09-25-2005, 09:37 PM #1
What you should know about Police <======
Letís face it, when you are being sweated by the police you donít usually think clearly. You start to believe what they tell you are facts; you start to forget your rights. Cops can lie to you all they want and itís perfectly legal, what they are trying to do in most cases is get you to admit to guilt. This is done in many ways, they may pressure you to search your car, your home, and open packages that they suspect Ėor even know- contain contraband. But when it comes to dealing with police you must know the golden truism ďItís not what you know itís what you can prove.Ē Remembering this in time of crisis will get you through many hard times that you may normally succumb to.
Letís look at a few examples. Supposedly you answer a knock on your door and there are police there with the fed ex guy and they want you to sign and claim a package. You know itís illegal, they know itís illegal so why in your right mind would you do so? Surprisingly many guys do. Why? The pressure of the situation dulls their thoughts and jolts their nerves; this is natural. You must keep calm and think clearly. If you just deny the package, they will most likely start to try and relax you. You may hear things like ďIf itís just for personal use itís okÖjust signĒ or ďwe just need you to sign it, if you donít open it you wonít be in any trouble.Ē These are flat out lies! Remember they KNOW that you have purchased illegal goods, and you KNOW they know. However, they must prove in court that you did. Think of it this way, if they had a case against you they would arrest you on spot. They aren't going to waste their time talking to you if they already have what they need for a conviction. So pretty much if the cops are trying to sell you an idea, you are in the relative clear provided you keep your head. If you deny the package no matter what do not sign for it, they will have no case, and worst case scenario is they arrest you and you are out in 24 hours.
This brings me to another misconception about police. Understand please that any cop can arrest you at any time for anything. Thatís right, if you look at him funny and heís had a bad day you can go to jail! Anybody that tells you differently doesnít know shit. By law, the longest you can be held in jail is I think 24 hours (this may vary per state) without being formally charged with a crime. Once that time is up you are released and do not have to go to court or get a lawyer. Now letís get back to the package. Worst case if you donít sign/accept the package is they arrest you, and release you on lack of evidence. They cannot prove you intentionally ordered with intent to use if you deny it from the beginning. So relax!
Sometimes you will have cops show up with these packages demanding to search your house. Now pay close attention! IF POLICE DO NOT HAVE A WARRANT NEVER LET THEM IN YOUR HOUSE! The only other way they could enter would be if there was an emergency inside. Similarly with cars, if a police officer has no probable cause to search your vehicle then do not let them! It is your right to tell cops that they cannot search your car. They may hassle you, threaten you, scare you into letting them, but hold your ground unless you want to end up in court.
I wrote this thread because a lot of guys get busted for things they shouldnít. Iíve been there, and have since learned from my mistakes. I wrote this thread so others could hopefully benefit.
Feel free to add on Iím tired of typing.
Last edited by symatech; 09-25-2005 at 09:44 PM. Reason: spelling error in title
09-25-2005, 09:43 PM #2
Nice post symie!!
09-25-2005, 09:51 PM #3Originally Posted by symatech
09-25-2005, 09:55 PM #4Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
09-25-2005, 09:57 PM #5Originally Posted by Pinnacle
09-25-2005, 09:57 PM #6Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
EDIT: Granted this is provided you have illegal goods in the car. If you and your car is clean let I'd let them look. Any other time hell no.
Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
09-25-2005, 09:59 PM #7Originally Posted by symatech
09-25-2005, 10:00 PM #8Originally Posted by symatech
09-25-2005, 10:01 PM #9Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
That's right, but there is the "electronic agreement", is where they get you
09-25-2005, 10:03 PM #10
i'll ask my frined the specifics about what type of safe they can not search.
On of my boys use to traffic an obscene amount of marijuana and some coke.
when i mena obscene, i mean he use to have 15 lbs of weed @ his house @ a time.
The police staked out his house and actually entered w/ warrants on three seperate occasions, but could not search his safe becasue it was the rotary dial kind on not the keypad entry kind. Something in the books state they can't search that type of safe....
09-25-2005, 10:04 PM #11Originally Posted by Mealticket
09-25-2005, 10:05 PM #12Originally Posted by symatech
09-25-2005, 10:06 PM #13
If you do not give consent to search the vehicle, they will search it anyways. They'd rather take the chance and search it (odds are your hiding something anyways because your not giving consent to search), and then they let the courts handle the rest. If you have a good lawyer you can probably get off, if there was really no probable cause whatsoever, and it also depends on what they found.
09-25-2005, 10:08 PM #14Originally Posted by 305GUY
Of course if you have a key of blow in the backseat or some large quantity of gear you'll loose in court anyways and do real time.
09-25-2005, 10:18 PM #15Banned
Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
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09-25-2005, 10:19 PM #16
im confused on the electronic agreement... when i got my license there is a pad, just a little screen the size of a CC signer.... wouldn;t they have to give you the option to view and look over the rules and bylaws of getting the license if there were such a thing?? just soething i was thinking maybe im wrong
09-25-2005, 10:24 PM #17
I don't know about the signing away my rights thing, but I know that if you deny a search of your car they CAN search it anyways..... they will hold you there for a while but they will get to search it one way or another.
09-25-2005, 10:36 PM #18
If gear is the issue at hand, it should be locked away in the glove box with no other types of drugs. Usually the next step an officer takes after being denied consent to search is to call for a K-9 unit, and we all know dogs cant smell out gear. So if the dog doesnt react after he has been walked around the vehicle that only benefits your case even more. However, some K-9 officers train their dog to react over nothing giving them the probable cause they would need.
09-25-2005, 10:40 PM #19Originally Posted by 305GUY
09-25-2005, 10:42 PM #20
good advice..but on the search you car thing...i've been searched many times by cops, even when i didnt do anything, and they didnt even find anything....all they have to say is........."I smelled marijuana" and your screwed. they've always said that too me or another one is..."i smell alcohol, you been drinking". doesnt matter what my response was..they know ways to bend the rules. In my experience and my father being a cop for 22 years. As cops start out as rookies, they usually on a power trip for awhile, until they realize they are human...at the same time, you have rookie cops who don't want to come off like that, but are as nervous as you and feel they have to put a little more bass in there voice....as they become experienced they usually tend to not care too much about things like this..especially when you havent done anything, because from experience they learn that its a waste of there time to search every vehicle. if something gets overlooked then screw it. Can't getum all.
Also in my experience, cops who ride with a partner tend to want to be dicks. This ofcourse is a power trip thing.......but you know what...fact is.:
There are Dickheads every where you go..not just some cops.
09-25-2005, 10:47 PM #21Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
09-25-2005, 10:53 PM #22
as said above, if you refuse to let them search your car you can be detained. but what yall are forgetin about is once a suspect has been obtained, if theyare in a vehical and they have a "reasonable suspition" that you have some kind of illegal things in your car then they can search it. they can do this because once you are detained technically your rights get a restriction on them, not all your rights are effectef but some are and thats one of them. i get this information from a friend of mine that is a district court judge
09-25-2005, 10:58 PM #23
Rule of thumb, don't drive around with illegal substances.
09-25-2005, 10:59 PM #24Originally Posted by IBdmfkr
09-25-2005, 11:31 PM #25Junior Member
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
The police can come in your house without a search warrant. If there is a call about a disturbance they must enter and investigate, to make sure no one is dead. This happened to me, a neighbor called about a party, the cops came, smelled pot, entered, and gave me a $500 fine for the noise and the pot. If there were steriods on the table they would've got me for them too.
09-26-2005, 12:08 AM #26Originally Posted by Gassy
09-26-2005, 12:43 AM #27
nice, great to learn
09-26-2005, 09:30 AM #28
I denied the cops to search my car under the basis it was against my fourth amendment rights against illegal search and siezure... He tried to brow beat me and threaten to impound my car until he got a warrant. He finally let me go with a verbal warning about speeding... I never signed anything and everytime I renew my licence I have not signed anything but the licence itself.
09-26-2005, 01:33 PM #29
Everyone on here is always specualting about the law and since I'm pre-law, Ill give out some FACTUAL information. I will take this directly from my textbook verbatim, with some interpreation. My information is coming from "The Criminal Law Handbook"
Believe it or not, the word privacy, is never mentioned once in the Constitution of the United States. However, it is true it is protected under the 4th Amendment, which often falls under English Common Law, and not Statutory Law. Privacy under the 4th Amendment states,
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath of affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized."
Now listen, the 4th Amendment does permit searches that can be considered reasonable. What is considered reasonable is the following...
*the police have probable cause to believe they can find evidence that you commited a crime, and a judge issues a search warrant
*the particular circumstances justify the search without a warrant first being issued.
Now the Fourth Amendment only applies IF, the person has a "Legitimate Expectation of Privacy," in the place being searched.
The courts use a two part test that was fashioned by the U.S. Supreme Court to determine whether, at the time of the search, a defendant had a legitimate expectation of privacy in the place or things searched. They are the following:
*Did the person subjectively (actually) expect some degree of privacy?
*Is the person's expectation objectively reasonable, that is, one that society is willing to recognize?
Now only if both questions can be answered with a YES, will a court go on to ask the next ultimate question: "Was the search reasonable or unreasonable?"
Examples of such, would be a person who uses a public restroom. They expect not to be spied upon, so if the police were to install survaillance cameras and that would be considered a SEARCH, subject to the 4th amendment's requirement of reasonableness. However, if the police find a weapon on the front seat of a car, it is NOT considered a search under the 4th amendment because it is unlikely that you have any expectation of privacy on the front seat of your car. Even if YOU expect to have privacy on the front seat of your car, it is highly unlikely that society would agree with you, in which case the 4th amendment rights would not be extended to you for that particular location.
09-26-2005, 01:45 PM #30
Good one! search & seizures... exactly what I was saying... if they do not see anything warranting a search they may not do so without permission.
09-26-2005, 01:52 PM #31
Now that we have covered that, onto the topic of arrests. An arrest occurs when a police officer take a suspect into custody. An arrest is complete the moment the suspect is no longer free to walk away from the arresting police officer, moment that often comes well before the suspect actually arrives in jail.
The US Constitutions 4th Amendment authorizes arrests ONLY if the police have PROBABLE CAUSE to believe that a crime was commited and that the suspect did it. This probable cause requirement restrains the power of the police to deprive people of liberty. Legislatures and courts have picked up where the Fourth Amendment leaves off, developing rules setting forth how, when and why people can be arested.
The most common consequences of arrest are as follows:
*The arrested person will have an official record of arrest which may have to be reported to employers and licensing agencies like a State Board of Dentristy.
*Arrested people who are taken to jail commonly try to secure quick release by posting bail or cinvincing the judge to order "own recognizance" release.
*The arresting police officer will usually issue "Miranda Warnings" before questioning the arrestee.
*The arrestee- and sometimes the arrestee's car or home, depending on where the arrest occurs- may be searched.
*Any contraband or evidence of a crime will be seized for later use in court.
*An arrested person who remains in jail after the arrest will be taken before a judge "as quickly as practicable" for a hearing typically called an "arraignment" or "initiral appearence."
Now im gonna skip over some other jargen in the book and try to give some key points...
As interpreted by the courts, the Fourth Amendment requires police officers to obtain arrest warrants only when they eneter a suspect's dwelling to make an arrest. (Payton v. New York, U.S. Supreme Court 1980). However, the police do not need an arrest warrant in emergency situations such as when they pursue a fleeing suspect into the dwelling.
The most important part of what Im about to write is next, this is the main thing that EVERYONE on the board should pay attention to, because it is also the thing that I hear most everyone here speculate on.
What exactly does "probable cause" mean?
The Fourth Amendment makes "probable cause" the key term in the arrest process. The police need probable cause to make an arrest, wether they are asking a judge to issue an arrest warrant or justifying an arrest after it has been made. Some principles of probable cause are well settled:
*To establish probable caue, police officers must be able to point to OBJECTIVE FACTUAL CIRCUMSTANCES that lead them to believe that a suspect committed a crime. A police officer cant establish probable cause by saying seomthing like, "I just had a hunch that the defendant was a burglar."
*Judges, not police officers, have the last word on whether probable cause exists. A police officer may be sincere in believing that enough factual information to constitute probable cause exists. But if a judge examines that same information and disagrees, then probable cause does not exist (Or did exist if the question is being decided after the arrest occured).
*Probable cause to arrest may have existed at the time of the arrest, even if the police later turn out to be wrong. Put differently, an arrest is valid so long as it is based on probable cause, even if the arrested person is innocent. In this situation, probable cause protects the police against a civil suit for false arrest if the charges are later dismissed or the defendant is acquitted at trial.
Now another important point is regarding how much information the police officers need to convince a judge to issue an arrest warrant, or to justify a warrantless arrest.
The judges take into account the following by issuing arrest warrants.
*what the judge thinks the amendment's drafters mean by the term 'probable cause'
*previous judges' interpretations in similar fact situations, and
*the judge's views about "police rights" vs "criminal rights."
Judges redefine what probable cause means everytime they issue a warrant.
This all may sound very tricky, and to a degree it is. The long story short is, the police can almost get away with anything they want. How smart you are during your stop, or even your arrest is the key. Even if you are arrested for posession of steroids , the best bet in any situation is to keep your mouth shut, and not fuck up any potential defense your lawyer may try to use. I am not studying criminal law, so please do not ask me any legal advice regarding that area. I have simply posted some useful factual information regarding your 4th Amendment rights, and interpreted the information somewhat to make it more understandable to laymens. Bottomline, dont transport illegal substances in your car if you dont have to, dont sign for packages, and never open them when asked, and NEVER try to 'talk yourself' out of an arrest, as you're most likely just digging a bigger grave for yourself. Shut the fuck up, and lawyer up!
09-26-2005, 01:59 PM #32
Nice find although, I have a personal friend that was stopped for a traffic violation, and the officer THOUGHT there might be something in the car that was illegal so the officer asked to search the car. The officer searched the car(mind you more officers appeared) and found "seeds" in the back of his car. they stated it was marijuana seeds. They didnt read him his miranda rights, just told him he was going to jail. He was charged with possesion of marijuana seeds, he told his lawyer hey they didnt even read me my rights! The lawyer laughed and said, "It's your word against theirs." Technically you have no proof they did or didnt read him his rights. So this proves that officers will pretty much do anything whether you state the 4th amendment or not, and technically strip you of your rights @ that moment. It comes down to your word against theirs & since no one I know carries a recording device with them @ all times to record if you got stopped by an officer, you really have no proof
Last edited by thejuiceisloose; 09-26-2005 at 02:02 PM.
09-26-2005, 02:02 PM #33Originally Posted by thegodfather
09-26-2005, 02:05 PM #34Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
Also i know many many people who have been arrested without having there rights read to them, including myself. I makes no difference.
09-26-2005, 02:14 PM #35New Member
- Join Date
- Mar 2005
never allow police entry into your home . this includes your guests letting them in. but once there in they can hold anything in plain site against you so always keep your stuff put away.
never fall for a cops wording of phrases or there lies about helping you out.
never freely let them look into your bookbags or purses.
when your frisked they cant look in you pockets unless somehting they feel seems to be illicit in nature.as for you vehicles they can look into you cab but cannot look in the glove compartment or trunk without a warrant or reasonable cause so keep them locked. if a cop tries to flat out get your verbal permission or trick you into giving them permission clearly state you do not give them permission to violate your fourth ammendment rights and say it loud enough for witnesses to hear. if the cop continues to search anyway do not give them any resistance or you may get hurt.
p.s. oh i forgot if your asked to step out of your car turn off the car take the key and lock the windows and doors
09-26-2005, 02:22 PM #36Originally Posted by thejuiceisloose
09-26-2005, 02:26 PM #37They didnt read him his miranda rights, just told him he was going to jail. He was charged with possesion of marijuana seeds, he told his lawyer hey they didnt even read me my rights! The lawyer laughed and said, "It's your word against theirs."
thegodfather - thank you very much your posts were excellent!
Originally Posted by thegodfather
Last edited by symatech; 09-26-2005 at 02:29 PM.
09-26-2005, 02:27 PM #38
start carrying a camcorder... how do you think we get to see all those videos in the lounge? I do believe I will get an older 8mm and see what I can turn up. Dont trust the police.
09-26-2005, 02:30 PM #39Originally Posted by symatech
I got my head pounded by cops once, then stripped. Not searched... they just took all my clothes??? I guess to humiliate me. When I asked if they just wanted to see my cock they slammed my head into the wall. All charges were dropped because the police would not release the video(I guess they video taped it)
09-26-2005, 02:33 PM #40Originally Posted by Mesomorphyl
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