Tribulus doesent work?

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09-04-2005, 11:17 AM
Titan1

Tribulus doesent work?

Ethnopharmacol. 2005 Jun 30
The aphrodisiac herb Tribulus terrestris does not influence the androgen production in young men.
Neychev VK, Mitev VI.

Department of Chemistry and Biochemistry, Medical University, 2 Zdrave str., Sofia-1431, Bulgaria.

OBJECTIVE:: The aim of the current study is to investigate the influence of Tribulus terrestris extract on androgen metabolism in young males. DESIGN AND METHODS:: Twenty-one healthy young 20-36 years old men with body weight ranging from 60 to 125kg were randomly separated into three groups-two experimental (each n=7) and a control (placebo) one (n=7). The experimental groups were named TT1 and TT2 and the subjects were assigned to consume 20 and 10mg/kg body weight per day of Tribulus terrestris extract, respectively, separated into three daily intakes for 4 weeks. Testosterone, androstenedione and luteinizing hormone levels in the serum were measured 24h before supplementation (clear probe), and at 24, 72, 240, 408 and 576h from the beginning of the supplementation. RESULTS:: There was no significant difference between Tribulus terrestris supplemented groups and controls in the serum testosterone (TT1 (mean+/-S.D.: 15.75+/-1.75nmol/l); TT2 (mean+/-S.D.: 16.32+/-1.57nmol/l); controls (mean+/-S.D.: 17.74+/-1.09nmol/l) (p>0.05)), androstenedione (TT1 (mean+/-S.D.: 1.927+/-0.126ng/ml); TT2 (mean+/-S.D.: 2.026+/-0.256ng/ml); controls (mean+/-S.D.: 1.952+/-0.236ng/ml) (p>0.05)) or luteinizing hormone (TT1 (mean+/-S.D.: 4.662+/-0.274U/l); TT2 (mean+/-S.D.: 4.103+/-0.869U/l); controls (mean+/-S.D.: 4.170+/-0.406U/l) (p>0.05)) levels. All results were within the normal range. The findings in the current study anticipate that Tribulus terrestris steroid saponins possess neither direct nor indirect androgen-increasing properties. The study will be extended in the clarifying the probable mode of action of Tribulus terrestris steroid saponins.

PMID: 15994038 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]
09-04-2005, 11:42 AM
Bryan2

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titan1

Ethnopharmacol. 2005 Jun 30
The aphrodisiac herb Tribulus terrestris does not influence the androgen production in young men.
Neychev VK, Mitev VI.

Department of Chemistry and Biochemistry, Medical University, 2 Zdrave str., Sofia-1431, Bulgaria.

OBJECTIVE:: The aim of the current study is to investigate the influence of Tribulus terrestris extract on androgen metabolism in young males. DESIGN AND METHODS:: Twenty-one healthy young 20-36 years old men with body weight ranging from 60 to 125kg were randomly separated into three groups-two experimental (each n=7) and a control (placebo) one (n=7). The experimental groups were named TT1 and TT2 and the subjects were assigned to consume 20 and 10mg/kg body weight per day of Tribulus terrestris extract, respectively, separated into three daily intakes for 4 weeks. Testosterone, androstenedione and luteinizing hormone levels in the serum were measured 24h before supplementation (clear probe), and at 24, 72, 240, 408 and 576h from the beginning of the supplementation. RESULTS:: There was no significant difference between Tribulus terrestris supplemented groups and controls in the serum testosterone (TT1 (mean+/-S.D.: 15.75+/-1.75nmol/l); TT2 (mean+/-S.D.: 16.32+/-1.57nmol/l); controls (mean+/-S.D.: 17.74+/-1.09nmol/l) (p>0.05)), androstenedione (TT1 (mean+/-S.D.: 1.927+/-0.126ng/ml); TT2 (mean+/-S.D.: 2.026+/-0.256ng/ml); controls (mean+/-S.D.: 1.952+/-0.236ng/ml) (p>0.05)) or luteinizing hormone (TT1 (mean+/-S.D.: 4.662+/-0.274U/l); TT2 (mean+/-S.D.: 4.103+/-0.869U/l); controls (mean+/-S.D.: 4.170+/-0.406U/l) (p>0.05)) levels. All results were within the normal range. The findings in the current study anticipate that Tribulus terrestris steroid saponins possess neither direct nor indirect androgen-increasing properties. The study will be extended in the clarifying the probable mode of action of Tribulus terrestris steroid saponins.

PMID: 15994038 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

All of these studies that I have seen always severly underdose for bbing purposes.

600mgs of tribulus isnt going to offer the same benefits as the prefered standard dose that is 5 grams +.

I still dont believe that tribulus works all that well But I do believe that it does work to some extent.

Its main problem is that it has a short halflife and doesnt allow for sustained increase in test production.

The main use is for PCT or specifically before a workout to increase test and I guess that this is good in terms of building slightly elevated test levels for building muscle but nothing dramatic.

Look inot longjack which IS backup up with scientific studies that have shown it does raise test levels.

Of course you still fall into the same category of the very short half life problem.
09-04-2005, 12:16 PM
stupidhippo

yup, very low doses on that study. I also dont believe tribulus does that much but would like to know that does it possibloy help a lil in PCT or not...
09-04-2005, 12:19 PM
ward065

5 grams of trib? that would be quite a few pills

i heard that 1g for pct is enough trib to take, or about 2 pills as if you did too many more G's, you would raise estrogen levels? anyone know?
09-04-2005, 12:20 PM
Papi93

I used tribulus are a natural test booster, off-cycle, and it caused my skin to become very oily. I was using above 5 grams ED. Isn't oily skin a side effect of increased test levels?
09-04-2005, 12:21 PM
ward065

Quote:

Originally Posted by striker93

I used tribulus are a natural test booster, off-cycle, and it caused my skin to become very oily. I was using above 5 grams ED. Isn't oily skin a side effect of increased test levels?

when i was on cycle i sweated like a beast, working out and having sex...

oily skin= sweaty skin?
09-04-2005, 12:25 PM
Papi93

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward065

when i was on cycle i sweated like a beast, working out and having sex...

oily skin= sweaty skin?

This was after I had just taken a shower. It did not take long before my skin was covered with a thin layer of oil.
09-04-2005, 12:27 PM
Titan1

But has anyone seen a study where Tribulus actually works?
09-04-2005, 12:33 PM
ward065

Quote:

Originally Posted by striker93

This was after I had just taken a shower. It did not take long before my skin was covered with a thin layer of oil.

oh, that is weird, i never developed oil on my skin.
09-04-2005, 12:37 PM
Papi93

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward065

oh, that is weird, i never developed oil on my skin.

I never did either until I was using over 5 grams a day. It might go back to its short half-life. The high doses, spread throughout the day, might be required in order to have enough circulating in your system :scratch: .
09-04-2005, 12:40 PM
Papi93

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward065

5 grams of trib? that would be quite a few pills

i heard that 1g for pct is enough trib to take, or about 2 pills as if you did too many more G's, you would raise estrogen levels? anyone know?

From what I have read, tribulus does raise estrogen levels significantly. I am not prone to gyno so when I was using high dosages; I didn't have a problem with gyno. If you're prone to gyno, then it might be a different story. If you're using an AI in PCT, wouldn't this negate the estrogen anyway? I really haven't heard many members complaining about tribulus gyno.
09-04-2005, 01:38 PM
Smak

All Tribulus isn't Tribulus. Tribulus terrestris, on its own, doesn't do anything. There's not enough protodioscin in the plant to have any positive effects at all That's why Optimum Nutrition's brand is standardized to 40% furastanol saponins therefore won't do shit for you and is a waste to take. Be careful when choosing your Tribulus. You need to go with a brand such as Biotest or Somapharm whos products contain Avena sativa and are standardized for protodiocin%. Make sure your extract is standardized for protodiocin%, not just frustanol saponins%. Steroidal saponin protodiocin is what stimulates the production of LH, thereby increasing testosterone levels.
09-04-2005, 02:44 PM
ward065

Quote:

Originally Posted by smak dat puzz

All Tribulus isn't Tribulus. Tribulus terrestris, on its own, doesn't do anything. There's not enough protodioscin in the plant to have any positive effects at all That's why Optimum Nutrition's brand is standardized to 40% furastanol saponins therefore won't do shit for you and is a waste to take. Be careful when choosing your Tribulus. You need to go with a brand such as Biotest or Somapharm whos products contain Avena sativa and are standardized for protodiocin%. Make sure your extract is standardized for protodiocin%, not just frustanol saponins%. Steroidal saponin protodiocin is what stimulates the production of LH, thereby increasing testosterone levels.

optimum nutrition tribulus is what i bought, $10 for 100 caps, hehe u are saying i wasted my money? well hopefully i am getting something
09-04-2005, 04:41 PM
Papi93

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward065

optimum nutrition tribulus is what i bought, $10 for 100 caps, hehe u are saying i wasted my money? well hopefully i am getting something

Optimum Nutrition's Tribulus is the product that I used as well. It attracts everyone because of the price. I guess you get what you pay for.
09-04-2005, 05:28 PM
Smak

Yea get some Tribex or Tribestan. ON won't do anything for you.
09-04-2005, 05:39 PM
ward065

Quote:

Originally Posted by smak dat puzz

Yea get some Tribex or Tribestan. ON won't do anything for you.

it's hard to tell if it has, regardless i know my natural test has been restored now, maybe that is why
09-04-2005, 06:27 PM
Papi93

Quote:

Originally Posted by smak dat puzz

Yea get some Tribex or Tribestan. ON won't do anything for you.

When I used Tribex, I remember reading an article at t-nation.com that said tribex raised test levels to high-normal. They claim their product is university tested. Why do members say that they can not find studies that prove tribulus raises test levels? I guess I'm confused on this subject :scratch: .