How natural should u be before u start?

So a friend of mine started coming to the gym with me. I wrote him up a little workout plan and even a diet hes been at it for about 3-4 months now doing really well never misses a day and its shown. My friend however is about 6'2" and only about 160-165lbs well at first he was seeing good results but now everything has slowed down on him, so of course he wants to turn to the darkside. I keep tellin him to get as much natural as he can but he doesn't really care hes got the money to blow on it. Is there any real reasons other than money why he shouldn't start untill he reaches his natural max?... and don't worry, yes it is a friend of mine.

I think he needs info from the diet sticky. He should be able to gain more natty. Hes not eating or training enough.

he has to gain more weight naturally, 6'2" 160lbs is skinny bro. HHe needs to re-evaluate his training/diet. I was 172lbs @ 6'0" when I started working out correctly and eating correctly, naturally I gained 18lbs in 2 yrs and a half. Then I started AS, again check his diet/training.

if hes only beign training for 3 to 4 months hes got a long way to go before he starts using roinds. i say this because he is obviously no eating enought. yes he did get good results at first but thats from the shok his body took. now he need to get into a good diet AND KEEP TRAINING AS YOU LEARN MORE ABOUT YOUR BODY AND FITNESS OR BODYBUILDING IT SELF BEFORE HE DOES ROIDS.
you might have some knowledge to take him through a cycle...but before that i strongly belive he needs knowledg about dieting training and his own body before even going into cycle.

good luck tho peace

See thats what i've been tellin him... and he promises me that he eats enough i think hes full of 5hit.

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Originally Posted by ToTheBuckeT21

See thats what i've been tellin him... and he promises me that he eats enough i think hes full of 5hit.

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I must agree, he is full of sh**. If not he would be gaining weight, maybe he's eating incorrectly, not necessarily enough

when i started workin out at age 15 i was 5'9 130lbs. By the end of that year after research on diet, supplements, etc. I was a solid 165 with 12% bf. Age 15

well i'll tell him but i doubt its gonna do much of anything... when someone has their mind set on something.. kinda like when someone wants to do a deca only no matter how much we tell them not too

what do u suppose is the worst of things that could happen to him if he started out now... Other than its a waste of money and he could have got the results natural, would it be harder for him to keep gains etc.. any input?

if he's not gaining, he's not eating more than likely. Taking steroids and not eating wont do much for him either, other than lower his bank account. You need to inform him that steroids arent miracle drugs, and they require hard work and dedication with training, diet, and rest. Dont let him think that he's gonna get big and ripped without those factors b/c it wont happen

no way hes eating correctly at 6'2 165

i used to be like your friend......... never was able to lift any more weight no matter what i did. Bench press was like stuck at 200 for 4 reps. Tried to work out more but it didn't work. I Was fustrated and Pissed.

i didn't turn to juice then.....no. i re evaulated what i was doing and i found some problems

a) i was not getting sufficent sleep 50% of the time. Some nights i would sleep for 4 hours. I would go to the gym and feel tired and really awful sometimes, and force myself to go through the workout (in which i really only went through the motions, not concentrating on the muscle since my rest was insufficent)

b) My diet did not have a proper amount of protien. I added an evening meal and more to my post workout shake. My evening meal was a good sized serving of chicken and rice on most nights. This was probably the biggest reason of them all why i was held back. I upped my protein intake by 100g per day and my carb intake by about 50g. God, it made a huge difference.

c) I could have been overtraining myself trying to get bigger, counter-acting the effort. Since i was not eating enough and did not gain any weight, my training time wasn't productive at all.

When i got things in order i increased my bench from 200x4 to 265x8 in about 5 months. Naturally (with creatine though).

Now this was about 1 1/2 years ago and my bench stagnated a little above that for awhile, well then i turned to juice and broke through what i believe were indeed serious plateaus.

Yeah, he is going to make excuses about how good he eats to justify AAS use. You should be in the irongame for at least a few years before going to AASs.

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Originally Posted by ToTheBuckeT21

what do u suppose is the worst of things that could happen to him if he started out now... Other than its a waste of money and he could have got the results natural, would it be harder for him to keep gains etc.. any input?

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He will grow but he will loose all or most of it after cycle. If you dont know how to eat to gain weight natty imagine how hard it would be trying to maintain a body 20, 30, 40 lbs heavier. Its a joke.

All very good points, i'll prob make him read this page to convince him... actually now that i'm readin this i wonder if i started to early... ward065 that bench increase is pretty amazing natural

actually since we are on the subject of bench increasing i've noticed lately that after i bench i don't feel it near as much in my chest as i do in my arms... you guys have any tips or ideas of what i may be doin wrong or what i could change to make it more effective?

I was 6-4 190lbs at 18 with 6%body fat. and I jsut started to resistance train at that age.

Your friend is abnormally skinny, its unhealthy. He should be 200lbs before he considers AAS use. I waited until 235lbs at 14% BF

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Originally Posted by ToTheBuckeT21

actually since we are on the subject of bench increasing i've noticed lately that after i bench i don't feel it near as much in my chest as i do in my arms... you guys have any tips or ideas of what i may be doin wrong or what i could change to make it more effective?

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Look at your form...and your grip...have they changed?

Simple things that one does subconsciously to make an exercise easier can redirect the stress from a major area to a minor one.

Are you keeping your upper arms perpendicular to your torso tru-out the movement?

To you (try to) stick your chest your chest out tru-out both the pressing and lowering parts of the exercise? Allowing your chest to sink inwards, thus allowing your shoulders to rol foward, redirects the stress to delts and tris.

Is your grip to narrow?

It could be a myriad factors.

~Nark