Hcg

[toiletcake]

I am on my 6th injection of Test Cyp. The cycle is 10 weeks of Cyp at 200mg per week along with 3iu's 5/2 indefinetly. My first hrt doc said to run the HCG after the 10th week of Cyp. Well, I left that Doctor and started with a new Doc b/c the prices were much better. This new doctor says that I should be on the HCG now and not when I finish the Cyp. Whats the best way to handle this issue?

[G-1000]

i like to shoot two weeks befor pct.

[toiletcake]

What doseage is the best way to handle this? My doc says I dont need pct based on my igf and test levels being so extrelemy low. Is this good advice?

[G-1000]

i do 2000iu eod.

[toiletcake]

OK, sounds good

[JohnnyB]

i do 2000iu eod.

At that dose you rasing estrogen.

Posted by hhajdo at S’ology

Differential effect of single high dose and divided small dose administration of human chorionic gonadotropin on Leydig cell steroidogenic desensitization.

Smals AG, Pieters GF, Boers GH, Raemakers JM, Hermus AR, Benraad TJ, Kloppenborg PW.

This study compared the effect of a single high dose of hCG (1500 IU) with that of the same dose administered in multiple small doses (300 IU, once daily for 5 days) on Leydig cell steroidogenesis. Administration of a single high dose of hCG to seven healthy men raised the mean plasma testosterone (T) level to peak levels 2.1 +/- 0.2 (SEM) X the baseline value at 48 h. Thereafter plasma T decreased to below normal (0.7 +/- 0.1 X baseline) 7 days after the injection. The mean 17-hydroxyprogesterone (17-OHP) level peaked at 24 h (2.5 +/- 0.2 X baseline) and then also fell to a nadir value of 0.6 +/- 0.2 X baseline on day 7. Reflecting the early accumulation of 17-OHP over T, the 17 OHP/T ratio reached its maximum (1.6 +/- 0.1 X baseline) at 24 h at the same time when plasma estradiol [(E2) 4.4 +/- 0.6 X baseline] and the ratio E2/T (2.7 +/- 0.3 X baseline) achieved their maximal values. Administration of 1500 IU hCG in five divided doses of 300 IU daily increased the mean plasma T levels to peak value of 2.1 +/- 0.2 X baseline at 5 days and the levels remained elevated thereafter. The response of T as reflected by the area under the curve was almost twice as great as in the single dose study (2844 +/- 360 vs. 1647 +/- 214). In contrast to the single high dose experiment, mean plasma 17-OHP levels in the divided dose protocol did not peak at 24 h but only gradually increased. As the increase of T exceeded the 17-OHP increase at almost all time intervals, no accumulation of 17-OHP over T occurred as in the single dose experiment. Instead the 17-OHP/T ratio fell to a nadir value of 0.6 +/- 0.1 X baseline on day 7. The initial E2 peak was absent in the divided dose protocol and the E2/T ratio only marginally increased. Considering both experiments together a close relation was found between the hCG-induced increases in E2 and 17-OHP (r = +0.88, P less than 0.001), as well as the ratio 17 OHP/T (r = +0.64, P less than 0.02).

JohnnyB

[toiletcake]

So, should I divide the dosage into 5 days like the study shows? Is 5 days enough to stop testicular atrophy from becoming an issue?

[JohnnyB]

You could do the 5 injection, then do scheduled injections of 300-500iu every 3-5 days

JohnnyB

[G-1000]

At that dose you rasing estrogen.

Posted by hhajdo at S’ology

Differential effect of single high dose and divided small dose administration of human chorionic gonadotropin on Leydig cell steroidogenic desensitization.

Smals AG, Pieters GF, Boers GH, Raemakers JM, Hermus AR, Benraad TJ, Kloppenborg PW.

This study compared the effect of a single high dose of hCG (1500 IU) with that of the same dose administered in multiple small doses (300 IU, once daily for 5 days) on Leydig cell steroidogenesis. Administration of a single high dose of hCG to seven healthy men raised the mean plasma testosterone (T) level to peak levels 2.1 +/- 0.2 (SEM) X the baseline value at 48 h. Thereafter plasma T decreased to below normal (0.7 +/- 0.1 X baseline) 7 days after the injection. The mean 17-hydroxyprogesterone (17-OHP) level peaked at 24 h (2.5 +/- 0.2 X baseline) and then also fell to a nadir value of 0.6 +/- 0.2 X baseline on day 7. Reflecting the early accumulation of 17-OHP over T, the 17 OHP/T ratio reached its maximum (1.6 +/- 0.1 X baseline) at 24 h at the same time when plasma estradiol [(E2) 4.4 +/- 0.6 X baseline] and the ratio E2/T (2.7 +/- 0.3 X baseline) achieved their maximal values. Administration of 1500 IU hCG in five divided doses of 300 IU daily increased the mean plasma T levels to peak value of 2.1 +/- 0.2 X baseline at 5 days and the levels remained elevated thereafter. The response of T as reflected by the area under the curve was almost twice as great as in the single dose study (2844 +/- 360 vs. 1647 +/- 214). In contrast to the single high dose experiment, mean plasma 17-OHP levels in the divided dose protocol did not peak at 24 h but only gradually increased. As the increase of T exceeded the 17-OHP increase at almost all time intervals, no accumulation of 17-OHP over T occurred as in the single dose experiment. Instead the 17-OHP/T ratio fell to a nadir value of 0.6 +/- 0.1 X baseline on day 7. The initial E2 peak was absent in the divided dose protocol and the E2/T ratio only marginally increased. Considering both experiments together a close relation was found between the hCG-induced increases in E2 and 17-OHP (r = +0.88, P less than 0.001), as well as the ratio 17 OHP/T (r = +0.64, P less than 0.02).

JohnnyB

when i do the 2000 i am on my last week of l-dex and then i up my noly getting ready for pct.

[G-1000]

that is the first tim ei have see that. im going to look into it a little more. if that is the case i would just shoot 500 ed for 3 weeks

[Jay J]

If you are on TRT, it is for life. If your Dr. wants you to cycle it, find a new Doc. You should be using HCG during your treatment because there should not be a cycle. There should not be a stopping point. TRT is something you do every week from now on. The best way to use HCG is to take 250 iu two days before your shot & again the day before your shot. This should keep your nuts like nuts & not marbles. This comes from Dr. John Crisler who is one of if not the top TRT Doc in the country. You can find info on him at www.allthingsmale.com & he is a regular at Mesorx.com on the HRT board. You can ask him and several other knowledgable guys questions and get very good info on your treatment. Hang around there for a couple of months & you will know more about your treatment than your family Doc. I can tell you this from experience. I tell my Doc what labs to run and how much of things I should take. Your general practitioner will probably know very little about TRT. If you go to an endo your chances are better but most endos don't know a lot about TRT. If you can get to Lansing, MI it would be best just to go see DR. John. If I can help you out PM me. Hope this helps.