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  1. #1
    TheHitman is offline New Member
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    Anti-estrogens with Test Replacement Therapy?

    Would a male taking testosterone replacement therapy (100mg Sus per week) need anti-estrogens? if so which drug (proviron or nolva or both), what amount and for how long?

    Also, would a dosage of 250mg Sus per week require anti-estrogens. Again if so if so which drug (proviron or nolva or both), what dosage and for how long?

    Cheers,
    TheHitman

  2. #2
    Morg is offline Junior Member
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    hmmm......

    100mgs of sust a week is a waste of time IMO,for that matter so is 250mgs a week,unless your stacking it with 400mgs EQ or deca .
    anti-e's should be on hand in case of signs of gyno(itchy nips)
    but at such low doses(unless your predisposed to gyno)
    you have little to worry about.
    a more legit cycle would be 500mgs sust for 8-12 weeks shooting sun. and wed.,throw some EQ at 400mgs a week and you got yourself a good basic cyle,also sust wont really kick hard till4-6 weeks in ,in my experiance so an anti e like 'dex wont be nessecary till week 4 IMO
    star clomid therepy 3 weeks after last shot of sust,100mgsED for week 1 of therepy,50mgs ED for week 2 and 50mgs ED for week 3
    Morg

  3. #3
    TheHitman is offline New Member
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    Morg,

    Thanks for the reply, but I wasn't asking for help with a cycle. 100mg is waste of time for bulking, but I am talking about test replacement, not bulking. As for the 250mg a week, I disagree that it is a waste of time. A newbie can make good, steady gains on 250mg a week Sus.

    Does anyone else have opinions on this? I would have thought 250mg a week of test would require an anti-estrogen since the body only naturally produces 70-80 per week top whack/at its very highest. 250 is double this and then some.

    TheHitman

  4. #4
    TheHitman is offline New Member
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    bump on this one.

    1. Does 250mg Sus require an anti-e? If so, what drug, dosage, and time?

    My 'cycle' is 250mg sus a week for 8 weeks then 100mg sus 8 weeks, 250mg sus 8 weeks. I am on T replacement 100mg a week sus, but am cycling with 250.

    TheHitman

  5. #5
    TNT's Avatar
    TNT
    TNT is offline Retired Moderator
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    Cool

    Welcome to the board, TheHitman. (May I call you "The?")

    No - anti-e's are not necessary on the dosages you discussed unless you are previously disposed to gyno.

    I am curious, however . . . Are you doing this under medical supervision, and are you in the United States? If so, are you doing it through an anti-aging clinic? Most U.S. physicians would not prescribe sus at all, they would prescribe cyp or enanthate for an HRT program.

  6. #6
    TheHitman is offline New Member
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    I'm from the UK where they are completely ignorant to HRT.

    Doctors here think Testosterone deficiency is something you just have to 'put up with'. They also believe testosterone has 'nothing to do with building muscle, it's just the way you are made'.

    So, it doesn't suprise me to see Sus is not the usual treatment. I also believe 250mg over 3 weeks is not appropriate. Surely I am experiencing high levels in week 1 and lower levels before my next injection. I wanted 100mg per week but the endocrinologist looked at me blankly and said 'I don't think we do that'.

    Darn!

  7. #7
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    Ajax is offline Senior Member
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    Find a new doctor--the one you have is missing basic knowledge. he should be able to answer your questions as well about the gyno issue.

  8. #8
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    TNT is offline Retired Moderator
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    Cool Agreed.

    The guy treating you, Hitman, is out of the mainstream, even with regard to HRT in the U.K. 9which follows the same recommendations as we do in the States).

    My recommendation: Download a copy of the American Association of CLinical Endocrinologists' Guidelineso n Hypogonadism, which is available in PDF format at this link. The AACE guidelines are followed by all endocrinologists here, and specifically mention the recomendation to split injections into 100 mg. per week in orer to avoid the peak-and-valley effect of testosterone . Also, as I mentioned previously, the preferred test for HRT is cypionate or enanthate (which, I believe, is the more common version in Europe).

  9. #9
    TheHitman is offline New Member
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    Thanks TNT. I hinted at this guy that 100mg was better, but he just shrugged my 'theory' off. What can you do when you have an endo who is obviously way out of touch and thinks he knows everything?

    I see this guy again in July. How can I get this geezer to consider 100mg per week?

    Thanks,
    Hitman

  10. #10
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    TNT
    TNT is offline Retired Moderator
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    Originally posted by TheHitman
    What can you do when you have an endo who is obviously way out of touch and thinks he knows everything? I see this guy again in July. How can I get this geezer to consider 100mg per week?
    Simple: Print out and show him the AACE guidelines - it's in teh Hypogonadism file - just highlight the section indicating that many endos recommend a weekly dosing to avoid the peak/valley effect.

    In the meantime, you would not throw your numbers out of whack if you were to do 100 mg. per week now - it is only 50 mg. more than the 250 mg. every 3 weeks that he prescribed.

    HOWEVER, you will throw off your total testosterone numbers by doing a cycle of 250 mg. per week.

    THEREFORE, make sure you end your cycle about three weeks before you have to get your next labs done for total testosterone, and go back on 100 mg. per week. Then get your labwork done at the end of a seven-day period, before your next shot. That way, the result will reflect your valley level (technically, your "trough" level) rather than your peak level, which will result in the doctor being more likely to increase your dosage.

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