Help me salvage this cycle...

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11-23-2002, 02:32 AM
Warrior

Help me salvage this cycle...

?Que Pasa? gents... I feel like shit. I mean a buddy of mine feels like shit *cough*

HIS first cycle was kinda f'ed up but yet effective none the less because nothing keeps him from going balls out training.

The cycle consisted with a frontload of Deca and Primobolan Depot. Then D-bol was added for a jump and some brain fuel. Primo ended. Then Deca ended and Equipoise began (Deca effected sex drive too much without running an androgen :wg: ). Now it has been like 5 weeks since the last Deca shot and the Eq is basically running on it's own and time outside the gym is getting to be a little... well... out of it. :o

Went like this:
Week 1: 800mg Deca, 600mg Primo
Week 2: 400mg Deca, 300mg Primo
Week 3: 400mg Deca, 100mg Primo, D-bol 25mg ED
Week 4: 400mg Deca, 100mg Eq EOD, D-bol 25mg ED
Week 5: 400mg Deca, 300mg Eq EOD, D-bol 25mg ED
Week 6-9: 100mg Eq EOD

Equipoise will be ran for another 3 weeks and pumps are fantastic, vascularity is showing and generally feeling swole in the gym. Gains have been good and looking to spot inject the remaining Eq in the Biceps and Triceps since leg strength seems to have improved the most (been doing quad and some glute injections).

My recap on this is the Primobolan was a waste but since it binds similar to the others it at least helped a little. Deca should have been continued with the Eq - Eq pumps seemed to be better when Deca was still in the system. An androgen should have been added. Gear should have been gather in advanced (learned the hard way).

Question is: How can I pull this one out of the shit can for the final few weeks? I was thinking Winstrol. But Anadrol 50 or D-bol ran at the end is more... econmical. I read that Anadrol 50 (highly androgenic) used with another sup (this case Eq) would allow smaller doses of Anadrol to be used, so less sides... bloat, liver, and supression. Would adding 50mg or 100mg of Anadrol be better than adding say 30-40mg of D-bol for 4 weeks?

Like this?
Weeks 10-12: Eq 100mg EOD
Weeks 10-14: Anadrol 50 100mg ED or D-bol 40mg ED (2 gallons H20 ED)

Begin Clomid week 15.

The intent of the cycle was to build keepable results and get past a sticking point (which it has very nicely done so far). Not looking for extra BF or bloat. No need for unnecessary weight gain - just solid lean weight. The last few weeks could focus more on strength than anything.

Thanks in advanced... another one bites the dust but knows much more now - if there is a next time around :wg:

:(
11-23-2002, 02:34 AM
palme

Why not run some prop last weeks before clomid?
11-23-2002, 02:49 AM
MBaraso

Wow talk about a fcked cycle lol
Different ppl gain off different things....If you could finish the cycle off w/ Winny then by all means go ahead.
But IMO Fina would be the best bet (as long as he's experienced)
11-23-2002, 02:51 AM
Warrior

Quote:

Originally posted by palme
Why not run some prop last weeks before clomid?

I had actually thought about that too. Test Prop 100mg, EOD M-W-F
11-23-2002, 02:54 AM
Warrior

Quote:

Originally posted by MBaraso
Wow talk about a fcked cycle lol
Different ppl gain off different things....If you could finish the cycle off w/ Winny then by all means go ahead.
But IMO Fina would be the best bet (as long as he's experienced)

First cycle... that should be obvious :lol:

Since the juice is all pretty similar how interacts with the receptors - would it still be okay? But obviously not a recommended cycle...
11-23-2002, 03:14 AM
MBaraso

War...I'm gonna let this one go....
Sorry bro but I don't wanna give advice.
I have an idea of what should be done but I'd best let it up to a Mod or Vet.
Good luck to you though!

M
11-23-2002, 06:11 AM
Warrior

Setting the Prop aside... as I research around it seems Dianabol would be better for greater mood and lasting gains than Anadrol. Dianabol is an aromatizable androgen that can be managed with an estrogen antagonist. Anadrol does not aromatize, however, it is progestagenic which cannot be mitigated by an anti-e.

It seems Anadrol is better stacked with Winny. And D-bol would be a good way to end this fucking cycle with the Eq. :D

Bill Roberts on a similar issue:

"But, a couple of things to be aware of, Dianabol aromatizes (some of it converts to an estrogen) whereas Anadrol does not. A Winstrol/Anadrol stack won't need Clomid or Arimidex but one or the other would be advisable with Dianabol... though many can get away without it. If you don't have the past experience of getting away with it before, there's no way to know whether you can get away with high estrogen levels or not, so I would use the Clomid.

"Personally, (if it were not for the topical diols which have the advantage of no 17-alkylation toxicity, and in my case the advantage of complimentary bottles) I would choose between Anadrol and Dianabol mostly on the basis of availability, price, and which I felt like using. The Dianabol has a bit of a feel-good property to it, unique to Dianabol, while Anadrol has effect on mood similar to most other androgens. In terms of placebo effect (hey, placebo effect is important!) Dianabol is very comforting and reassuring to use, if it's the pink pentagons anyway, while Anadrol can be a little alarming if it's one of the crumbly tablets, but on the other hand if you know it's legit then Anadrol you can have high confidence in.

"What I'm saying is that either drug can be used to good effect and it comes down to personal preference really, though with the metabolic difference I pointed out above.

"If you had testosterone in the stack though, my personal opinion would be, definitely Dianabol over Anadrol. You don't, so that isn't an issue here." T-Mag
11-23-2002, 10:32 AM
nj_

I would suggest either Prop or Winny for the last weeks of the cycle. No dbol, DEFINITELY no drol cause you will lose most of the gains you get off it especially without a test in there.
11-23-2002, 11:43 AM
Jack87

Quote:

Originally posted by palme
Why not run some prop last weeks before clomid?

I would 2nd the Prop suggestion... No reason to throw a 17aa in at the end of this cycle... At this point it wouldn't make that much of a difference...

I'd go with Prop 100mg EOD...
11-23-2002, 12:15 PM
Rickson

Well I am going to buck the system on this one a little. While prop would be a fine addition to the cycle, Anadrol (in low doses) works great with EQ. As a matter of fact many BB's use anadrol at the end of a cycle to cut up (I know hard to believe). I don't think you will go wrong either way although it looks like you have gone out of your way to avoid test in the rest of the cycle. Let us know how it goes and good luck.
11-23-2002, 12:42 PM
iron4life79

rickson put it better than i could have.........but he captured the jist of what i was going to say. might want to throw the prop and the 'drol in there for last few weeks. this way, you'll finish with a fast acting androgen, and it will taper out along with the rest.

good luck bro........

peace bb79
11-23-2002, 05:48 PM
Warrior

Is Dbol kinda forgotten because it is not as androgenic as the Anadrol or Test Prop. I was thinking that a fast acting androgen would be a good way to end it - and Dianabol isn't as androgenic as the other two... a good benefit though is the Dbol dopamine boost :D

_nj - are you still aginst Anadrol used only at 100mg per day with Eq? Since smaller amounts of Anadrol are needed when ran with Eq. I am interested in the combination as Rickson said it. And will probably opt this direction and let you guys know how it ends up.

I'll see what else get's posted but for now it seems either Prop @ 100mg EOD or Anadrol @ 100mg ED ending two weeks after the Eq. Then the following week beginning clomid.
11-23-2002, 10:57 PM
iron4life79

warrior,
im not a big fan of dbol, and i'd choose drol over the d's anytime.
while a lot of the good brothers wont agree with this, imho, as rickson said, i'd rather finish with anadrol every time.
just curious though bro, do you have some reason for the test aversion here?
its kind of weird to run the cycle you ran above with no test. i'd be interested to hear the logic on this one.........

peace bb79
11-24-2002, 12:43 AM
Warrior

Quote:

Originally posted by barbells79
warrior,
im not a big fan of dbol, and i'd choose drol over the d's anytime.
while a lot of the good brothers wont agree with this, imho, as rickson said, i'd rather finish with anadrol every time.
just curious though bro, do you have some reason for the test aversion here?
its kind of weird to run the cycle you ran above with no test. i'd be interested to hear the logic on this one.........

peace bb79

Well... a few weeks back I stated that I had been hospitalized for an Anaphylactic Shock while in another country. Until then I had been in incredible shape. But after a few months of Prednisone ( :cry: ) and a few other drugs - it broke me down quite a bit. So I picked some postconvalesent aids for helping to rebuild - some I had read about. The script the Doc wouldn't give me... Deca (humans) and Equipoise (Vet). The others where merely a push.

Any further cycles will add Test. My biggest thing is just to be sure what is available now. And I know Dbol is - and Dbol gives a good feeling - which the Eq, now running on it's own, seems to be a bit of a downer. Finding some good Dbol around here is easier than finding a good price on Myoplex too :D . The Anadrol and Test Prop I am working on...
11-24-2002, 02:02 PM
Rickson

Anadrol has the unique ability to keep one's muscles full and dense even on restricted calories and seems to keep vascularity high. I believe this is due to its weak AR interaction and the other mechanisms by which it works. As long as you are in good shape and keep your sodium intake low and your water intake high and of course most BB's use some sort of diueretic with it precontest you can keep bloat to a minimum. Winny would be a nice add to it but that can be expensive. My problem with dbol is two fold. It is harder in my opinion to control the water gain and to realize kept gains on reduced calories and while the dopamine boost is nice you will be coming off that(which can cause depression) and your cylce(which can cause depression). Might end up making you feel worse overall rather than better. If that didn't explain my reasoning well PM me again and we will talk about it some more.
11-24-2002, 05:10 PM
Warrior

I did not think about the fact that the post cycle crash could be increased by the D-bol's effects. :( The more I learn about the Anadrol the more I want to give it a shot w/ the Eq... thanks for you help...
11-24-2002, 05:27 PM
palme

At what dosage would the drol be at?
11-24-2002, 05:39 PM
Warrior

I was thinking something like this, tapering as to not shock the liver values (?):

Week 10: Anadrol 50 100mg ED
Week 11-13: Anadrol 150 150mg ED
Week 14: Anadrol 50 100mg ED

Eq runs until week 12
11-26-2002, 11:07 PM
JetBlack

i would say run the prop.

continue with the EQ until week 12.

but run prop
weeks 9-15 150mg EOD

run the prop until 18 days after last EQ injection.

then clomid will be 3 days after last prop injection.

adding anadrol or even dbol at the end of a cycle will make it dammn near impossible to keep your gains. and your rececptors are already saturated. you just need some old fashioned test.

next cycle test should be the base of the cycle.

Slide!