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  1. #1
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    Big MASS stack, and keeping it afterwards ? First cycle.

    hey guys,

    how is this stack for building some fast mass/size, (sus-250) and keeping most of it as quality muscle afterwards, (winstrol ).
    (deca to even it out )

    Since, its my first ever cycle, the dosage is lower than normal and starts off low / and tapers at the end.

    Also would i expect any side effects from this ? and if so, would lowering sustanon to 250 a week solve this ?


    week 1 - 250 sus , 200 deca , 200 winstrol
    week 2 - 250 sus , 200 deca , 300 winstrol
    week 3 - 500 sus , 400 deca , 300 winstrol
    week 4 - 500 sus , 400 deca , 300 winstrol
    week 5 - 500 sus , 400 deca , 300 winstrol
    week 6 - 500 sus , 400 deca , 300 winstrol
    week 7 - 250 sus , 200 deca , 300 winstrol
    week 8 - 250 sus , 200 deca , 200 winstrol
    week 9 -
    week 10 - 300mg clomid day 1
    week 11 - 100mg clomid
    week 12 - 50mg clomid

  2. #2
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
    Mesomorphyl is offline Smart Ass Member
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    Tapering is considered old school of thought. You would be better off running one dose throughout. Also, your doses start off way to low IMO. If you decide to go with sust or deca you should start pct in 3 weeks.

  3. #3
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    does pct = clomid ?

    alot of people told me, if you dont taper, and suddenly drop from 500ml or whatever a week to 0 - then you will lose alot of gains.

    if you taper, then you keep more of it ??


    do you think those steroids go well together ? will the winstrol give any boost to the stack ? i.e. increase quality muscle or reduce puffiness / water ?

  4. #4
    esone's Avatar
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    post cycle therapy ..... you have got tons of research to do my friend

  5. #5
    dodgeram is offline New Member
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    I would run some novidex or liquidex after second week. To stop gyno and to keep from water retention down. novidex 40mg ed or liquedex .50 mg ed

  6. #6
    ***xxx***'s Avatar
    ***xxx*** is offline Anabolic Member
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    cycle is bs. sus at least 12 weeks and 2-4 weeks longer than deca , deca too, 8 weeks of winstrol ? no, in combination with 2 mass builders a total waste.

    btw: stats?

  7. #7
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    stats are low, ive just started training again, after more than 2 years of nothing.

    about 6,1
    88kg

    can put on 2-3lbs a week without steroids , if i eat like a horse and take a lot of whey/gainers.

    but i want to SUPER charge the gains, put 45 lbs,(22kg) or more in 8 weeks


    - about the winstrol - alot of people say if u add something like primobolan or winstrol it will help maintain the muscle post cycle, and also decrease some of the negative water retention etc.

  8. #8
    FrkyBgStok's Avatar
    FrkyBgStok is offline Senior Member
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    lol...45 lbs. damn bro. your goals are def. set high. get back into lifting for at least a year and go from there.

  9. #9
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    dont think they are high,

    ive been lifting for 11 years, on and off since 16.

    how can 45lbs be high ? when i could get almost 24lbs in the same time without steriods ?

    if im eating enough protein (250-350g) a day and training 6x a week, should not be a problem to get the 45.

    In the past ive got 2lb-4lbs a week working out 2x a week,
    just monday and friday. heavy lifts, squat, bench, shoulder, lats, etc.

    Over a year it averages around 1-1.5lb a week. slows down towards the end months, but still gain quite easy naturally
    Last edited by steroid123; 05-09-2005 at 10:26 AM.

  10. #10
    FrkyBgStok's Avatar
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    are you talking fat as well as muscle. 45lbs of muscle is insane. if you are 200lbs and you gain 45lbs of all muscle, you would be 245 with little bodyfat, which is close to a common comp weight for heavyweights or superheavyweights. this is huge!!

  11. #11
    RA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    dont think they are high,

    ive been lifting for 11 years, on and off since 16.

    how can 45lbs be high ? when i could get almost 24lbs in the same time without steriods ?

    if im eating enough protein (250-350g) a day and training 6x a week, should not be a problem to get the 45.

    In the past ive got 2lb-4lbs a week working out 2x a week,
    just monday and friday. heavy lifts, squat, bench, shoulder, lats, etc.

    Over a year it averages around 1-1.5lb a week. slows down towards the end months, but still gain quite easy naturally

  12. #12
    ***xxx***'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roidattack
    I second that

  13. #13
    Dave321 is offline AR's Salad Tossing Connoisseur
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  14. #14
    wayneboard1 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by roidattack


  15. #15
    wayneboard1 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Sane

    Man your avatar is cool but it kinda creeps me out at the same time.

  16. #16
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    roid attack , its not bs.

    maybe you have pretty poor genetics, but most people i know hit the gym and gain pretty easily.

    one of my good friends was being trained here in the uk, and started taking a lot of steroids age 17, he is now 22. he still has the stretch marks under his shoulders, at that time his arms went up to 19 inches.

    he doesnt take much these days, arms are around 17. and he looks a lot leaner.

    so you dont think i get 2-4lbs a week naturally ? maybe you are forgetting, that if you have been big in the past, and then stop for a year or 2, let yourself get thin, it is very very easy to build it back up.

  17. #17
    Dave321 is offline AR's Salad Tossing Connoisseur
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    Quote Originally Posted by wayneboard1
    Man your avatar is cool but it kinda creeps me out at the same time.
    I know, I was too juice at the time. 1500mg/day of tren and 2000mg cyp/day. I've leaned down since.

  18. #18
    RA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    roid attack , its not bs.


    maybe you have pretty poor genetics, but most people i know hit the gym and gain pretty easily.

    one of my good friends was being trained here in the uk, and started taking a lot of steroids age 17, he is now 22. he still has the stretch marks under his shoulders, at that time his arms went up to 19 inches.

    he doesnt take much these days, arms are around 17. and he looks a lot leaner.

    so you dont think i get 2-4lbs a week naturally ? maybe you are forgetting, that if you have been big in the past, and then stop for a year or 2, let yourself get thin, it is very very easy to build it back up.
    Yeah and I know a guy that knows a guy that knows a guy who drank winne and looks just like Ronnie Coleman!!

    If you can gain 52-78lbs of lean muscle per year, wtf are you doing talking about juice?

  19. #19
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roidattack
    Yeah and I know a guy that knows a guy that knows a guy who drank winne and looks just like Ronnie Coleman!!

    If you can gain 52-78lbs of lean muscle per year, wtf are you doing talking about juice?
    Yes we here at AR can do math... steroid123 you are a

  20. #20
    Dave321 is offline AR's Salad Tossing Connoisseur
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    Quote Originally Posted by roidattack
    Yeah and I know a guy that knows a guy that knows a guy who drank winne and looks just like Ronnie Coleman!!

    If you can gain 52-78lbs of lean muscle per year, wtf are you doing talking about juice?

  21. #21
    perfectbeast2001's Avatar
    perfectbeast2001 is offline "king of free stuff" / Retired
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    I call it BS too. If it were that easy to gain muscle this forum would not be here and we would all be competing in the top BB shows.

  22. #22
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    punchrf is offline Anabolic Member
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    if you can grow 2-4 pounds a week then you don't need steroids at this point. max your natural potential first. 8 weeks will be to short for the deca and sus. you will just start to make quality gains when you are stopping. 45 pounds in 8 weeks would be insane. just because you can put on that amount of weight that quick is not neccasarily good. your tendons are going to be stressed from the extra weight you are lifting plus the extra muscle. i would drop the deca and up the sus to about 500mg a week and run it for 10-12 weeks. don't forget that sus needs to be shot every other day minimum.

  23. #23
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    so 52lbs is a big deal ? you guys must be pretty crap.

    obviously it is not possible to put 52lbs on year after year, but if i train for a year i can put that amount on with ease.

    thats why i said i trained on and off for 11 years.
    this year i will train hard get the 52-74 then quit as usual through boredom.
    then when i dont eat or train and lose it. when i come back 2 years later, i can just put that weight on again very easily.

    that is my circle of weight traning. and you think its bs. you must be a cripple then. or have really bad genetics.

  24. #24
    FrkyBgStok's Avatar
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    this post cracks me up

  25. #25
    FrkyBgStok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    so 52lbs is a big deal ? you guys must be pretty crap.

    obviously it is not possible to put 52lbs on year after year, but if i train for a year i can put that amount on with ease.

    thats why i said i trained on and off for 11 years.
    this year i will train hard get the 52-74 then quit as usual through boredom.
    then when i dont eat or train and lose it. when i come back 2 years later, i can just put that weight on again very easily.

    that is my circle of weight traning. and you think its bs. you must be a cripple then. or have really bad genetics.
    LOL!!!!! pros worship juice and the are happy when they gain 3-4lbs per year!!!! 52 lbs of lean muscle mass in one year is not only insane it it


  26. #26
    Dave321 is offline AR's Salad Tossing Connoisseur
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    so 52lbs is a big deal ? you guys must be pretty crap.

    obviously it is not possible to put 52lbs on year after year, but if i train for a year i can put that amount on with ease.

    thats why i said i trained on and off for 11 years.
    this year i will train hard get the 52-74 then quit as usual through boredom.
    then when i dont eat or train and lose it. when i come back 2 years later, i can just put that weight on again very easily.

    that is my circle of weight traning. and you think its bs. you must be a cripple then. or have really bad genetics.
    again...

  27. #27
    perfectbeast2001's Avatar
    perfectbeast2001 is offline "king of free stuff" / Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    so 52lbs is a big deal ? you guys must be pretty crap.

    obviously it is not possible to put 52lbs on year after year, but if i train for a year i can put that amount on with ease.

    thats why i said i trained on and off for 11 years.
    this year i will train hard get the 52-74 then quit as usual through boredom.
    then when i dont eat or train and lose it. when i come back 2 years later, i can just put that weight on again very easily.

    that is my circle of weight traning. and you think its bs. you must be a cripple then. or have really bad genetics.
    Hmm your style of training seems a bit counterproductive. You train and pack on 50-70 pounds of muscle (BS) then you give up. Well good luck mate!!

  28. #28
    RA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    so 52lbs is a big deal ? you guys must be pretty crap.

    obviously it is not possible to put 52lbs on year after year, but if i train for a year i can put that amount on with ease.

    thats why i said i trained on and off for 11 years.
    this year i will train hard get the 52-74 then quit as usual through boredom.
    then when i dont eat or train and lose it. when i come back 2 years later, i can just put that weight on again very easily.

    that is my circle of weight traning. and you think its bs. you must be a cripple then. or have really bad genetics.
    Ok Mr. Supergene. How much do you weigh right now?

  29. #29
    perfectbeast2001's Avatar
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    I would like to see some pics of you when your not training then the ones when your 70lbs of muscle heavier please!!

  30. #30
    Dave321 is offline AR's Salad Tossing Connoisseur
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  31. #31
    FrkyBgStok's Avatar
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    i want to see a 70lb gain in one year. DAMN!!!

  32. #32
    RA's Avatar
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    Sorry gotta go work out with my meager gened body. But, I have an idea that you have a misconception about weight training. Ask any vet on the board and they will say your full of shit too.

    -ra

  33. #33
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by roidattack
    Ok Mr. Supergene. How much do you weigh right now?
    at the moment 88kg. in the past i have dropped to 76kg, and i can go over 105kg without much difficulty

    around 78-80kg is a comfortable weight,

  34. #34
    steroid123 is offline New Member
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    actually i wasnt eating for a while, 2 years ago - and got real thin, think i went to 74kg.

  35. #35
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
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    You are still talking???

  36. #36
    punchrf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steroid123
    so 52lbs is a big deal ? you guys must be pretty crap.

    obviously it is not possible to put 52lbs on year after year, but if i train for a year i can put that amount on with ease.

    thats why i said i trained on and off for 11 years.
    this year i will train hard get the 52-74 then quit as usual through boredom.
    then when i dont eat or train and lose it. when i come back 2 years later, i can just put that weight on again very easily.

    that is my circle of weight traning. and you think its bs. you must be a cripple then. or have really bad genetics.
    52 pounds in one year is a huge gain. i think i went up about 35-40 the first year i started cycles but now it's more like 8 pounds a year. if you plan on quitting lifting then you are going to lose your gains then. save yourself some money and don't buy roids. it's not worth the extra stress on your body if you are only going to maintain those gains for 6 months. you should try to not insult people in your thread, you will get much better responses.

  37. #37
    Swifto's Avatar
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    I think your goals are a bit tooooo..... ambitious!!

  38. #38
    ElWrighty is offline New Member
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    i too can put on 52lb on in one year without gear and i can also fly and sh*t gold nuggets

  39. #39
    Mesomorphyl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElWrighty
    i too can put on 52lb on in one year without gear and i can also fly and sh*t gold nuggets
    You must be rich! LMAO

    steroid123> <everyone else that reads this thread

  40. #40
    MatrixGuy's Avatar
    MatrixGuy is offline Good things come to those who wait
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    steroid123.

    If you can gain that much mass naturally, why bother with steroids ?
    You must have some pretty amazing genetics!

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