Thread: Var questions
05-31-2005, 02:57 PM #1Member
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- Aug 2004
Doing a Var only cycle. (continue reading after your done laughing) I'm running 40mg/day for 7 weeks, and I just have 2 questions. Is it OK if I only lift 3 days week during the cycle? Also, I mixed it up myself in everclear. When I dissolved the powder however, I noticed that some of the solution evaporated. Did I lose Var in the evaporation or just everclear? Thanks.
05-31-2005, 03:05 PM #2
You should have used allittle peg in there also.
How many days a week do u usually lift? Do you think you could get the same results lifting 3 days a week as opposed to 5?
That's a question that you'll have to answer for yourself.
05-31-2005, 03:08 PM #3
This was origianlly posted by Dflood from AR
I have seen about three threads a day in the past month on anavar alone, and they all turn into arguments involving the same parties....so let this just be a "guide" for an individual planning/considering using oxandrolone as a standalone compound.
First, id like to get a few things straight about var.
Myth #1 - Anavar will not suppress the HPTA.
False. Anavar, used in adequate dosages, will shut you down. To what degree you experience side effects of suppression (loss of libido, lethargy) is entirely dependent upon the individual and the dosages used.
Myth #2 - Var is a weak anabolic , and is not effective unless stacked with a more androgenic compound.
This could not be further from the truth. At dosages of 40mg a day and higher, anavar is incredibly effective at adding water free LBM. At around day 6-7, increased vascularity should become apparent (assuming your oxandrolone is legitimate in its dosing), and strength gains should start appearing around day 14.
If used during a clean bulk, gains of 10-20 pounds are possible. If cutting, you will maintain weight, or even put on 5-10 pounds (depending on the rate of fat loss/severity of diet). You will keep all of your gains with proper PCT.
Myth #3 - Anavar will not require any type of PCT.
This is one ive never understood. It's a pretty commonly known fact now that var is a suppressive compound. So why is it that some individuals still refuse to make a small investment in some clomid/nolva....this is your testicular function we're talking about. That said, PCT required for var is not as "heavy" as PCT for, say, a test/eq cycle. 15-20 days @ 50mg clomid should be sufficient.
The only real issue of concern that i have found when running anavar alone is slight libido suppression. Anavar is suppressive enough to where you WILL feel a difference in your sex drive (and not for the better ) when using 40+mg a day. There are three options to counteract this.
#1 - Tribulus + Avena Sativa - Trib at 4-7g a day and Avena Sativa at 3-4g a day tend to help prevent any loss in performance or ability to get it up. However, using effective dosages is going to end up being as or more expensive than options 2 or 3...but its your call.
#2 - Proviron - If hairloss is an issue in your choice to use anavar, then you may want to avoid this one. But 25mg ED proviron, starting after week 2, will keep you rock hard. And it will help to harden up your muscles too .
#3 - Maintenance Test Dosage - Finally, you could choose to use testosterone to keep your willy in shape. At a dosage of around 200mg, split bi weekly, everything should keep running smoothly. Also, this will contribute to your gains much moreso than than options 1 or 2. I would keep nolva onhand on the off chance that you are severely gyno prone. Bloating should not be an issue at this dosage.
Anavar is a badass drug. This is why.
#1 - Vascularity
Oxandrolone will make you veiny as all hell. And quickly. Look out for brand new bulging forearms veins by around day 6. If you are following a cutting regimen, expect new spider webs in your chest, shoulders and quads by around day 21.
#2 - Pumps
When on var, the pumps are constant. Bored sitting in class/at work? Do some unweighted calf raises. After about three minutes, your calves will be ready to pop. Youll be doing something like drinking a cup of water, and after a minute of holding it, your bi will be completely full and pumped. You may have to cut some sets short in the gym due to the painful pumpage.
#3 - Strength
Even when cutting, you can expect new strength gains every workout after about day 14-21.
#4 - Fat Loss
Anavar has been shown to contribute to accelerated fat loss in both subcutaneous and visceral fat, concentrated effects in the abdomen and thigh area. And if youve used the drug, you can attest to this...if you cant sport the 6-8 pack look on var, its not gonna happen .
Anavar should be run @ at least 40mg a day to see all of the benefits it offers. Dosages upwards of 80mg have been shown to exhibit diminishing returns. Also, i cant imagine the intensity of the pumps at that kind of dosage.
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Tribulus 5-8g ED Weeks 1-12
Avena Sativa 2-4g ED Weeks 1-12
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Proviron 25mg ED Weeks 3-8
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Test Prop 50mg EOD Weeks 1-8
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
If bulking, Test Enanthate could be substituted for prop, and 100mg could be injected every 3-4 days...however, this could cause more bloating, and complicate PCT timing.
Anavar is a 17 Alpha Alkylated steroid , and is toxic. It has been shown to be less toxic than other orals, and is even used as liver treatment for recovering alcoholics. Still, i would limit my time using it to 8 weeks, 10 at the most.
It would be beneficial to you liver to use several different OTC supplements during, and perhaps after your cycle. A few preventive measures never hurt anyone .
1 - Milk Thistle
The classic liver protectant herb.supposedly works by blocking the entrance of harmful substances to liver cells, and hastening their expulsion. Make sure there is a high standardization of Silymarin
2 - R ALA
A powerful antioxidant
3 - NAC
Supports liver function and production of l-glutathione
4 - Vitamin C and E
5 - LOADS of water
Helps to flush out your entire system
Anavar isnt going to kill your cholesterol levels like some drugs (winny being one of the worst), but it may put your LDL/HDL profiles outside of the normal range. There are a few things that help, but as long as your not using 60+mg daily or running it for more than 10 weeks, i would just use flax...
1 - Flax Oil
Consuming lots of omega fatty acids promotes overall health, as well as helping to keep your lipid profile from becoming too bad.
2 - Policosanol
Used at 20mg daily to keep your HDL (good cholesterol) levels from crashing, and your LDL from becoming too high.
3 - Niacin
Preferably the flush free variety. If you wish, niacin can be used at 1-2g ED for a short period post-cycle to normalize HDL levels. Do not use for more than 7-14 days, as liver toxicity can be an issue when using those dosages of niacin for long periods of time.
I hope that people read this, and that it helps those doing their research to make the correct decision. If anyone sees any glaring errors, or has something important to add, hit me with a PM and ill do some editing.
I would like to add my opinions as I often do...
I have done 50mg of var and 75mg of var... There is a significant difference between the two. If you are one of those that say var is for chicks, then run 75-100mg and let me know how it goes.
FWIW Im going to try 100mg of var and some LR3 in the near future.
05-31-2005, 03:09 PM #4
Thanks to JGUNS from CEM.
Oxandrolone and fat burning
Oral anabolic steroid treatment, but not parenteral androgen treatment, decreases abdominal fat in obese, older men.
Lovejoy JC, Bray GA, Greeson CS, Klemperer M, Morris J, Partington C, Tulley R.
Pennington Biomedical Research Center, Baton Rouge, Louisiana 70808-4124, USA.
OBJECTIVE: To compare the effects of testosterone enanthate (TE), anabolic steroid (AS) or placebo (PL) on regional fat distribution and health risk factors in obese middle-aged men undergoing weight loss by dietary means. DESIGN: Randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trial, carried out for 9 months with primary assessments at 3 month intervals. Due to adverse blood lipid changes, the AS group was switched from oral oxandrolone (ASOX) to parenteral nandrolone decaoate (ASND) after the 3 month assessment point. SUBJECTS: Thirty healthy, obese men, aged 40-60 years, with serum testosterone (T) levels in the low-normal range (2-5 ng/mL). MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: Abdominal fat distribution and thigh muscle volume by CT scan, body composition by dual energy X-ray absorptiometry (DEXA), insulin sensitivity by the Minimal Model method, blood lipids, blood chemistry, blood pressure, thyroid hormones and urological parameters. RESULTS: After 3 months, there was a significantly greater decrease in subcutaneous (SQ) abdominal fat in the ASOX group compared to the TE and PL groups although body weight changes did not differ by treatment group. There was also a tendency for the ASOX group to exhibit greater losses in visceral fat, and the absolute level of visceral fat in this group was significantly lower at 3 months than in the TE and PL groups. There were significant main effects of treatment at 3 months on serum T and free T (increased in the TE group and decreased in the ASOX group) and on thyroid hormone parameters (T4 and T3 resin uptake significantly decreased in the ASOX group compared with the other two groups). There was a significant decrease in HDL-C, and increase in LDL-C in the ASOX group, which led to their being switched to the parenteral nandrolone decanoate (ASND) after 3 months. ASND had opposite effects on visceral fat from ASOX, producing a significant increase from 3 to 9 months while continuing to decrease SQ abdominal fat. ASND treatment also decreased thigh muscle area, while ASOX treatment increased high muscle. ASND reversed the effects of ASOX on lipoproteins and thyroid hormones. The previously reported effect of T to decrease visceral fat was not observed, in fact, visceral fat in the TE group increased slightly from 3 to 9 months, although SQ fat continued to decrease. Neither TE nor AS treatment resulted in any change in urologic parameters. CONCLUSIONS: Oral oxandrolone decreased SQ abdominal fat more than TE or weight loss alone and also tended to produce favorable changes in visceral fat. TE and ASND injections given every 2 weeks had similar effects to weight loss alone on regional body fat. Most of the beneficial effects observed on metabolic and cardiovascular risk factors were due to weight loss per se. These results suggest that SQ and visceral abdominal fat can be independently modulated by androgens and that at least some anabolic steroids are capable of influencing abdominal fat.
It has been postulated that Oxandrolone is especially good at reducing visceral fat due to its high AR binding affinity. It appears to be better at binding to the AR (at even amounts) then Test or deca . It would make sense if it is working through the AR if it also increases AR expression in adipose tissue as well (upregulating the AR in adipose tissue adding to lipolytic effects), which the following study seems to show:
Short-term oxandrolone administration stimulates net muscle protein synthesis in young men.
Sheffield-Moore M, Urban RJ, Wolf SE, Jiang J, Catlin DH, Herndon DN, Wolfe RR, Ferrando AA.
Department of Surgery, University of Texas Medical Branch, and Shriners Burn Hospital for Children, Galveston 77550, USA. firstname.lastname@example.org
Short term administration of testosterone stimulates net protein synthesis in healthy men. We investigated whether oxandrolone [Oxandrin (OX)], a synthetic analog of testosterone, would improve net muscle protein synthesis and transport of amino acids across the leg. Six healthy men [22+/-1 (+/-SE) yr] were studied in the postabsorptive state before and after 5 days of oral OX (15 mg/day). Muscle protein synthesis and breakdown were determined by a three-compartment model using stable isotopic data obtained from femoral arterio-venous sampling and muscle biopsy. The precursor-product method was used to determine muscle protein fractional synthetic rates. Fractional breakdown rates were also directly calculated. Total messenger ribonucleic acid (mRNA) concentrations of skeletal muscle insulin-like growth factor I and androgen receptor (AR) were determined using RT-PCR. Model-derived muscle protein synthesis increased from 53.5+/-3 to 68.3+/-5 (mean+/-SE) nmol/min.100 mL/leg (P < 0.05), whereas protein breakdown was unchanged. Inward transport of amino acids remained unchanged with OX, whereas outward transport decreased (P < 0.05). The fractional synthetic rate increased 44% (P < 0.05) after OX administration, with no change in fractional breakdown rate. Therefore, the net balance between synthesis and breakdown became more positive with both methodologies (P < 0.05) and was not different from zero. Further, RT-PCR showed that OX administration significantly increased mRNA concentrations of skeletal muscle AR without changing insulin-like growth factor I mRNA concentrations. We conclude that short term OX administration stimulated an increase in skeletal muscle protein synthesis and improved intracellular reutilization of amino acids. The mechanism for this stimulation may be related to an OX-induced increase in AR expression in skeletal muscle
05-31-2005, 03:09 PM #5
Anavar 's Anabolic Effects and Liver Safety...
The anabolic androgenic steroid oxandrolone in the treatment of wasting and catabolic disorders: review of efficacy and safety.
Orr R, Fiatarone Singh M.
School of Exercise and Sport Science, Faculty of Health Sciences, The University of Sydney, Sydney, Australia. R.Orr@fhs.usyd.edu.au
There has been increasing interest in the development of effective agents that can be safely used to promote anabolism in the clinical setting for patients with chronic wasting conditions as well as in the prevention and treatment of frailty associated with loss of muscle tissue in aging (sarcopenia).One such agent is the anabolic androgenic steroid (AAS) oxandrolone, which has been used in such clinical situations as HIV-related muscle wasting, severe burn injury, trauma following major surgery, neuromuscular disorders and alcoholic hepatitis for over 30 years. In the US, oxandrolone is the only AAS that is US FDA-approved for restitution of weight loss after severe trauma, major surgery or infections, malnutrition due to alcoholic cirrhosis, and Duchenne's or Becker's muscular dystrophy.Our review of the use of oxandrolone in the treatment of catabolic disorders, HIV and AIDS-related wasting, neuromuscular and other disorders provides strong evidence of its clinical efficacy. Improvements in body composition, muscle strength and function, status of underlying disease or recovery from acute catabolic injury and nutritional status are significant in the vast majority of well designed trials. However, oxandrolone has not yet been studied in sarcopenia.Unlike other orally administered C17alpha-alkylated AASs, the novel chemical configuration of oxandrolone confers a resistance to liver metabolism as well as marked anabolic activity. In addition, oxandrolone appears not to exhibit the serious hepatotoxic effects (jaundice, cholestatic hepatitis, peliosis hepatis, hyperplasias and neoplasms) attributed to the C17alpha-alkylated AASs. Oxandrolone is reported to be generally well tolerated and the most commonly documented adverse effects are transient elevations in transaminase levels and reductions in high density lipoprotein cholesterol level.However, optimal risk:benefit ratios for oxandrolone and other agents in its class will need to be refined before widespread clinical acceptance of AASs as a therapeutic option in sarcopenia and other chronic wasting conditions.
05-31-2005, 03:10 PM #6
Anavar is indeed suppressive...the famous study
Effect of low dose oxandrolone and testosterone treatment on the pituitary-testicular and GH axes in boys with constitutional delay of growth and puberty.
Crowne EC, Wallace WH, Moore C, Mitchell R, Robertson WH, Holly JM, Shalet SM.
Department of Endocrinology, Christie Hospital Trust, Manchester, UK.
OBJECTIVE: To investigate the effect of low dose oxandrolone and testosterone on the pituitary-testicular and GH-IGF-I axes. DESIGN: Prospective double-blind placebo-controlled trial. PATIENTS: Sixteen boys with constitutional delay of growth and puberty (CDGP) with testicular volumes 4-6 ml were randomized to 3 months treatment: Group 1 (n = 5), daily placebo: Group 2 (n = 5), 2.5 mg oxandrolone daily or Group 3 (n = 6), 50 mg testosterone monthly intramuscular injections with assessment (growth, pubertal development and overnight hormone profiles) at 0, 3, 6 and 12 months. MAIN OUTCOME MEASURES: LH and GH profiles (15-minute samples) were analysed by peak detection (Pulsar), Fourier transformation and autocorrelation. Testosterone levels were measured hourly and insulin , SHBG, IGF-I, and IGFBP-3 levels at 0800 h. Statistical analysis was by multivariate analysis of variance for repeated measures. RESULTS: LH and testosterone parameters increased significantly with time in all 16 (LH AUC, P < 0.001; peak amplitude, P = 0.02; number of peaks, P = 0.02; testosterone AUC, P = 0.02; morning testosterone, P = 0.002). In Group 2, however, LH and testosterone parameters decreased at 3 months followed by a rebound increase at 6 and 12 months. SHBG levels were markedly reduced at 3 months (P = 0.006) and a wider range of dominant GH frequencies was present although GH AUC was not increased until 6 months, with an increase in GH pulse frequency but not amplitude. IGF-I levels were increased at both 3 and 12 months. In Group 3, pituitary-testicular suppression was not apparent, but GH levels increased with an increase in GH amplitude at 3 and 12 months. CONCLUSION: Oxandrolone transiently suppressed the pituitary-testicular axis and altered GH pulsatility. Testosterone increased GH via amplitude modulation.
hope that helped bro...
05-31-2005, 03:27 PM #7Junior Member
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- Apr 2005
Man, amazing work justin, thanks a ton for the help. How much $$ would your suggested cycle run you total/week? Just out of curiousity, i know it depends on source, etc. ( that is, the 40-50 mg doses ) and would this be a decent first cycle?
05-31-2005, 03:30 PM #8Originally Posted by droddy
05-31-2005, 04:58 PM #9Member
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- Aug 2004
great post, but can anyone still answer my main question.... ? i lost a few cc's from evaporation while heating the powder in everclear to break it down. Did I lose some Var as well as everclear, or can i just add the appropriate amount of everclear and break it down again without diluting it?
05-31-2005, 06:28 PM #10
the only thing that will evaporate is liquid, I.E everclear.... a precipitate will not evaporate... I actually dissolved mine today... 30mg/ml... and it all dissolved.. somone told me that var will only disolve @ 20mg/ml. The only thing it will do by evaporating is make your dosage more potent.
05-31-2005, 06:50 PM #11Member
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- Aug 2004
ok, thanks alot, so lets just say 5 cc's evaporated, as long as i add another 5 cc's of everclear to replace it, i will be back to 40mg/cc?
05-31-2005, 08:06 PM #12Junior Member
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- Apr 2005
Is there a tutorial or some thread i can reference for complete instructions on the evaporation process, etc?
06-01-2005, 06:00 AM #13Originally Posted by Big Poppa Pump
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