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  1. #1
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Should this cycle work ?

    I am getting ready to take the plunge to the darkside and looking at this for a novice cycle for an older fella.

    Test-Enanthate 1-10 weeks 400mgs
    hGH 1-10 weeks (not sure yet of dose)
    clomid 11-13 weeks (not sure of dosage)

    Is this sensible for someone over 40 and looking to gain in the moderate range (12-15 lbs of quality muscle), while looking to lose bodyfat ?

    Thanks for any help y'all can give me. I'm still reading and studying so let me know what you think I should do farther reading on.

    peace brothers

  2. #2
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    it seems good I believe, but I have a couple questions.


    I thought HGH should be run longer than that? Im not sure, I thought I heard that..

    and why no other anabolics?

    btw - maybe run your nolva with clomid post cycle as well?

    have you considered going to the doctors for hormone therapy instead??
    Last edited by Iron horse; 05-04-2002 at 05:45 PM.

  3. #3
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    looks good cane...You could Run insulin with your hgh, i dont know if you want to get into that right now, but the 2 really work well together.

    But other than that looks like a solid one.

    for the clomid your still gonna wanna keep the dosage the same as usuall. 300/100/50

  4. #4
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    Originally posted by Iron horse
    it seems good I believe, but I have a couple questions.


    I thought HGH should be run longer than that? Im not sure, I thought I heard that..

    and why no other anabolics?

    btw - maybe run your nolva with clomid post cycle as well?

    have you considered going to the doctors for hormone therapy instead??
    Hey IH,

    Yes I am going to go to the doctor very soon and get bloodwork, and I might be able to get this with a script. That would be so incredible.

    wish me luck

  5. #5
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    Hey canes, if you do go to the doc, and get scripts for stuff, then be blunt with him, let him know what you want to get out of this, and see what he tells ya. Oh, and it may be cheaper to get HGH on the black market as opposed to the pharmacy...

  6. #6
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    Originally posted by broncojosh
    Hey canes, if you do go to the doc, and get scripts for stuff, then be blunt with him, let him know what you want to get out of this, and see what he tells ya. Oh, and it may be cheaper to get HGH on the black market as opposed to the pharmacy...
    Wow, Black Market is cheaper.....I will have to look into this.

  7. #7
    androplex is offline Donating Member
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    Canes,

    You need to run hGH at least three months and should run it for 6 months. Dont start until you get your IGF-1 levels checked. If they come back above 260 you might want to think about not doing the hGH. I would NOT get your hGH other than at a US Pharmacy. No black market stuff please. If you have the money go for Saizen. Its what I use. You and I need to talk on the phone about this. You call me before you stick that needle in.

    I am glad your getting closer to taking gear and think it will help you as long as your PSA comes back low, and the other lab test look good.

    Sounds like you are doing the correct things before you start.

    Here is a list of the lab test you need done with CPT codes

    CBC 85025
    FSH 83001
    LH 83002
    T3 total RIA 84480
    T4 , Free 84439
    TSH Highly Sensitive 84443
    Comp Met panel 80053
    Lipid Panel 80061
    Testosterone 84403
    Ldopa
    DHEA -s 82627
    Growth hormone 83003]
    HIV Western Blot 86689 ( You really dont need this but I had done because I was so fatigued and tired the doc ran it. Thank God it came back non responsive, that means negative....)
    PSA 84153
    Creatinine Serum 82565


    Last edited by androplex; 05-04-2002 at 10:46 PM.

  8. #8
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Originally posted by androplex
    Canes,

    You need to run hGH at least three months and should run it for 6 months. Dont start until you get your IGF-1 levels checked. If they come back above 260 you might want to think about not doing the hGH. I would NOT get your hGH other than at a US Pharmacy. No black market stuff please. If you have the money go for Saizen. Its what I use. You and I need to talk on the phone about this. You call me before you stick that needle in.

    I am glad your getting closer to taking gear and think it will help you as long as your PSA comes back low, and the other lab test look good.

    Sounds like you are doing the correct things before you start.

    Here is a list of the lab test you need done with CPT codes

    CBC 85025
    FSH 83001
    LH 83002
    T3 total RIA 84480
    T4 , Free 84439
    TSH Highly Sensitive 84443
    Comp Met panel 80053
    Lipid Panel 80061
    Testosterone 84403
    Ldopa
    DHEA -s 82627
    Growth hormone 83003]
    HIV Western Blot 86689 ( You really dont need this but I had done because I was so fatigued and tired the doc ran it. Thank God it came back non responsive, that means negative....)
    PSA 84153
    Creatinine Serum 82565


    Thanks Androplex, and yes without adoubt you will be part of my journey to the Darkside You, TNT and a few others are the men I will lean on for advice before I ever stick the needle in.

    Thanks also for the list of tests. I will ask my doctor about every one of them.

    I was hoping maybe a VET or Mod would pop in and help out too. Where are you guys ?

  9. #9
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    Originally posted by sk*
    Yea you need to run the HGH longer than that, I would suggest at least 20weeks. I know you are over 40 but running growth harmone on your first cycle might not be the best choice, but it certainly is an option. I would put some insulin in there with the HGH and you are golden. I would also suggest running some oral somewhere in that cycle, probably dbol , because orals go very well with growth harmone.

    You should also run armidex/liquidex throughout the whole cycle.

    I am sure you already thought about this and growth harmone is probably a good choice for you, just make sure to do a lot of reading on it before you stick it in and take it for a longer period of time.
    Thanks sk*, by the way, where have you been lately ? I've missed your unique personality around here.

  10. #10
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Originally posted by cnyce89
    looks good cane...You could Run insulin with your hgh, i dont know if you want to get into that right now, but the 2 really work well together.

    But other than that looks like a solid one.

    for the clomid your still gonna wanna keep the dosage the same as usuall. 300/100/50
    Thanks for the help Cynce89, I appreciate the comments. I am however a bit scared of the insulin, that is I think one step farther than I am gonna go at this time. I'm just looking for moderate gains and mostly I'd like to reduce the bodyfat and turn around the signs of aging.

  11. #11
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    Canes, what you're doing is the perfect example for all newbies. You've been here for months, learned tons about gear, and are now gonna take the plunge. Good work bro, you're a role model. As for your cycle, at your age, having never done gear, I don't think it's a bad idea at all. I don't know much about HGH, having never used it, but I think that 400mg/wk of test will make you a happy man. YOu have plenty of time to up the dosages in future cycles. Good luck bro

  12. #12
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    Originally posted by JP1570
    Canes, what you're doing is the perfect example for all newbies. You've been here for months, learned tons about gear, and are now gonna take the plunge. Good work bro, you're a role model. As for your cycle, at your age, having never done gear, I don't think it's a bad idea at all. I don't know much about HGH, having never used it, but I think that 400mg/wk of test will make you a happy man. YOu have plenty of time to up the dosages in future cycles. Good luck bro
    Thanks JP, I hope that I am doing this right. I'm nowhere near to injecting yet, still tinkering and playing with what I should do, but have a base and a place to plan from, for taking the real plunge and that could be as long as September.

    400mg may even be more than I need, I may even lower that to 300mg a week after talking to more of you guys.

  13. #13
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    Well WEll my man canes is jumping over......Looks like youll be getting up the weight now huh????Well just want to wish you luck and yes the gh should be run longer....Anyways the best to you pm me for any help you need.............ALOHA BRONZE...........

  14. #14
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    bro, this might not be what you want to hear...but if i was you, i would save some change right now and maybe run something besides GH.. i would suggest maybe some deca or eq to run along with your test.. then throw in some winny and clen .. i would just experiment with other roids instead of just jumping into GH.. just my opinion.. i tried to put it the most respectable way i could canes!! no flame intended bro..just some friendly advice....just more food for thought..but overall, it's your decision..and if you decide to go with GH, then hey bro, i am all for it. and i'll cheer you on during your cycle..good luck bro


    Big J

  15. #15
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    <Cue Darth Vader Voice Over>
    "So. You are coming to the Dark Side."
    <Cue horrible asthma breathing problems (Gasp, Hack)>
    "Good. The Emperor will be pleased"
    <Cue more horrible asthma breathing problems (Gasp, Hack)>



    Back to Real Voice

    Looks good bro! Iv not done the GH myself so rely on the other guys to advise about that - With all the research youv done you will be fine!!


  16. #16
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    Originally posted by bronzebeefcake
    Well WEll my man canes is jumping over......Looks like youll be getting up the weight now huh????Well just want to wish you luck and yes the gh should be run longer....Anyways the best to you pm me for any help you need.............ALOHA BRONZE...........
    Thanks Bronze my brother, I know I can count on you for guidance. I'll be PMming you soon.

  17. #17
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    Originally posted by BIG_JDAWG
    bro, this might not be what you want to hear...but if i was you, i would save some change right now and maybe run something besides GH.. i would suggest maybe some deca or eq to run along with your test.. then throw in some winny and clen .. i would just experiment with other roids instead of just jumping into GH.. just my opinion.. i tried to put it the most respectable way i could canes!! no flame intended bro..just some friendly advice....just more food for thought..but overall, it's your decision..and if you decide to go with GH, then hey bro, i am all for it. and i'll cheer you on during your cycle..good luck bro


    Big J
    BigJDawg no problem bro, I am open to all suggestions bro. I have just gotten off the phone with Androplex and I am just gonna start rethinking everything, inlcuding the doseage of test-enanthate . As I say I'm not in any hurry, as I say I have all summer to think about it. I have, for sure, decided NOT to do it until then.

    Keep the suggestions coming !

  18. #18
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    Just curious why you would use GH in your first cycle? I know your gonna get all the correct info on how to run it and such (since I know your not dumb enough to play around with something that is supposed to be for "experienced users"), just wondering what made you pick it.

  19. #19
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Kaz
    <Cue Darth Vader Voice Over>
    "So. You are coming to the Dark Side."
    <Cue horrible asthma breathing problems (Gasp, Hack)>
    "Good. The Emperor will be pleased"
    <Cue more horrible asthma breathing problems (Gasp, Hack)>



    Back to Real Voice

    Looks good bro! Iv not done the GH myself so rely on the other guys to advise about that - With all the research youv done you will be fine!!

    Thanks Kaz, I appreciate the post, and I certainly have a lot to think over yet, and as I posted before I have time ot tinker around with it. I still need to canvass more opinion, and get some lab work done with my doctor and see if I can get the stuff as HRT. If I can I'd much rather do it that way. Especially with all the FED stuff going on.

  20. #20
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Originally posted by A_Nice
    Just curious why you would use GH in your first cycle? I know your gonna get all the correct info on how to run it and such (since I know your not dumb enough to play around with something that is supposed to be for "experienced users"), just wondering what made you pick it.
    Because of my age. I am nearly 42, and the benefits of its ability to apparently reverse the aging process some ways sounds like something to look into. I am not going to be using amounts that are in line with bodybuilders but more just as HRT. I'd like to have the GH levels I had when I was 30 instead of what I have now.

  21. #21
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    Hey there Canes,

    Long time no talk buddy! I missed this the first time around I guess. Personally, IMO, the 400mg test is the right dosage. I am doing that now (along with the dbol and deca ) and it's really no big deal bro. I really haven't noticed anything different - I am just starting week 2, but I can't express enough to ya that once you get going it's a piece of cake. My recovery time is starting to get a little better and I notice that I feel "pumped" a little longer after working out. I might even be upping to 500 or 600mg of test before too long. I don't know anything about the GH, but I did notice someone above mention winny. I have been doing research and talking with other bros about winny and I think am going to add it to the end of my cycle because of some of the same things that I know you are wanting to achieve. Just more food for thought bro. Plus I am bumping this for you so that the vets and mods will see and put their nickels worth in! I look forward to visiting soon.

    peace,

    ttgb

  22. #22
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    whoa and to think Canes who was against doing AS sweet Canes good luck on the cycle,HGH whoa:/ lucky let me get some :P :P

  23. #23
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    canes,
    well, by now you know my feelings on the hgh use.......... i also think youve picked a great aas to base your 1st cycle on. test enanthate is one of the best long chain esters out there, and also gives great results. i tend to agree with the above posts when running an oral is mentioned. if you dont, the 1st 4-5 weeks of your cycle will look like nothing much is happening. but hey, if you dont feel comfortable running orals yet, then by all means dont do it.
    i would prefer you run liquidex or arimidex over the nolva or proviron , as it seems to be a safer anti-e for gyno purposes, along with water retention.
    good luck brother and keep us all in the loop ok?.............


    peace bb79

  24. #24
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Originally posted by D00fy
    whoa and to think Canes who was against doing AS sweet Canes good luck on the cycle,HGH whoa:/ lucky let me get some :P :P
    Bro, I've never been against AS use, where did you get that from ? By the way bro, you and I gonna workout sometime ?

  25. #25
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    Originally posted by barbells79
    canes,
    well, by now you know my feelings on the hgh use.......... i also think youve picked a great aas to base your 1st cycle on. test enanthate is one of the best long chain esters out there, and also gives great results. i tend to agree with the above posts when running an oral is mentioned. if you dont, the 1st 4-5 weeks of your cycle will look like nothing much is happening. but hey, if you dont feel comfortable running orals yet, then by all means dont do it.
    i would prefer you run liquidex or arimidex over the nolva or proviron , as it seems to be a safer anti-e for gyno purposes, along with water retention.
    good luck brother and keep us all in the loop ok?.............


    peace bb79
    BB79,

    You will be one of my main men on planning this without a doubt. After talking to Androplex last night on the phone, I don't know I even need 400mg of test. He is seeing results from just running 100mg of test and doing his hGH a week.

    If I am only running 100 or 200 mg a week, and the hGH do I still have to worry about the anti-estrogens ? Those are not such high does to cause worry about gyno are they ?

  26. #26
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    If you want to go with a test only cycle... then here you go Canes:

    400 mg test enth a week for 8 weeks
    100 mg test prop eod weeks 9, 10, 11
    0.25 mg arimidex ed
    Clomid starts week 12

    Don't know much about HGH so I'll leave it up to the Vets.

  27. #27
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    Originally posted by Diesel
    Like BB79 said, Enanthate is a good base. I would also agree on running an oral the first four weeks. As for the HGH, I'm not sure about running that on your first go round. Then again, I have not considered it yet so I have not done much study on it either.
    Thanks Diesel, but I am trying to stay away from the oarls due to my age and liver toxicity. I just don't wanna chance it at all. Thanks for the suggestions. TNT told me about the test-enanthate and said look into it, I did and like what the drug profile said. Folks have also agreed so far it seems to be a pretty good choice.

  28. #28
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    Originally posted by Canes4Ever


    After talking to Androplex last night on the phone, I don't know I even need 400mg of test. He is seeing results from just running 100mg of test and doing his hGH a week.

    If I am only running 100 or 200 mg a week, and the hGH do I still have to worry about the anti-estrogens ? Those are not such high does to cause worry about gyno are they ?

    ok bro
    just because person a is getting results on x amount of steroid , dosent mean person b will too, ok? this is a strictly "know your own body" kind of thing. androplex might be getting great results whereas you may not. this is what i suggest to you and you can take it for what its worth, start with what he suggested if it makes you feel comfortable, but if you dont see results, up the dosage as soon as possible.
    imho, 100-200mg/week isnt going to do jack for you bro, except give you unwanted sides. and at that low of a dosage no anti e's will be needed, because not much is gonna happen.
    this is just my opinion bro, and androplex and other brothers might have better advice for you, but i felt this had to be said.

    peace bb79

  29. #29
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    Originally posted by barbells79



    ok bro
    just because person a is getting results on x amount of steroid , dosent mean person b will too, ok? this is a strictly "know your own body" kind of thing. androplex might be getting great results whereas you may not. this is what i suggest to you and you can take it for what its worth, start with what he suggested if it makes you feel comfortable, but if you dont see results, up the dosage as soon as possible.
    imho, 100-200mg/week isnt going to do jack for you bro, except give you unwanted sides. and at that low of a dosage no anti e's will be needed, because not much is gonna happen.
    this is just my opinion bro, and androplex and other brothers might have better advice for you, but i felt this had to be said.

    peace bb79
    BB79, thanks bro, I am just confused about it. I would like to consult with you more about this, I will shoot ya PM (as I owe you one right now ). I will definately be talking to you for sure about this, and getting myself inline to do it in a few weeks. I may not wait til Summer is through because I am getting anxious to try it.

    BB79 please don't get upset with me bro, I'm just a bit confused at this point.

  30. #30
    iron4life79's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Canes4Ever


    BB79 please don't get upset with me bro, I'm just a bit confused at this point.

    canes,
    if you dont know me better than that by now then dont bother pm'ing me ok?.........................

    peace bb79

  31. #31
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    Originally posted by barbells79



    canes,
    if you dont know me better than that by now then dont bother pm'ing me ok?.........................

    peace bb79
    Yes Sir !


  32. #32
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    I would run EQ and test together and drop the HGH...HGH is way too expensive and yet since this is your first cycle not so necessary... IF you are looking for the fat loss effects of HGH, tren may be a simpler, cost effective substitute

  33. #33
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    Originally posted by Canes4Ever


    Wow, Black Market is cheaper.....I will have to look into this.
    Canes, balck market maybe cheaper, but if you get a script you simply can't beast that bro. I assume your not exactly poor (like us college students )...why not spend some extra $$$ go with the sure thing...maybe your insurance will cover it. IMO, if you have a script, black market is the last thing you would want to consider.

    Peace
    Last edited by Big Rush; 05-05-2002 at 11:54 PM.

  34. #34
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    Originally posted by Big Rush


    Canes, balck market maybe cheaper, but if you get a script you simply can't beast that bro. I assume your not exactly poor (like us college students )...why not spend some extra $$$ go with the sure thing...maybe your insurance will cover it. IMO, if you have a script, black market is the last thing you would want to consider.

    Peace

    Money really isn't an issue with me. I can afford the extra if it comes down to that. I am going to make arrangements to see the doctor and do it legally 1st, then if I have to turn to a source I will.

  35. #35
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    Originally posted by solid90062
    I would run EQ and test together and drop the HGH...HGH is way too expensive and yet since this is your first cycle not so necessary... IF you are looking for the fat loss effects of HGH, tren may be a simpler, cost effective substitute
    How would Tren react with someone with panic attacks ?

  36. #36
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    I wouldn't go with the tren . Sweats, insomnia, coughing, these are all the reasons I keep holding off on using it. I've never used it so I guess my opinion on it isn't worth as much, but to be on the safe side, Id avoid it just for now. And btw, unless you wanna be sitting at your comp every night on AR, don't take DNP either. When I'm awake, I wanna sleep because I'm miserable. When I get in bed, I can't sleep. Oh well

  37. #37
    Canes4Ever's Avatar
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    Originally posted by JP1570
    I wouldn't go with the tren. Sweats, insomnia, coughing, these are all the reasons I keep holding off on using it. I've never used it so I guess my opinion on it isn't worth as much, but to be on the safe side, Id avoid it just for now. And btw, unless you wanna be sitting at your comp every night on AR, don't take DNP either. When I'm awake, I wanna sleep because I'm miserable. When I get in bed, I can't sleep. Oh well
    I'm just getting 2nd thoughts sometimes about the whole thing......I guess I am gonna have to talk to some more folks about this.

  38. #38
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    I'm not trying to make you rethink the whole thing. On the contrary, I think you're basically ready to go. If you just run the test and eq together at 400mg/wk, you're gonna make solid gains. You're gonna like the way you feel- younger, stronger, more confident. If something goes wrong, not that anything should, you always have us to turn to, or in more serious circumstances, doc. ANyway, decide what you really wanna do and don't let us make any decisions for you. We want you to take the plunge, but only if you want to.

  39. #39
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    Congradulations on your decision to turn to the dark side. Thanks for being a good rolemodel, seeing people like you with thousands of post and still waiting to learn more really has been a good influence on me. I decided to wait till mid july to turn to the dark side, instead of poking myself last week. I thought this would be wiser just because a couple of months on the board and the time to read anabolics 2002 will make a world of difference in my overall knowledge of AAS. Thanks again and keep us posted on your test results and decisions.

  40. #40
    Ajax's Avatar
    Ajax is offline Senior Member
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    Feb 2002
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    We'll I can't let my buddy Canes get away post his first proposed cycle without at least adding a comment:

    I agree with the guys on holding off on HGH right off the bat. See what the Testosterone alone does to your body, then in the future, you can see what difference adding HGH (or any other chemical) makes.

    I am interested in doing HGH as well Canes! After seeing what test/deca has done, I am impressed; but it doesn't seem to do everything I want!

    Now I am almost at the point where I will have the amount of muscle mass I want; I know I can lose most of the fat, but I think that doing HGH will help get rid of the tough fat deposits and firm up my skin some after I lose the weight!

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