day for 6 injections, then 2500 IU every other day for 6 injections given with 150 IU of menotropins, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex 2 times per day. 15 days after treatment his numbers were: LH=9.8IU/L, Test=507 ng/dl.(20)

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thats over 4 months of treatment with high baseline LH and low range test. Though it is a single subject, who may have other gonadal/hormonal issues, it is representative of possible significant inhibition by nandrolone

[QUOTE=gooroo]Can T levels be restored in former anabolic steroid users?

The Study: Two hypogonadal former anabolic steroid users were studied. Normal levels of LH are >3.6 IU/L and Testosterone are 300-1000 ng/dl. Former anabolic steroid users often have suppressed levels of both.

The Results: Subject #1 is a 6', 206lb former user of 500-2000+ grams per week of anabolics. His baseline numbers were: LH<1IU/L, Test=191ng/dl. This suject underwent a 32 day treatment of 2500 IU of HCG every 4 days, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. 15 days after treatment his numbers were: LH=5.2IU/L, Test=1072 ng/dl.

Subject #2 is a 5'10", 184lb male who used 400 mg per week of nandrolone. His baseline numbers were: LH<1IU/L, Test=45ng/dl. This subject's 32 day treatment consisted of 2500 IU of HCG every 4 days, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. There was no change. He underwent another treatment consisting of 60 days of 5000 IU of HCG every 4 days for 4 injections, then 2500 IU every 4 days for 4 injections, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex per day. Still, no change. For the next 32 days, this subject received 5000 IU of HCG every other day for 6 injections, then 2500 IU every other day for 6 injections given with 150 IU of menotropins, 50 mg of clomid 2 times per day, and 10 mg nolvadex 2 times per day. 15 days after treatment his numbers were: LH=9.8IU/L, Test=507 ng/dl.(20)

Comments: The authors of this paper have presented some very interesting data that the medical community needs to learn from. When dealing with former androgen users, there may be better ways to increase Testosterone than the standard patch treatment (which will only prolong the problem of decreased T production.) Hypogonadal former androgen users need a treatment, not a band-aid. If you need to jump start your Testosterone after an androgen cycle, this combination of HCG, Clomid, and Nolvadex may be just what the doctor ordered. Now, trying to get him to order it is another story!


TAKEN FROM http://www.johnberardi.com/articles/...on/ascmy2k.htm[/QUOTE/]

Good little article man never used deca and probley never will.

I've seen other studies where they gave test to volunteers and then monitored their blood levels once the treatment was stopped. From the graph in the report, most men had significant recovery within two months, with some taking 6 months or longer to completely recover. Note that this was without any PCT at all. Maybe someone has a link the one I'm thinking of.