Anavar Dreams

**CheckerChest** · 12-22-2005, 12:58 AM

Hey, been enjoying these forums for a few years now, but never posted...

Quick rundown....

Im 24, 6'4" 235-240 lbs, I have been lifting and training hard (seriously and properly) for the last 4-5 years, ..always worked out before but had a slack regiment. I have never ran any cycles and have naturally always had a big build (Thank god for height). Unfortunately my diet was piss-poor for far too long but i have had it in order now for about a year in a half and with my lifting staying consistent and JUST a change in diet i have gone from 255 to 235 in a short time and have maintained my current weight for 6 months now along with BF (15%ish) which is huge for me cuz im an easy gainer. ....

So basically im looking to lean out a bit (look a little harder), improve strength and improve vascu more. So would running straight 'Var be the right choice? It appeals to me for its safety and the fact that putting on alot of mass/water isnt what im looking for.

Thanks alot Guys, Any Feedback/Criticizm would be appreciated

**Kale** · 12-22-2005, 01:08 AM

Here is some more info on Var if you dont already have. I have done a var only cycle and had great success with it although it blew my Cholesterol levels out of the water, so you will need supps to control that.

Is oxandrolone an effective bridge?

See "Does anavar supress your HPTA".

What is the highest recommended dose for bodybuilding purposes?

From my research, the consensus is that anything over 80mg shows extreme diminishing returns.

Does oxandrolone supress your HPTA (natural testosterone production)?

Yes. Research shows as little as 2.5mg can supress in some folks. As far as the effects of this lowered test production, at 40mg a day, I would say that it's pretty much split evenly. Half of people will attest to loss of sex drive and testicular shrinkage late cycle, while about half attest that they retained sexual drive without any shrinkage. Bridging users be forewarned.

Reference: (Effect of low dose oxandrolone and testosterone treatment on the pituitary-testicular and GH axes in boys with constitutional delay of growth and puberty. Crowne EC, Wallace WH, Moore C, Mitchell R, Robertson WH, Holly JM, Shalet SM. )

Is clomid needed post cycle?

Yes. This should be apparent from the above question. You may find that 50mg/day for two weeks is enough however.

Oxandrolone and liver damage. What's the deal?

There is room for serious debate here. Oxandroline is 17-alpha-alkylated, so it's starting off on a bad foot. Oxandrolone has shown to cause liver values to sway outside of the "normal zone" for some posters (which may or may not indicate liver toxicity, this is debatable), however, the insert also states that oxandrolone can alter blood test results. I would treat this drug as liver toxic, supplimenting with a lot of ALA, Liver Detox, etc. However, this drug has also been used at 80mg/day to treat (and reverse!) liver damage in alcohol abusers. Hard to say what this means. My advice is to play it safe and treat it like any other 17aa oral.

Reference: (1: Am J Gastroenterol 1991 Sep;86(9):1200-8, A randomized, controlled trial of treatment of alcoholic hepatitis with parenteral nutrition and oxandrolone. I. Short-term effects on liver function. Bonkovsky HL, Fiellin DA, Smith GS, Slaker DP, Simon D, Galambos JT.)

Cholesterol? Heart attack time?

User experience seems to point to the fact that prolonged use does bring your good cholesterol down and your bad cholesterol up. Take your flax seed oil.

"Also, because oral steroids can decrease the "good" HDL cholesterol and increase the "bad" LDL cholesterol, oral steroids can increase the risk of cardiovascular disease (CVD). If you use oral anabolic steroids consider taking 400 to 800 IU of Vitamin E, and 1,000 to 2,000 mg. of Vitamin C with each meal. These vitamin antioxidants help to protect cholesterol from the oxidation that is associated with CVD."

(Oxandrin May Cause Liver Toxicity, by Michael Mooney (Original article in issue #7, October, 1998. Updated July, 2001)

Will grapefruit speed absorbtion?

Naringen present in grapefruit juice has shown to increase absorbtion of 17 alpha-ethinylestradiol (EE2), however, it is pure speculation as to its effects are similar in 17-alpha-alkylated substances. Hey, it cant hurt!

(Can grapefruit juice influence ethinylestradiol bioavailability? Author: Weber A; J¨ager R; B¨orner A; Klinger G; Vollanth R; Matthey K; Balogh A)

What about the different brands of Oxandrolone floating around? What to choose?

** "10mg tabs" Street price: ~$.40/"10mg"

This product must be chewed says the "manufacturer". This product is underdosed, and of dubious purity and consistency. Lab results on a test done on another board showed the pills to contain a little over 4mg of oxandrolone.

BTG/SPA 2.5mg tabs. Street price: 1-2$ per pill.

Exceptional results can be obtained with this product using signifigantly lower doses (e.g. 25mg instead of 40mg). This can probobly be attributed to greater absorbtion via proprietary "delivery systems". Outstanding product if you can afford it.

Spanish Generic 10mg caps. Street price: $1/cap.

Nothing but positive feedback so far. Tested within pharm. margin of error (+-10%). Here are the results. These are great if you can still get them.

Percentage OX: 4.42%
Percentage moisture: 2.1%

Total OX content: 9.55mg

(Credit goes to Fonz.)

Ttokkyo Labs. 5mg tabs. Street price: around 1.50 each.

Consistent, well dosed product. Does not seem to have the absorbtion or potency of the BTG/SPA product. Because of the extreme cost, I would never choose this over BTG or SPA except for availability issues.

Side effects?

Common side effects you should be prepared for: Appetite loss, stomach discomfort, increase skin "grease". I personally suffered extreme loss of appetite, but no stomach discomfort. Appetite came back in 1 week.

Rarer side effects: acne

Overall, this is an extremely mild drug. You should experience virtually no side effects. Those you do experience will diminish over time.

As ulter once said "safer then baby food".

How long before it kicks in?

Individual thing. Varies on product line as well. BTG hits quickest, ** slowest if at all.

I noticed vascularity and hardness within 2-3 days with generics, and strength in 2.5 weeks. Huck saw strength in 3 days on BTG. Wait about 3 weeks for the full effect before you get dissapointed.

Vascularity and hardness will come quick, it's very nice. I had spiderweb viens on my pecs that I've never seen before in just 3 days on Ox.

What is this drug used for?

Involuntary weight loss. HIV, AIDS, burns etc. Liver treatment in severe alcohol induced liver damage.

What is the halflife of Ox?

~9 hours.

When should ox be dosed?

There are two camps.

Camp 1: Take it all in the morning. The rationale is that your blood concentrations will 'fall off' by the time you go to bed, which will limit HPTA impact during this crucial "recentering" time for your body.

Camp 2: Spread it out evenly through the day. This will keep blood concentrations steady. Plus, don't we want that nice anabolic substance in our veins during our growth at night?

My comments: With a halflife of 9 hours, this issue is virtually meaningless. The ideas used in "camp 1" apply well when you have a substance with a 3 hour halflife (dbol ), (e.g. if 30mg of dbol is taken at 9am, only about 1 miligram is left in your bloodstream by bedtime. great.) I don't think things pan out so well with a 9 hour halflife drug. If 40mg is taken at 9am, at bedtime you will have approximately 10mg or more in your bloodstream. You would have about 15 at bedtime if you took it 4 times evenly through the day. I don't think you are giving your body any dropoff at night anyway.

Conclusion: Take it whenever you want. Choose the camp you agree with and do it, things will work out.

What gains can I expect?

Individual question. I've heard of folks with no gain in lbm, I've heard of a 15lb gain. It all depends on your diet, brand, etc. However, don't expect this to pack 3 times the punch of a sust/dbol cycle because it costs 3 times as much. .

This question is actually pretty silly, so I won't delve into it.
You CAN expect hardness and vascularity.

How about doses for women?

Go scope out the Womens discussion. However, from the grape vine I've heard of dosages starting at 2.5mg/day ramping up to 10mg/day. I wouldn't recommend more. I know little about anabolics in women though. Don't use anything but BTG/SPA. The cost is so small with female dosages and the damage done to a women's body from counterfiets is far too great. Overmore, you can't dose small amounts accurately with 10mg caps/tabs.

How long is a typical Oxandrolone cycle?

Most tend to agree longer is better with Ox. 6 weeks seems to be the minimum, while 10 weeks is recommended and common. Over 10 weeks might be stressful on the ole' liver.

**Milky87** · 12-22-2005, 05:43 AM

prop + var/winni/tbol sounds like what you are looking for Al can be used to cut while building strength. If you not looking to gain too much mass, var or wini solo might be best

**Rocky IV** · 12-22-2005, 05:48 AM

Originally Posted by Milky87

prop + var/winni/tbol sounds like what you are looking for Al can be used to cut while building strength. If you not looking to gain too much mass, var or wini solo might be best

var/winni/tbol??? ouch,, say hi to your liver for me

**Milky87** · 12-22-2005, 07:41 PM

the way i wrote that was meant to come out as him using either popr + var, porp + winni or porp+tbol. Not all 3 at once

**Hellmaskbanned** · 12-22-2005, 08:08 PM

For your goals var alone would be great without sides from other compounds.

**CheckerChest** · 12-22-2005, 10:30 PM

Right on, thanks alot, ill let you know how it goes...

How much do you recommend i run? ...being 240lbs im thinking 80mg

**toolman** · 12-22-2005, 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by Hellmask

For your goals var alone would be great without sides from other compounds.

This is only true if he does not feel like having sex his whole cycle. If you run the cutters like var or primo, they absolutely will shut you down. I speak from experience. THe result is a complete loss of sex drive. Not like deca , you can get an erection, you just have absolutely no desire. As I recommend to anyone running a cutter, add some small amount of test e or better, prop. My guess that since it is your first cycle, you are afraind of injectables or at least not used to them so you should add 250mgs of test E which only requires 1 jab a week.

**Hellmaskbanned** · 12-22-2005, 11:25 PM

Originally Posted by CheckerChest

Right on, thanks alot, ill let you know how it goes...

How much do you recommend i run? ...being 240lbs im thinking 80mg

Run between 60-80mgs for 6-8 weeks.
You may have erection problems you may not. Even after pct with test some people have problems from being shutdown and have a harder time recovering with that as well, it varys per individual.

I'm 245lbs also, and I would just run the var if wanting to lean out.

**CheckerChest** · 12-23-2005, 01:05 AM

Will do, thanks alot.....

With litte or no supression on your HPTA how does it manage to shut people down so bad?

**toolman** · 12-23-2005, 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by CheckerChest

Will do, thanks alot.....

With litte or no supression on your HPTA how does it manage to shut people down so bad?

That is not correct, at 60-80 mgs a day, it will absolutely suppress your HPTA. That is an old myth that it won't.

**Anabolios** · 12-23-2005, 02:45 PM

try running EQ at 600mg/ew and maybe a little test to keep your sex drive in check 250mg/ew maybe? throw the var in there and you should get the vascularity and solid muscles you're looking for should run EQ at least 12 weeks though

**Pop_Smoke54** · 04-18-2006, 02:33 PM

Hey All,

New member with a couple of questions re:Anavar

1) What is the lowest dosage that is likely to have results in terms of strength gain. I'm not a body builder or competitive athlete and am not looking for dramatic gains. I'm over fifty and am looking to regain muscle after an injury and offset the effects that aging has on adding muscle.

2) There are any number of online sources for Anavar. How does one determine which are reputable? Is there a list posted anywhere of known scammers? I understand that it would be hard to keep such a list completely current, but at this point I'm really in the dark.

Finally, thanks Kale for your post above. I've been reading various forums for the past couple of weeks and that is as good a summary of Anavar related issues as I've seen. It helped clear a couple things up.

**Kale** · 04-18-2006, 04:47 PM

Nate you need Test not Var, are you prepared to inject. I am 51 and I am on Test for the rest of my life and its the best thing I ever did

**Random** · 04-18-2006, 06:19 PM

var is just awesome, its the best stuff ive run when considering side effects...it will definitely cut you up..ive already lost over 2% bodyfat with NO change in diet and ZERO cardio in 6 wks...check out my diary....

Incredible Anavar Experience

***D7M*** · 04-19-2006, 05:57 AM

This thread got hi-jacked.

Checkerchest, Var sounds good for what ur looking for. 60-80mg a day. Read the Var profile, it will shut you down (trust me), but you have a few options to combat this.

I suggest running a small dose of test w/ it.

**Random** · 04-19-2006, 07:49 AM

sorry guys didnt mean to hi-jack...var and test prop are both great...

**Ufa** · 04-19-2006, 07:53 AM

Sh!t this an OLD thread........................This guy is most likely on the end of the next cycle...............

**Kale** · 04-19-2006, 07:58 AM

Damn I hate it when newbies do that !!!!!!

**Pop_Smoke54** · 04-20-2006, 03:07 PM

What'd I do?

**Pop_Smoke54** · 05-02-2006, 12:56 PM

Look, I don't really understand what rule of forum etiquette I've violated, but whatever the transgression, it was inadvertent. I apologize for any ill feelings caused.

My questions, though, still stand.

1) What is the lowest Anavar / Oxandrolone dosage that is likely to have results in terms of strength gain. I'm not a body builder or competitive athlete and am not looking for dramatic gains. I'm over fifty and am looking to regain muscle after an injury and offset the effects that aging has on adding muscle.

2) There are any number of online sources for Anavar. How does one determine which are reputable? Is there a list posted anywhere of known scammers? I understand that it would be hard to keep such a list completely current, but at this point I'm really in the dark.

I would appreciate any help.

Thanks.