advice needed please

**dazbo** · 06-22-2005, 04:35 PM

just a quick question. I am on prop and var at the moment with 4weeks left.

This is my 2nd and very last cycle. Ive got nothing out of them but wasted money. The thing is, I have around 4/5vials of test enanthate left. I know I prob wont get much use out of it but rather than throwing it out, can I just stick it in me and hope I even get a little bit out of it over the next 4 weeks ?? If I dont, its going in the bin!! It wont do me any harm will it to have an extra 250mg test on top of my 500mg ??

Also, I have alot of Dbol left which again, I will never use and they will go in the bin! So, can I stick them into the end of my cycle? at 20mg per day or something ?? I know 2 orals isnt always good but 20mg is very low and it would only be for 4 weeks ??? I am also cutting but at same time trying to gain as much muscle as poss so Im not too worried about water gain etc.

Thanks

Darren

RA · 06-22-2005, 04:43 PM

Id throw it in the bin. I honestly dont think you would see any improved results. If no results then its not worth taking. Personally I am not a big fan of dbols in general but you could throw them in at the end, like you said, at a low dose.

**Alpha-Male** · 06-22-2005, 04:50 PM

FOUL!

dood, i'll PM you with my home address, PLEASE don't throw that in the trash!

**dazbo** · 06-22-2005, 04:51 PM

would it make me have any worse results tho ?? or would it cause damage ??

RA · 06-22-2005, 04:54 PM

No, not worse results, just no results. Weigh side effects vs results. No results means I would not take it. JMO

**Alpha-Male** · 06-22-2005, 04:54 PM

i wouldnt add 'em, seriously, save 'em for another cycle or donate 'em...

**dazbo** · 06-22-2005, 04:56 PM

I wont be doing ANY other cycle. Dont get anythign from them and dont like them. basically a waste of money that cocks up my sex drive!!!!

**SprinterOne** · 06-22-2005, 04:58 PM

Are you saying you have got no gains from steroids ever, or just from this exact cycle? And I agree with Alpha-Male, donate those suckers don't just toss them

**Alpha-Male** · 06-22-2005, 05:02 PM

damn Daz, i'd look in the mirror before i made those claims, you look pretty damn good in your pic bro...not taking anything away from your diet and training regime, but hey, there's nothing wrong with going el naturale...back to your surplus though......do you accept WU?

**dazbo** · 06-22-2005, 05:05 PM

read the following post -

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...29#post1832329

It explains about my cycle. I did one cycle of sus/deca /dbol and I ended up weighing pretty much the same as I did before it, after PCT. I gained while on but even with proper PCT I went back down. I also gained a little more fat while on. My diet is pretty spot on. My strength didnt go up, my sex drive did while on but then dropped to v low near end few weeks. PCT didnt help the sex drive a great deal. I am now on prop 150mg EOD and var 50mg ed and again, Nothing!! I have no strength inc, a little weight gain (But then I am trying to cut) and no change in BF% etc. So, Ive decided they just dont work for me, maybe I need high doses to see results!! So, come on, I ave nooone to donate to, and would rather not throw in the bin! Stick it in me or not ?? how can I not see ANYTHING from an extra gram of test in my body ???? test is just test in the end. Would it mess my PCT up cos I know I have to wait 3 weeks after last injection b4 starting pct

**dazbo** · 06-22-2005, 05:08 PM

my pics were taken before any cycle. So all natural there. Maybe thats why I dont respond so well, cos I got so far naturally before juicing. Again, another post that will explain this -

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...12#post1828312

**dazbo** · 06-22-2005, 05:09 PM

I would like to say my first cycle was a dud cos of how it went and what I used, so dont really class that as one.

**j martini** · 06-22-2005, 05:15 PM

Are you sure your gear is legit. Also dieting and trying to gain muscle is never the best way to go IMO. Even with AAS the body needs to be in a calorie surplus to grow best.

**PrimoPup** · 06-22-2005, 05:26 PM

Daz, when you already look as good as you do bro i do not think you are going to see some crazy kind of gains that your are expecting. Question to you is while you have been on the Juice, this cycle have seen noticeable strength gains? If the answer is (YES) then you have legit gear, if the answer is (NO) then u have been ripped off.! Bro i think you are getting confused with the way some people look on those water retention pig steroids . Is this the look you want? Bro you have a great build now.! What are you looking for?
I got PM and sent it 1 back.!

Originally Posted by dazbo

read the following post -

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...29#post1832329

It explains about my cycle. I did one cycle of sus/deca/dbol and I ended up weighing pretty much the same as I did before it, after PCT. I gained while on but even with proper PCT I went back down. I also gained a little more fat while on. My diet is pretty spot on. My strength didnt go up, my sex drive did while on but then dropped to v low near end few weeks. PCT didnt help the sex drive a great deal. I am now on prop 150mg EOD and var 50mg ed and again, Nothing!! I have no strength inc, a little weight gain (But then I am trying to cut) and no change in BF% etc. So, Ive decided they just dont work for me, maybe I need high doses to see results!! So, come on, I ave nooone to donate to, and would rather not throw in the bin! Stick it in me or not ?? how can I not see ANYTHING from an extra gram of test in my body ???? test is just test in the end. Would it mess my PCT up cos I know I have to wait 3 weeks after last injection b4 starting pct

**dazbo** · 06-23-2005, 09:17 AM

Thanks Primo - just replied to your pm. I have had no strength gains on this cycle so far - no. But, the thing is, beyond sending my stuff away to get tested, I can never be 100% sure they are fake. heres the story. A good freind of mine gets his gear from a friend he has known for a long time now. My friend, started AAS over 2yrs ago easily and before he took them he was a lot smaller than me, and a lot weaker but still looked good and pretty toned. Now, he is 15.5st and his strength is closer to mine - although still not as high. His diet is shit and he doesnt know much about it but is training I guess is OK. Anyway, he has only ever used sus/deca /dbol like my first crap cycle, and at the same doses as me (Only he actually did it more wrong than I did all these yrs - dbol 10wks, sus once per wee and deca once per week - 250mg and 200mg respectively). Its obvisouly worked for him. I did the same, and got nothing but water gain from it which I soon lost - even though diet is my main thing - its a big part of my training. He has now taken my diet to go through and try to learn and copy stuff.

Anyway, the guy he gets em from, has actually asked my mate if he wants to go to thailand all paid for, bring back the gear, and get a free hol out of it. My friend cant do this cos his GF wont let him tho!! So, surely that confirms theyre real ??

Also, wen I did my first cycle, my other friend also started. He was not big but quite toned and only short and did a LOT of cardio/boxing. I gave him a diet to stick to which he did. and in 10wks, he gained 21lbs on his small frame, and after PCT, he still holds around 15 of those lbs. So again, this confirms the gear was real dont it ??

What do you reckon now ??

thanks

**dazbo** · 06-23-2005, 04:35 PM

bump

**PrimoPup** · 06-23-2005, 05:57 PM

Bro i do not know what to tell you, well i do but i know your $$$ situation and i know you do not want to spend a $150.00 for a lab test. All i know is that if you are getting no strength gains at all then it is either way underdosed or fake. One thing about Var is you may not see major physique changes but you sure as will feel the damn power it gives you.! Bro here is a cycle i put my nephew on and i know people freak about this kind of cycle, but he had a LVT test before and a LVT test a few weeks after his PCT. here is the cycle.

Code:

Week 1-8 T-Bol 70MG ED 
Week 1-8 Var 70MG ED
Week 1-8  Clen 80MCG ED
Week 1,3,5,8 Benadryl 100MG EO³W
Week 1-12 Liv52 1280MG ED
Week 1-8 Proviron 25mg ED
Week 1-12 Tribuplex 750 2G ED
Week 1-12 Tribex 1500 MG
Week 1-12 B-Complex ED
Week 1-12 Taurine 2000MG ED
Week 9-12  Clomid 100MG ED

here is his LFT test

LFT test results (Liver Function Test)
ALB was normal
AP was slightly elevated Before was 42 After was 82 (Normal Range is 35-115 IU/L)
GGT was normal
AST was slightly elevated Before was 2 After was 26 (Normal Range is 0-42 IU/L)
TBIL was normal

And i'll tell you he looks real good, a complete change of his body. It is to bad that you have had a bad go i would love to see what you would look like after a cycle like this.

Code:

(WEEK 1-14)  Primobolan 700MG     EW
(WEEK 1-6)   Oxydrol 50MG  ED
(WEEK 1-12)  Test Sus 100MG  ED
(WEEK 1-14)  Clenbuterol 60MG  ED
(WEEK 1-14)  Benadryl 100MG  EOW
(WEEK 1-18)  Taurine 2000MG  ED
(WEEK 1-18)  B-Complex  ED
(WEEK 1-18)  Liv 52 1280MG  ED
(WEEK 1-18)  Proviron 25mg  ED 
(WEEK 12-18) Clomid 100mg  ED 
(WEEK 1-18)  Avena Sativa  3G  ED
(WEEK 1-18)  Tribex  4G ED

I bet you would amaze yourself.

Originally Posted by dazbo

Thanks Primo - just replied to your pm. I have had no strength gains on this cycle so far - no. But, the thing is, beyond sending my stuff away to get tested, I can never be 100% sure they are fake. heres the story. A good freind of mine gets his gear from a friend he has known for a long time now. My friend, started AAS over 2yrs ago easily and before he took them he was a lot smaller than me, and a lot weaker but still looked good and pretty toned. Now, he is 15.5st and his strength is closer to mine - although still not as high. His diet is shit and he doesnt know much about it but is training I guess is OK. Anyway, he has only ever used sus/deca /dbol like my first crap cycle, and at the same doses as me (Only he actually did it more wrong than I did all these yrs - dbol 10wks, sus once per wee and deca once per week - 250mg and 200mg respectively). Its obvisouly worked for him. I did the same, and got nothing but water gain from it which I soon lost - even though diet is my main thing - its a big part of my training. He has now taken my diet to go through and try to learn and copy stuff.

Anyway, the guy he gets em from, has actually asked my mate if he wants to go to thailand all paid for, bring back the gear, and get a free hol out of it. My friend cant do this cos his GF wont let him tho!! So, surely that confirms theyre real ??

Also, wen I did my first cycle, my other friend also started. He was not big but quite toned and only short and did a LOT of cardio/boxing. I gave him a diet to stick to which he did. and in 10wks, he gained 21lbs on his small frame, and after PCT, he still holds around 15 of those lbs. So again, this confirms the gear was real dont it ??

What do you reckon now ??

thanks

**TonyM** · 06-24-2005, 03:23 AM

Darren my diet is not shit and for saying my training is well... ok is a load of crap because you have never seen me train. and as for my strength how would you know what i am or are not lifting?!

OK so your just over half way through this cycle with no gains.. maybe you should be informing everyone that you havent been to the gym for the last three weeks!

**PrimoPup** · 06-24-2005, 03:54 AM

Tony M you are the above mentioned? Well i sure hope he is not expecting miracles not going to the gym?

**TonyM** · 06-24-2005, 04:06 AM

Yeah thats me, Daz has been off the gym for three weeks with a shoulder injury and when he has gone back to the gym he has had no strength loss, I would expect to loose some considerabe strength especially in my first week back..

Dont get me wrong Daz is one of the most dedicated people i know, but i just dont think he should expect miracles.

I am confident that the gear i provide is 100% genuine as I have known my source for some years and know for a fact he is supplying a mr. universe entrant this year.

As for me.. I consider my diet and training to be good.. I am 15.5stone
34 inch waist, 50inch chest, 18inch arms, 26inch quads and i would put my bodyfat around 12-14%
Im off cycle at the minute but the cycles i have done (dec, sus and dianabol ) have always work well more me and I have kept allot of my gains

**PrimoPup** · 06-24-2005, 04:28 AM

Would have been a sweet trip to ThiaLand, you should take your source up on the offer just for the free trip..LOL.

**TonyM** · 06-24-2005, 04:31 AM

Yeah thats a bit toungue in cheek, wish daz hadnt posted that on here! and its not that my girlfriend wont let me go! I`ve just got to many responsibilities to leave the country 4 days out of every week, not to mention it would screw my training up let alone my full time job! HA!

Would be nice to live the dream thought!!

**PrimoPup** · 06-24-2005, 04:44 AM

I was in Bangkok back in 1995 what a place, what a place. I remember going to an opium house and getting so jacked up i was stuck there for like 8 hours before i could walk out of there. Every fast handed dirt bag in the world is there as well. If you do not know the language your screwed. Man i miss my buddy now thinking about it.

**TonyM** · 06-24-2005, 04:52 AM

Yeah it will defo be a place i will visit, saving to go back to Florida at the min!!

anyway I`ve kinda hijacked Darrens thread here, just wanted to put my point across, I`ll let it get back to "darrens issues".

Nice talkin to ya bud

**PrimoPup** · 06-24-2005, 05:36 AM

Same here bro good luck with everything.

Originally Posted by TonyM

Yeah it will defo be a place i will visit, saving to go back to Florida at the min!!

anyway I`ve kinda hijacked Darrens thread here, just wanted to put my point across, I`ll let it get back to "darrens issues".

Nice talkin to ya bud

**dazbo** · 06-24-2005, 11:26 AM

caused a little barny between us two this thread!! lol, but we sorted it now!!!

I havent been "OFF" the gym as such. 3 weeks I had my last "GYM" session. For a full week, working 11hrs a day, on my own, Ive dug up my garden (Over a full skip of clay), lifted patio slabs weighing around 175lbs from a large patio area, laid hardcore, 2tonne of sand, cement, and laid a new patio. Every day, I was working very hard all day long to get it finished in the week I had off work. During the 3 weeks, other than the week in between which I did the patio, I kept up with my kickboxing. I also play football (English) at leasty once per week. My diet while "OFF" was excellent and I made sure that while off work. I dd it how I wanted to.

So, as you can see, I have not exactly been off training - just not been to the gym. And, if you ask me, the above stuff should be perfect for a fat burning/lean bulking cycle no ????

Anyway, like I said, no fat loss even after that and no inc in vascularity, and none in strength when I did go to the gym. I only have 3 weeks left of my cycle - so Im not only half way through. I had around 4weeks of the prop and var even BEFORE I had my time off so I should have seen results by those 4 weeks.

Anyway, I appreciate all the help, especially from primo !!

IF I do another cycle some time in the future, Ill maybe give yours ago primo.

thanks

**dazbo** · 06-26-2005, 11:09 AM

Can anyone give a little more advice on the first of these threads please ???

thanks

RA · 06-26-2005, 12:13 PM

Hey Daz, what if you started the e now, got more, and turned it into an extended cycle. Heres the thing-I just dont think the e would kick in and give you any benefit with what you have.

**dazbo** · 06-26-2005, 01:44 PM

well the minimum I would want to run the Enanth would be 8 weeks so that I see the results, and I would have to use 500mg EW wouldnt I ?? Because I am not seeing anything on that amount of prop so I wouldnt think 250mg would be enough. That means, I only have 2 weeks worth right now, so Id have to buy another 8 amps of it - costing £32 extra. I really dont want to have to spend anything else because as far as Im concerned, this cycle has already been a waste of £900!! Maybe, I could get my source to swap it for 4 amps of test prop. Then do maybe 200mg EOD for the next 3 or so weeks instead of 150mg EOD. Would that be good ?? Sounds it to me???

I dont want to do a really long cycle because I get shut down easily (From my last cycle that was low sus dose and deca ) and dont want to have to use HCG .

Sound like a good plan ??

thanks so far

**dazbo** · 06-26-2005, 01:54 PM

forget that idea - my source cant swap em!!

**TRICK** · 06-26-2005, 02:45 PM

you're finding out the hard way, when people on this and other boards talk about how their strenght went through the roof. strength gains are modest as is lean muscle mass. most are exagerrating.

Originally Posted by dazbo

well the minimum I would want to run the Enanth would be 8 weeks.

your cycle should be 12 weeks, 10 weeks at the very least. you honestly won't see real strenght gains untill you're in weeks 6 7 and 8, thats why you run it 12 wks.

I dont want to do a really long cycle because I get shut down easily.

with proper research this can be avoided. sounds like to me you followed what others were doing instead of what your own goals are.

Sound like a good plan ??

not at all. i would advise you to sqaush your cycle, and sit back for 3 or 4 months or longer and research the board. and realize that you're not going to double lean muscle or strength in one cycle.

try this: set up your next cycle on paper, i garauntee you change that sucker 4 times a week for 4 months straight by reading this forum alone.

but at the end of those 4 months you'll have a better understanding of where YOU want to go and how to get there.

**dazbo** · 06-27-2005, 01:56 PM

I think you need to read through my other posts to realise that I know a lot about what I talk about on here. I do a lot of research every day and beleive my knowledge on AAS now is well above most peoples who use gear.

I am not expecting "double lean muscle or strength". I know this is impossible, if I was to double my strength I'd be benching 750lbs !!! I did this cycle as my second one after a shit first one (Where I admit I didnt do half the research I needed to). All I wanted was to either keep the same muscle while hardening up and burning fat, or gaining a little muscle along the lines. I only have 3 weeks left, I have no increased sex drive, had no gains in strength (Although I will say that I "Think" I MAY be noticing something there now after todays session of getting 320lbs on shoulder press), my vascularity has not changed (But again, I think that maybe showing a little now) and fat has definately NOT bee lost from this cycle - the main point of it.

Belevie me, my diet is spot on, I can post it if you want. And training is great.

I will say it again, I have done nothing wrong in this cycle, and not a great deal wrong in my first one (I know people who had great results with same cycle). I should have seen something well befor enow. I will not be doing another cycle again!!!

**dazbo** · 06-29-2005, 11:35 AM

Right, I think Im starting to see some results at last!

My pre cycle max bench was 350lbs, I just did a chest session today and pushed out 375lbs just to see if I could. So Im happy with that! Definate vascularity increase now also cos I can see them in my legs which I couldnt previously. Im not sure if its due to switching brands of Var tho - I now use La pharma Var instead of BD Var. The dose has now just jumped up to 60mg to see if it makes any diff.

All in all, if things go like they are, and I keep what weight I have gained so far, then I will be happy enough with my cycle but, still not happy to think about doing another one.