Guys who gain 25-30lbs per cycle...

[Jnrmrplymouth]

this is something where I beleive I have had a problem. I did my first cycle after being stuck at the same weight for the past couple of years pretty much. I had correct diet knowledge and ALWAYS varied my training and research and reading was a daily thing in this area. I was stuck at around 190lbs @ 5'10" with around 12%BF. I realised I needed to drop body fat to get to where I wanted (good 6 pack and vascularity etc) but didnt want to work on getting that until I got to a weight I wanted. Anyway, when I did bulking periods by increasing my cals and macros etc I would gain a little weight. then I would try to cut down.. All this seemed to do was drop me back down to my normal weight and BF% and this was my knightmare circle for around 2 yrs.

Anyway, early this year, at 23 I just decided to try AAS. My first cycle was sus250/wk and deca200/wk with Dbol start and Test prop finish. I gained a little while on but my start weight was 190lbs and my end weight was 190lbs!!! So, I gained nothing!! This cycle did nothing for me, even in the strength area.

I I am now into my second week of my 2nd cycle and when I weighed myself after 1 week (With a lean bulking/cutting diet of 3500cals, 350+prot, 250-300g carbs, 100gs+ good fats) and my gains was just over 2lbs! I know this aint much but Im happy because I know not much is water. I hope to gain at least 10lbs off this cycle and keep most of it but I think my body was already at its max level so thats why Im finding it hard to go higher - for reasons you explained.

You have basically just backed up what I already thought - so thanks!!

darren

Yo dazbo how ya doing buddy. Did you really gain nothing off your first cycle? I find it hard to beleive. I have to say you look bigger than 190 in that pic so im assuming uve put on some size in your last few cycles.

Back to the topic.........genetics are an important role no doubt but I find it hard to beleive that some people say they cant get any bigger. Some guys are like 'im 210lbs and even when I do gear thats my genetic weight'. If you are 200-210lbs and cant really get any bigger even on a cycle must be doing something wrong. I dont think anyone can just 'stop growing'. I think the most important things in bodybuilding are diet, training and consistency.

People just think genetics all the time and if they cant gain they blame genetics. In bodybuilding you have to be smart in EVERYTHING you do. Maybe you cant gain cause ur diet is off, or u party every weekend.

I beleive that EVERYONE can get bigger.....some will gain 10lbs a year and other 1 or 2 lbs but no matter what you always get bigger somehow. I just find it hard to beleive that some people gain 0lbs a year. If thats true then they must be doing something wrong and genetics are NOT to blame.

[Schwarz]

Good post and very well put. I have one question. If your premise is that people who take AAS and add on 25lbs+ do so because they are not at their genetic peak then how do you explain the constant rise in pro BB weight. I remember that one year Ronnie put on like 20-40lbs of pure muscle....surely it can't be that these ppl simply don't have ANY genetic limitations??? But rather that the drugs do actually push you past the genetic limitations...

Also does this mean that once you've reached your genetic limitation you can't push through it and carry on growing?? If that's the case that's very depressing!!

s

[stupidhippo]

I sure would like to know thaty also Schwarz... I mean do we possess the capability to keep growing with right training nutrition or is the genetically set peak some where close by..

[djboots]

well i hate to admit this but i'm the guy that olny worked out for six months and juiced. i grew like crazy 20lbs in 10 weeks my friends were amazed well now i continue to work out all the time and without always cycling. you are right it was a shortcut but that shortcut introduced me to lifting hard and i do not regret it one bit.

[GetHugeDieTrying]

Agreed on every point...Highlighted a couple that, though not your main argument, are an argument i put foward to some of the Bros here who've never competed...or who lift and use gear recreationally.

is there anything wrong if someone were to use gear, to look better and feel better about themselfs, or is your opinion gear is only needed for competitors?

-ghdt

[GetHugeDieTrying]

well i hate to admit this but i'm the guy that olny worked out for six months and juiced. i grew like crazy 20lbs in 10 weeks my friends were amazed well now i continue to work out all the time and without always cycling. you are right it was a shortcut but that shortcut introduced me to lifting hard and i do not regret it one bit.

join the club, worked out for a year then juiced, with a kept 32 pounds as of now. solid base can lift quite a bit now without juice. very happy regardless, and i got my ballz back.. so im happy now 2

[C_Bino]

Yo dazbo how ya doing buddy. Did you really gain nothing off your first cycle? I find it hard to beleive. I have to say you look bigger than 190 in that pic so im assuming uve put on some size in your last few cycles.

Back to the topic.........genetics are an important role no doubt but I find it hard to beleive that some people say they cant get any bigger. Some guys are like 'im 210lbs and even when I do gear thats my genetic weight'. If you are 200-210lbs and cant really get any bigger even on a cycle must be doing something wrong. I dont think anyone can just 'stop growing'. I think the most important things in bodybuilding are diet, training and consistency.

People just think genetics all the time and if they cant gain they blame genetics. In bodybuilding you have to be smart in EVERYTHING you do. Maybe you cant gain cause ur diet is off, or u party every weekend.

I beleive that EVERYONE can get bigger.....some will gain 10lbs a year and other 1 or 2 lbs but no matter what you always get bigger somehow. I just find it hard to beleive that some people gain 0lbs a year. If thats true then they must be doing something wrong and genetics are NOT to blame.

I agree with you completely on this. I think it is possible for anyone to gain weight. Like I also thinks its possible for anyone to lose weight, its the same principle. I hate when people say "I have tried EVERYTHING to lose weight and I just cant." That is bullshit to me
It may be harder for some than others but I really think anyone can still gain, with proper habits.

-Bino

[Eddie8]

Probably some truth to this post, you can’t continue to gain 25 pounds per cycle or we would all be Ronnie Coleman. I say live and let live though. You can’t be everything in every part of your life. Some are dedicated to body building at the sacrifice of their career or the ability to earn a good living, so do I call that man a looser or a poser because he cant hang with me in the money department. Some focus on their family and do a great job there but are not so dedicated in the gym, they find more reward from being a good parent or partner. There are many things that carry more substance in life than being big. If everyone wanted to be the best body builder in the world we would have no homes to live in and no societal infrastructure to exist in because it takes, for most, single minded discipline in whatever our chosen profession is to achieve greatness. Kind of that jack or all trades but master of none saying. Bodybuilding is at best a narcissistic self involved activity with out much, if any socially redeeming worth. I can’t think of any emergency that could happen to me in life where I would pick up the phone and say “quick, send me over a body builder I need help”. I do like being jacked though so I can intimidate the puny dweebs that I run across in daily life, we all know it is about ego at some level. Don’t be a hater; everyone has their thing in life, that’s what makes the world go round.

[Jnrmrplymouth]

Probably some truth to this post, you can’t continue to gain 25 pounds per cycle or we would all be Ronnie Coleman. I say live and let live though. You can’t be everything in every part of your life. Some are dedicated to body building at the sacrifice of their career or the ability to earn a good living, so do I call that man a looser or a poser because he cant hang with me in the money department. Some focus on their family and do a great job there but are not so dedicated in the gym, they find more reward from being a good parent or partner. There are many things that carry more substance in life than being big. If everyone wanted to be the best body builder in the world we would have no homes to live in and no societal infrastructure to exist in because it takes, for most, single minded discipline in whatever our chosen profession is to achieve greatness. Kind of that jack or all trades but master of none saying. Bodybuilding is at best a narcissistic self involved activity with out much, if any socially redeeming worth. I can’t think of any emergency that could happen to me in life where I would pick up the phone and say “quick, send me over a body builder I need help”. I do like being jacked though so I can intimidate the puny dweebs that I run across in daily life, we all know it is about ego at some level. Don’t be a hater; everyone has their thing in life, that’s what makes the world go round.

Thats a very good and interesting post

[BG]

I agree, I built my natural body until 30 years old then turned to AS when it would not grow anymore. I only get 10lbs if lucky from cycles, but nice lean muscle, not the water these guys that are getting 25lbs, plus I keep mine, no stretch marks either.

[DSM4Life]

There is some good advice in here and I believe 99% of it all. I believe that genetics does play a big part in bodybuilding. Some guys are just "programmed" to be small, just like some guys are "programmed" to be tall. That is what makes us all different, our genes. I believe some have that strand that when you eat right and train you will take off like a rocket. Then you have people who do the same and just seem to sputter along slowly. I feel some do need juice to get to their goals but there is a very fine line between who needs it and who doesn’t. Since I am not a doctor/expert I will not go any further on that topic.


To each their own my friends.

[FINAMAN]

Amazing post good work bro, one of the best around id have to say

[bjf17]

That was a good post. Genes are the key. Some of us are mesos, etc. and we can gain fast without juice. I am that way(or was) I agree with what he said about your genetic potential. I have taken juice before only 2 inj and the diff was very noticeable. The trick is also not to listen to everyone and what routine they are doing. you have to learn your own body. What excer work what diet works it takes time even for a true meso to realize just what their potential is.

[Bigkarch]

never heard of phreezer..LOL.dont thing most understand kept gains

[superfat73]

one hell of a motivating post, off to do bi's

[Dying Wail]

Great post Thanks!

[manc]

Probably some truth to this post, you can’t continue to gain 25 pounds per cycle or we would all be Ronnie Coleman. I say live and let live though. You can’t be everything in every part of your life. Some are dedicated to body building at the sacrifice of their career or the ability to earn a good living, so do I call that man a looser or a poser because he cant hang with me in the money department. Some focus on their family and do a great job there but are not so dedicated in the gym, they find more reward from being a good parent or partner. There are many things that carry more substance in life than being big. If everyone wanted to be the best body builder in the world we would have no homes to live in and no societal infrastructure to exist in because it takes, for most, single minded discipline in whatever our chosen profession is to achieve greatness. Kind of that jack or all trades but master of none saying. Bodybuilding is at best a narcissistic self involved activity with out much, if any socially redeeming worth. I can’t think of any emergency that could happen to me in life where I would pick up the phone and say “quick, send me over a body builder I need help”. I do like being jacked though so I can intimidate the puny dweebs that I run across in daily life, we all know it is about ego at some level. Don’t be a hater; everyone has their thing in life, that’s what makes the world go round.

well said eddie..im 38,self employed.big mortgage..bodybuilding dont pay my bills.

[SnaX]

Some of you will disagree with me on this. Personally, I dont try to measure gains in terms of weight. What does weight do? Nothing.
I think this because weight doesn't always equal muscle. Weight could equal anything. It's sort of like a self-critique.
I look at the size i've gained over time and thats what the success is. Weight never helped me, but size has.
I look in the mirror after a workout, and i think "Im getting to a good platform. Just a little more to go" not, "I need to get more weight".
Weight is only a factor in competition.
So I don't see what the big deal with "weight" is. Of course if the mindset helps you get bigger and stronger, then you know, it's not a big deal really. It's all about the mind working for you.
End.

[Jnrmrplymouth]

Some of you will disagree with me on this. Personally, I dont try to measure gains in terms of weight. What does weight do? Nothing.
I think this because weight doesn't always equal muscle. Weight could equal anything. It's sort of like a self-critique.
I look at the size i've gained over time and thats what the success is. Weight never helped me, but size has.
I look in the mirror after a workout, and i think "Im getting to a good platform. Just a little more to go" not, "I need to get more weight".
Weight is only a factor in competition.
So I don't see what the big deal with "weight" is. Of course if the mindset helps you get bigger and stronger, then you know, it's not a big deal really. It's all about the mind working for you.
End.

Alot of people do that. They go by the mirror and not the scale but I find that there is a problem with doing that. When you go by the mirror your mind is telling you how big you are. The problem I have is sometimes I look in the mirror and feel small and other times I look in the mirror I feel big. It depends what time of the day it is, or what mood im in. My training partner is the same. Sometimes he feels big and sometimes he feels small. So basically I think its hard to go by the mirror as its not 'accurate' enough. The only way I know if im growing is by using everything. It helps to go by the scale and tape. I do everything now..........I measure my bodyparts, weigh myself and go by the mirror. By using all three you can see where you are going in your bodybuilding.

[I_Want_Abs]

this is a good post but it is niether right nor wrong as it is only 1 persons opinion on the way they think and feel about steroids (no offence) but it is and you can agree and dissagree all you like but some one else can turn around and start a thread about the totally opposite end of this spectrum and have a valid point, for example and only for example one could say: why once you have reached your genetic limit would you continue to do big cycles or any cycles at all because once you come off it is going to be very hard to naturally maintain or push past where you are as you are allredy at or beyond your genetic limits.

this is just a simple comment and my opinion on this tread no offence is intended to anyone at all

-bex-

[craneboy]

one of the best posts iv'e seen on this board

[SnaX]

Alot of people do that. They go by the mirror and not the scale but I find that there is a problem with doing that. When you go by the mirror your mind is telling you how big you are. The problem I have is sometimes I look in the mirror and feel small and other times I look in the mirror I feel big. It depends what time of the day it is, or what mood im in. My training partner is the same. Sometimes he feels big and sometimes he feels small. So basically I think its hard to go by the mirror as its not 'accurate' enough. The only way I know if im growing is by using everything. It helps to go by the scale and tape. I do everything now..........I measure my bodyparts, weigh myself and go by the mirror. By using all three you can see where you are going in your bodybuilding.

I very much agree with that

[little men]

good post, i wish i could keep 15lbs instead of the 7-10lbs after a cycle but it just doesnt happen even after proper pct and im on my 3rd cycle

[juicy_brucy]

Everyone jumps on the "ban ross" bandwagon sooner or later...

[madflabby]

I've been working out for over 10 years, first cycle I gained 22lbs. But 10 lbs of that was water weight. Does that count?

[Eddie8]

this is a good post but it is niether right nor wrong as it is only 1 persons opinion on the way they think and feel about steroids (no offence) but it is and you can agree and dissagree all you like but some one else can turn around and start a thread about the totally opposite end of this spectrum and have a valid point, for example and only for example one could say: why once you have reached your genetic limit would you continue to do big cycles or any cycles at all because once you come off it is going to be very hard to naturally maintain or push past where you are as you are allredy at or beyond your genetic limits.

this is just a simple comment and my opinion on this tread no offence is intended to anyone at all

-bex-

Very well said. I kind of look at AAS applied with the best knowledge that we can get as the great equalizer. I don’t possess the natural test levels of some and could never get over 180 lbs clean without just getting fat, but once the juice is applied it really doesn’t matter then. The man with the superior genetics will usually win the BB show but I can get damn close with the proper hormone balance in my body to optimize growth. There are many people that have never trained clean, I would guess that Arnold is one of them by looking at his pictures when he was 19. Many people have been brought into the gym by a big brother or friend that was a competitive body builder that put them on a cycle from day one. Before all of the steroid hype by the media many athletes and trainers treated d-bol like it was a vitamin. I don’t think it really matters whether you train clean or not, there certainly is no virtue in it. Once you are not clean any more it really doesn’t matter.