Best steroids fo your joints?

[catlovesfood]

Everybody gets injured sooner or later, what steroids helped rebuild/repair your joints, and how much?

[catlovesfood]

bump

[wolfyEVH]

deca

and don't bump a thread when its only 7 minutes old

[Almost There]

im not sure if they exactly rebuild or repair your joints, but eq and deca somewhat lube them and make them not hurt as much

[mark956101957]

Deca , EQ or anavar !

[catlovesfood]

how much deca or equipose is required to ease the joints?

[catlovesfood]

bump this

[edmen2]

how much deca or equipose is required to ease the joints?

150 mg of deca not sure about eq.

[catlovesfood]

Is anavar used for your joints?

[dirtyvegas]

do a search on collegen synthesis, i think its called. this has been posted before a few weeks ago or so.

~dv~

[IBdmfkr]

I would say GH and IGF-1 long as far as repairing damage.

[catlovesfood]

do a search on collegen synthesis, i think its called. this has been posted before a few weeks ago or so.

Yeah, Im the one who posted it, I didnt get much feed back at all.

[catlovesfood]

I would say GH and IGF-1 long as far as repairing damage.

Don't you think that AAS would be a better choice?

[IBdmfkr]

cheaper alternative, might mask the problem. Surgery would be the best solution.

[catlovesfood]

Surgery would be the worst thing to do in my opinion, The joint will never be the same.

[catlovesfood]

I think is you can stimulate your body to repair the damge it would be better than surgery

[catlovesfood]

i seem to be answering my own questions...

[IBdmfkr]

from what I understand you cannot repair cartilage on your own.. Tendons and ligaments can be repaired by the body but not cartilage. Isn't that what your question was originally referring to?

[catlovesfood]

but from what I have read on IGF-1, it seems to regrow new cartilage cells..

from what I understand you cannot repair cartilage on your own.. Tendons and ligaments can be repaired by the body but not cartilage. Isn't that what your question was originally referring to?

Isn't tendons, ligaments, and catrilage the same thing?

[IBdmfkr]

umm.. no tendons ligaments and cartilage are not the same thing.. oh my.

[edmen2]

umm.. no tendons ligaments and cartilage are not the same thing.. oh my.

deca improves collagen synthesis by 10 x faster than the normal healing process. i researched it to try and fix my knee last cycle only prob is i didnt get to reap the benfits cause i only ran it for 6 wks cause it made my b/p skyrocket. i did run it with test with a few cycles under my belt so i knew what was raising my b/p once i dropped the deca my b/p lowered to a high normal that test always does to me.

[edmen2]

stop being lazy and read this link!
http://67.18.108.244/showthread.php?t=131230

[IBdmfkr]

deca improves collagen synthesis by 10 x faster than the normal healing process. i researched it to try and fix my knee last cycle only prob is i didnt get to reap the benfits cause i only ran it for 6 wks cause it made my b/p skyrocket. i did run it with test with a few cycles under my belt so i knew what was raising my b/p once i dropped the deca my b/p lowered to a high normal that test always does to me.

what did this have to do with tendons, ligaments and cartilage being the same?

[edmen2]

what did this have to do with tendons, ligaments and cartilage being the same?

r u trying to help or start shit regardless of tendons ligaments and cartilage im trying to help the guy not give him a lesson in anatomy and physiology.

[IBdmfkr]

I don't understand what your saying, but by giving him info on deca didn't help his problem. He doesn't know what a tendon is so he might just need to know some anatomy, being that it is important to know the human body if you are trying to bodybuild. edmen I think your free thyroxine levels might be a little high. calm down.

[blodget2000]

Deca durabolin has been established as a great soother of sore joints and tendons

http://www.dianabol.info/Decadurabolin.htm

[edmen2]

I don't understand what your saying, but by giving him info on deca didn't help his problem. He doesn't know what a tendon is so he might just need to know some anatomy, being that it is important to know the human body if you are trying to bodybuild. edmen I think your free thyroxine levels might be a little high. calm down.

in his original post he asked what would help his injured joints the deca link was meant for him. regardless of what it is tendon which connects muscle to the bone or ligament which attaches a bone to another bone or cartilage which keeps bones from rubbing together he wants to make his joints feel better without surgery and i came to one conclusion during my research "deca" if it works cool if not sorry!

[IBdmfkr]

[Power Viking]

Estandron is also known to lube your joints. I have a sore left knee, and at least its not getting worse now that I`m on estandron, doesn`t seem to get any better either, though.

[100m champ]

I would say deca and igf-1 is the best for joints

[KINGKONG]

Test and deca !!!GH and IGF-1 oh my!!

[goalkeeper]

deca bro

[Property of Steroid.com]

To aid your joints, you want aromatizing steroids and progestins like deca , and you need to avoid DHT-derived steroids like Winstrol . Here's why you want those steroids to aromatize (convert to estrogen) to help your joints:

Estrogen exerts what is known as a a biphasic ( two phase) effect. At low amounts, it is proinflammatory, because it stimulates the TH1 arm (I'll explain that a little later) of the immune system (cellular immunity) and inflammation. In high(er) amounts, it is actually an anti-inflamatory (2). So when you take very strong anti-estrogens (or aromatase inhibitors), you both lose water (because estrogen causes water retention) as well as get sore joints because of the proinflammatory effects you get from having such low levels of estrogen. Letrozole , which reduces blood plasma levels of estrogen due to aromatase inhibition, is the best example of this, because it is infamous for causing aching joints. Letrozole, decreases both aromatase activity (aromatase is the enzyme responsible for conversion of testosterone to estrogen as you already know) as well as (obviously) plasma levels of estrogen, and in addition reduces progesterone levels (3)....and you only need 100mcg of Letrozole to inhibit aromatase activity(4)- making it a very potent aromatase inhibitor. This is why when people take Letrozole, they claim it takes "water out of their joints" and makes them ache. Again, this is total bullshit. You now know the real reason that Letro can make your joints ache. Lowering estrogen will lower your water retention, but also take away some of your body's ability to have estrogen mediated anti-inflammatory reactions to weight training. You lose water and your joints hurt...hence...people say you lose water from your joints, and that makes them hurt. Its true that you lose subcutanous water, but it's simply not true that losing this water will make your joints hurt...it's the loss of estrogen and progesterone that is behind the aching joints here. We can also make the claim that Testosterone, can have some anti-inflamatory effects both through it's aromatization to estrogen is as well as it's effects on corticosteroids. This too, is well documented.

T helper 1 (TH1) cells secrete proinflammatory cytokines as well as promoting cell-mediated immune responses, whereas TH2 cells trigger antibody production (2). Simple enough? . Sex hormones (such as progesterone) that promote the development of a TH2 response also happen to antagonize the emergence of TH1 cells. Hence, when progesterone levels are (or the PgR, progesterone receptor) is stimulated, you'll have more anti-inflammatory cytokines floating around and less proinflammatory cytokines. Aspirin, Tylenol, and all of the over the counter anti-inflammatories are also useful as painkillers. Anti-inflammatory effects are often highly correlated with pain killing activity. What happens when women with arthritis get pregnant? Yeah, thats right, a reduction in symptoms and pain in their joints. Is this due to pregesterone and estrogen increasing during pregnancy, and the inti-inflammatory effects they bring? Yeah, probably....I'll support that leap.

If you're still with me, you now know that progesterone, like testosterone, both stimulates humoral immunity (the TH2) and suppresses cellular immunity (TH1 response). Ergo, progesterone has anti-inflammatory action. Deca is what, boys and girls? Thats right, it's a progestin, meaning it stimulates the progesterone receptor. And thats why it alleviates joint pains. Remember that old idea that deca promotes "water-retention" in the joints, and thats why it helps your joints feel soothed? Bullshit. You just read the real reason deca helps joints. Deca actually works both as an androgen, which have the well documented ability to exert effects on corticosteroids to diminish inflamation, and it also acts as progestin to reduce inflammation.

On the other hand, lets look at DHT and DHT-derived steroids (Winstrol) and why they can hurt your joints:

DHT administration has been found to decrease estrogen levels because the majority of circulating estrogen in men is derived from peripheral conversion of androgens or androgenic precursors (1). DHT directly inhibits estrogens activity on tissues, either by acting as a competitive antagonist to the estrogen receptor or by decreasing estrogen receptor binding. Either way way, it has two mechanisms of possible action in peripheral tissue.
DHT and its metabolites have also been shown to inhibit aromatiziation (conversion of testosterone to estrogen via the aromatase enzyme). Indeed, DHT, androsterone, and 5alpha-androstandione are all potent inhibitors of the formation of estrone from androstenedione. Finally, DHT acts on the HPTA to decrease the secretion of gonadotropins (it inhibits it). In fact, it's so potent at reducing estrogen that transdermal DHT gel has been used to treat gynocomastia by applying pure DHT gel to the affected area(5)(6), since estrogen is the primary culprit in gyno (8), although we know that progesterone can be synergistic with estrogen in this (and other) respects(s).
DHT also has a negative effect on Progesterone biosynthesis in cells (7),and even has the ability to inhibit progesterone elevation caused by estrogen (10). Therefore DHT would be (and is) very effective in reducing gyno because it reduces both estrogen as well as progesterone. This property holds with DHT-derived steroids, for the most part as well, since Masteron has been found to have similar effects in reducing breast tissue tumors(9), which is what gyno is (albeit benign).

Well, by now, you should be aware that a reduction in both of those hormones (Estrogen and Progesterone) is caused by DHT, and therefore, by DHT-Derivations, which carry many of the same properties and produce similar metabolites.

And this reduction in Estrogen/Progesterone, caused by DHT, reduces your body's production anti-inflammatory and painkilling cytokines. And this, finally, is what causes Winstrol, Masteron, etc... to cause Joint Pain.

SO now you should be able to figure out which steroids ought to help your joints, and which will hurt them.

References:

1. MacDonald PC, Madden JD, Brenner PF, Wilson JD, Siiteri PK 1979 Origin of estrogen in normal men and in women with testicular feminization. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 49:905–916
2. Science, Vol 283, Issue 5406, 1277-1278 , 26 February 1999
3. Eur J Obstet Gynecol Reprod Biol. 2002 Nov 15;105(2):161-5.
4. J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1995 Sep;80(9):2658-60.
5. Successful percutaneous dihydrotestosterone treatment of gynecomastia occurring during highly active antiretroviral therapy: four cases and a review of the literature.
   Clin Infect Dis. 2001 Sep 15;33(6):891-3. Epub 2001 Aug 10.
6. Androgens and the immunocompetence handicap hypothesis: unraveling direct and indirect pathways of immunosuppression in song sparrows.
   Am Nat. 2004 Oct;164(4):490-505. Epub 2004 Sep 1.
7. Nippon Sanka Fujinka Gakkai Zasshi. 1988 Mar;40(3):331-7.
8. Progesterone is not essential to the differentiative potential of mammary epithelium in the male mouse. Freeman, Topper. Endocrinology. 1978 Jul;103(1):186-92
9. Eur J Cancer Clin Oncol. 1983 Sep;19(9):1231-7.
10. Biol Reprod. 1989 Jun;40(6):1201-7.

Originally found ON www.bodybuilding4life.com .

[Darkness]

As usual hooker shines again.

[Property of Steroid.com]

Nah...It took me like...8 hours to research & write that...JuicyR6 wanted to know why Masteron was hurting his joints...so I took basically a whole day to figure that out and write it. Then I posted it on BB4L....I'm just reposting it here for shits and giggles.

[catlovesfood]

so hooker your saying....that progestins help heal the joints, and that taking a strong anti-e reduces its effectiveness?

So doesn't that mean that tren also heals joints?

And can I ask about LR3 IGF-1? Does that heal joints? Ive read your profile but JonnyB said your profile on IGF-1 is not the same as LR3 IGF-1....

A little help?

[catlovesfood]

hooker?

[Property of Steroid.com]

so hooker your saying....that progestins help heal the joints, and that taking a strong anti-e reduces its effectiveness?

So doesn't that mean that tren also heals joints?

And can I ask about LR3 IGF-1? Does that heal joints? Ive read your profile but JonnyB said your profile on IGF-1 is not the same as LR3 IGF-1....

A little help?

Yes, to the first 2 questions.

Re: Tren

I would speculate that tren reduceces cortisol and muscle glucocorticoid action too much to be of use in joint healing; also since itdoesn't aromatize, it loses that (estrogenic) mechanism of healing/bone-repair/etc... as well.

[cubanojoe]

Deca is a great anti imflamatory and can help with your joint problems.

Another problem with AAs usuage is that you get water retention that places stess on the joints and makes them hurt.

Not sure about IGF but HGH espically first time users it will make your joints hurt like crazy. I guess it would depend on the dosage but I am taking 4 IU's a day and never had any joint problems until I started on that stuff. It is supposed to go away after 6 or 7 weeks or at least decrease.

[catlovesfood]

Its gonna be my third cycle, I want to know does LR3 IGF-1 help rebuild joints, ligaments, tendons etc. Could I get some real answers from Hooker please? (I have posted similar questions on the HGH & IGF-1 Board, but no real answers so help me out Anthony)