D-bol and ??

[fhorst]

Hi all,

Just want your advice.
I'm using D-bol, 3x 5mg per day as a starter.
(for a 10 week cycle, weekends off)
Only d-bol cycle is not a good idea I read in all the forums

I don't want to start with needels (yet)

I want to add in week 3
Andriol (Testosterone Undecanoate) 40mg caps 3 per day
"Winnies" Stanozolol 3 x 10mg per day

and ocf 2 weeks Clomid (first 7 days 100 mg, 7 days 50g) at the end on the cycle.

Feedback PLEASE!

[Booz]

no needles no cycle mate,the only all oral cycle you will be recommended will be anavar and even then its best to do it with a form of test.

[hemidog66]

bro you are gonna hurt yourself, all those oarls are gonna wuuuup your liver. injects are nothing.... ez it dont hurt what are your stats?

[colossus1]

Simple answer...........no. Dont do it. While i dont have a problem with someone doing a d-bol only cycle (although there are way better alternatives) what you are planning is simply the result of not being educated the least bit as far as anabolics are concerned.

[fhorst]

So.... Educate me

I know the Andriol is not toxic on the liver. Winnies can be. D-bol is.
I'm not running high dosages, so that should balance things a bit.

I want to "back up" the D-bol, so that the gains will stay more. Test should be fine right?

[Booz]

yes mate test should really be the base of all cycles imo.

[fhorst]

OK, so if I get it right:
Stick to the D-bol and the Andriol (Testosterone Undecanoate), drop the winnies.

for a next cycle... use needels

[pitbull27]

NO....what we are saying here is only one oral with injectable test! Way too much stress on the liver. Is your fear of poking yourself worth losing your liver over???

[fhorst]

Andriol (Testosterone Undecanoate) is NOT TOXIC to the liver. No stess what so ever. (according to many forums)

I can understand the combination D-bol and Winnies are to much....

But why do I read in a lot of posts to start taking 30, 40 and even 50 mg D-bol / winnies?

IMHO you should take as much as is good for YOU, when you feel the stuff working, you have enough.
If I would start now with 50 mg D-Bol, that would surely hurt my liver...... or am I missing the point here.

I'm sure that taking 5 days 15 mg, 2 days off for 10 weeks will give me less stress to the liver then the sugested Cycles for the Newbie 40mg per day.

[hellapimpin]

andriol sucks dude.......you have to take it every 3 to 4 hours to keep levels constant in body...i dont know what to tell you if you dont want to do injectable with dbol ..but andriol would be an option..but remember it sucks.

[smokethedays]

liver transplants aren't that expensive anymore, so make sure ur name is on the list

[fhorst]

I know I need to take 3 or 4 each day, every 4 hours.. That's the down side.

Injecable's are OK, but for my next cycle. As it is my first cycle, I don't want to grow to much to fast.
15mg D-bol is already doing great! (looks like I react good on steroids )

[fhorst]

liver transplants aren't that expensive anymore, so make sure ur name is on the list

Srry to quote you......... but this is turning into a liver discussion. You want to tell me that no-one uses oral's anymore?

You want to tell me that taking 40mg D-bol (Oral) togeter with injecalbles is better for the liver then 15 mg D-bol?

nvm.
Andriol and D-bol got Arny big.... but it might be I'm reading to much old posts.... 15 years ago there was "no liver" issue

Could be that most ppl in this forum has liver problems and that's why you're urging me to take needles.

I'm not affraid to use a needle.. I am afraid to hit a vain.

[hellapimpin]

good luck with whatever you decide..keep us posted.

[longhorn814]

As it is my first cycle, I don't want to grow to much to fast.
15mg D-bol is already doing great! (looks like I react good on steroids )

dont worry youre mostly gaining water on dbol right now, which will go away once you stop. You need injectable test in your cycle period. If you cant inject, then youre not ready for AAS. Andriol is crap and doesnt yield any results from what I hear. Please do it right or dont do it at all.

[stocky121]

d/boll and test bro. AND NOT ORAL TEST

[fhorst]

well........ all ppl who are on AAS did their first shot ones, and it is kind of kreepy the first time

I don't know how I will react mentaly on the Test. My natural levels are not so high (I guess........I'm the "sweet guy")
When you inject it stays in your system 3 to 4 days. Andriol gives me the option to experiment with the levels.
When I know what levels I react good to, I can start using injactables.

(I did think/ read about the combination several months prior to ordering)

For liver protection I'll use Milk Thistle. Any suggestions on that dosis?

[hellapimpin]

about 400mg a week 500 would be good.....but if your worried about your reaction..go with 400mg a week.

[fhorst]

go with 400mg a week.

Meaning injectable and = 2 x 200 right?

[longhorn814]

I don't know how I will react mentaly on the Test. My natural levels are not so high (I guess........I'm the "sweet guy")
When you inject it stays in your system 3 to 4 days. Andriol gives me the option to experiment with the levels.
When I know what levels I react good to, I can start using injactables.

why do you think your test levels are low? b/c youre a "sweet" guy, that doesnt have anything to do with it. The only way to know what your test levels are is to have a blood test. Perhaps you should read hookers profile on andriol before you take that junk. Better have lots of it and take it every two hours and then you'll be lucky to gain 5 lbs!! Use a needle!

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...hlight=andriol

[hellapimpin]

preferably injectable!!! most preferably..but if your set on andriol ..which sucks...then do it at 160 mg a day ...read up on hookers andriol profile...might change your mind.

Meaning injectable and = 2 x 200 right?

[hellapimpin]

as a matter of fact.....Just dont do it..waste of money and time and receptors.

[bignatt]

Wait on your cycle until your not scared to hit a vein....and just run some test at a low dose

[fhorst]

OK Thanks a lot m8t's!

Good info here.

Also Hooker says :
Despite all of it’s problems, if I had the money to run 10-15 caps of Andriol /day, and if I were looking for a stand-alone oral compound to safely run for a full cycle (of perhaps 12 weeks), then I have to admit, Andriol would be my #1 choice.
Testosterone undecanoate and may offer an alternative for androgen treatment in women.



Well 10-15 caps a day is like 15-20$ a day. <--> expensive hobby this way 450 euro's a month.

So. Skip Andriol if it is pricewise a problem....... and at that rate it is..

Some of my options:
Anadrol is WAY to toxic
Anavar (Oxandrolone) could be an option, but in the ammount you need to take it it's also WAY to expensive (8-10$ a day)
Winny (Stanozolol ) Oral is also to toxic to take with the D-bol (maybe as injectable?)

Leaves me with many options in injectables, who are indeed much cheaper, and safer for the liver (leaves me money for additional Novadex)

After reading my best Idea is to use Sustanon 250-500 mg per week, with D-Bol 15-20 mg per day

Looks OK to you?

only leaves me with the Clomid. I saw also injectable. (if I am injecting, why not also this?) it is supposed to be pricewice beter, but how much to inject and how often?

[Booz]

it would be better for you to take test e or cyp mate, you only have to jab them twice a week, if you take sus you really should take it eod because of the short actin prop in it.

[fhorst]

I know I'm beeing a hard nut to crack............

Some I've been reading:

Testosterone propionate 30mg,
Testosterone phenylpropionate 60 mg,
Testosterone isocaproate 60 mg,
Testosterone decanoate 100 mg

the effect of the four testosterones is time-released so that Sustanon goes rapidly into the system and remains effective in the body for several weeks
(http://www.steroid.com/SUSTANON%20250.phtml)

Sure, the prob starts quickly and also ends quickly, but then the other 3 seem to kick-in
Right?

I know you are all a big fan of test e and cyb, but I can get sutanon, and not test e / cyb.

[bignatt]

better to choose a solid ester like Test E to keep your levels more stable

[wolfyEVH]

Even if you ran sust at twice a week, it is still a helluva lot better than your cycle your proposed earlier.......like the others said, cyp and enanthate would be much better, but go with sust if you have to......

I know I'm beeing a hard nut to crack............

Some I've been reading:

Testosterone propionate 30mg,
Testosterone phenylpropionate 60 mg,
Testosterone isocaproate 60 mg,
Testosterone decanoate 100 mg

the effect of the four testosterones is time-released so that Sustanon goes rapidly into the system and remains effective in the body for several weeks
(http://www.steroid.com/SUSTANON%20250.phtml)

Sure, the prob starts quickly and also ends quickly, but then the other 3 seem to kick-in
Right?

I know you are all a big fan of test e and cyb, but I can get sutanon, and not test e / cyb.

[Booz]

fair enuff mate you can shoot it twice weekly no prob but you would get better results shootin it eod because of the prop in it,if you only shoot it twice weekly your blood levels will not be as stable because the prop will not be at a constant level,so more chance of sides.But people have and do run it like you want to so go for it,all we are tryin to say is it would be better to run eod,good luck with watever you do,peace mate!

[nolaboy43]

you gotta stick to really get great results and ur moneys worth

[longhorn814]

go with test e or cyp, the shots are usually painless, the sust shots can definitely hurt you for a few days too. Plus you only have to shoot twice a week

[fhorst]

OK thanks for the feedback.

2x 250 per week sust, 15-20 D-bol/day total cycle 12 weeks (incl the 2 weeks clomid)
I am now 65kg....... and let you know the results!
(prob. with water retention from D-bol I'm now 67 or so )

[longhorn814]

Whats your diet like? 65 kg is pretty small. I would suggest working on improving your diet before taking anymore gear. If you dont know how to eat properly to put on size, steroids arent gonna give you very good results and you wont be able to keep them when you come b/c your diet sucks and you dont have a solid foundation built to keep the gains. Here's and example of how to eat properly

UNoffical "How to Bulk" thread and sample diet...

if youre not eating like this, you should be. Eating like this will give you good natural gains in no time too. Seriously try this first,

[fhorst]

LOL. Un-educated statement. If you saw my profile I'm working out for about 18 years.
I tried just about every diet there is.

Does the term "extreme ectomorph" say some to you?

But thanks for the concern! and thinking with me

[pitbull27]

Any particular reason you are only planning to run 2 weeks of clomid for PCT?
You should run at least one more week...and if you have access to nolvadex , run that during PCT at least, but it is good to have on hand incase the bloat gets too bad or sides start to show up.

[fhorst]

Any particular reason to run more then 2 weeks of clomid?
Most sites / cycles tell 5 days 100mg and 5 days 50mg.

[sasquatch]

here is my advice to you. I educated myself on AAS long before I started with them, and it sounds like you are also. Education is key.

And the more education you have, the more you realize how easy injections really are.
For my first cycle, I was a little scared to inject myself, and I had no one I could trust to inject for me. So I know I had to do it myself. I got my pins, and my gear, and it took me a WEEK before I got the guts to do my first injection.

But I educated myself, so I knew all about sterility, injection sites, etc, everything I needed to know. I did my first injection in the right glute, and it was PAINLESS. the pin went right in like butter.
I couldn't believe how EASY it was, and I felt like a prick for getting myself all worked up about it.
Now I look forward to injections...

If you do something like Test Enan of Cyp to begin with, you only need to inject once or twice a week (depending on the amount of test you're using). Just give yourself some time and space to do it, and relax and don't rush yourself. It'll be easy...

[fhorst]

Thanks m8.

what's best to use? the 0.7- 32mm long or the 0.8mm-38mm long?

I guess the 0.7 goes in most smooth, and it prevents injecting to fast.
0.8 will be smooth also, and injecting will be quicker.

I'm sure it will be painless, but like you said... guts :P

[Booz]

pct should be
day1 300mg
day 2-7 100mg
day 8-21 50mg,and run nolv at 20mg from last shot all the way through till a week after pct,i take it you are doin the dbol 1st 4 weeks?

[pitbull27]

Any particular reason to run more then 2 weeks of clomid?
Most sites / cycles tell 5 days 100mg and 5 days 50mg.

I have personally NEVER been to a site that recommended only 2 weeks of clomid therapyfor a 10 week cycle, let alone only 10 days as your previous post emplies. Even this site recommends at least three weeks and in some cases 4 weeks. Just click on any cycle listed on the main page.
*Here, I copied this formula off of the main page for you. This is generally standard protocal for clomid PCT. Some people whom are sensitive to clomid don't take the 300mg on the first day, but rather take 200mg the first two days, or they take 100mg all the way thru.

Clomid Therapy

******Day1 **Day 2**Day 3**Day 4**Day 5**Day 6**Day 7
Week 1 300 mg 100 mg 100 mg 100 mg 100 mg 100 mg 100 mg
Week 2 100 mg 100 mg 100 mg 100 mg 50 mg 50 mg 50 mg
Week 3 50 mg 50 mg 50 mg 50 mg 50 mg 50 mg 50 mg


Just trying to help bro.....I want you to keep your gains!