Anabolics
Search More Than 6,000,000 Posts
Results 1 to 7 of 7
  1. #1
    dtr98's Avatar
    dtr98 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Hos Ka Bos Ka
    Posts
    984

    milk thistle will always harm your body's ability to utilize androgens

    anyone ever heard this b4??
    milk thistle will always harm your body's ability to utilize androgens, even testosterone .

  2. #2
    48ngoin's Avatar
    48ngoin is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    South
    Posts
    239
    I've heard @ the enzyme help to liver. I'd like to see it stop 650mg of TestE from reaching my receptors! Sounds lame.

  3. #3
    rager's Avatar
    rager is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    crashing my boat
    Posts
    742
    Bs Dude

  4. #4
    punchrf's Avatar
    punchrf is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    nor cal
    Posts
    3,093
    i have a hard time believeing it could have much effect in stopping androgens. if it does have an effect i don't think it's enough to even worry about.

  5. #5
    dtr98's Avatar
    dtr98 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Hos Ka Bos Ka
    Posts
    984
    here's whai got from another board, have to look into more.

    there's persistant bullshit circulating stating that silymarin is bad to take along with orals because it increases the rate at which the liver metabolises the drug. this is false. either no effect or the opposite has been found with both alcohol and aspirin:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract

    in vitro evidence suggests that silymarin actually inhibits drug metabolism, causing steroids to circulate in the body longer. most steroid breakdown is done by the cyp3a4 enzyme, which is significantly(dose dependant, but at least a 65% slower rate) inhibited by silymarin:

    http://dmd.aspetjournals.org/cgi/con...ull/28/11/1270

    so why have users reported decreased steroid effects when using silymarin when the opposite should be true?

    i found this study which has fascinating consequences:

    http://carcin.oupjournals.org/cgi/co...full/22/9/1399

    a choice excerpt:

    "SB decreased androgen-stimulated growth and prostate-specific antigen (PSA) levels in LNCaP cells (6). In this study, we further evaluated the effects of SM and SB on androgen action. We found that SM and SB down-regulate several androgen-regulated genes, including PSA, human glandular kallikrein (hK2) and an immunophilin, FKBP51, mainly by inhibiting the transactivation activity of the AR. More interestingly, we show that SM and SB can inhibit nuclear localization of the AR. Thus this report provides a novel mechanism by which SM and SB inhibit function of the AR."

    or, in plain(er) english, when an androgen comes to a cell it passes through the cell membrane and binds to an androgen receptor in the cytoplasm. upon binding, the receptor/androgen bundle float to the nucleus to tell which tell the cell to alter its behaviour, i.e. in this case, "synthesize more protein and grow larger". different androgens probably relay different messages, which is why particular stacks seem to be more effective than others, despite all binding to the same receptor.

    silymarin inhibits this either by preventing androgen/receptor bundles from ever reaching the nucleus, or by allowing the bundle to drift out of the nucleus easily once there.

    i.e. all androgens, oral or injectable, will not work nearly as well. avoid silymarin, and please spread the word. feel free to repost this anywhere with proper acknowledgements to both marble and getbig

  6. #6
    crizoc's Avatar
    crizoc is offline Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Jacksonville, FL
    Posts
    146
    yes its true. while on milk thistle since it helps ur liver regenerate faster, it will filter out more than normal. but not using milk thistle and getting better results is an adverse reaction from ur liver being broken down more than it would have had u protected it with MT

  7. #7
    dtr98's Avatar
    dtr98 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Hos Ka Bos Ka
    Posts
    984
    true, do you stay on thru cycle?
    i use just while i'm on orals

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •