Help on first cycle. Unique circumstances...experts needed

**Anonimatrix** · 01-23-2003, 02:04 AM

First of all thank you for taking the time to read this. Any and all info is appreciated.
Here's the deal...

I am almost 22 years old, am currently 5'6" and weigh 130 pounds. I was diagnosed with Crohn's Disease 7 years ago, and had surgery done in May of 2002. I was just tested yesterday, and I am still disease free, and will probably stay that way for a while. I've allready gotten some information, and A/S will not aggravate or affect my illness in any way.

Now 130 is the most I've ever weighed. After my surgery I was down to 105(sad), and after a month I was in the gym, and I hit my current weight after just a few months of working out(I had worked out a year before the surgery, before my illness got out of control, and I also hit 130 back then). For the past 2 months though, my weight has not budged. My strength has increased, but not the weight. I would have to say that I eat fairly well, even though I guess I could eat a lot more.

But what I want to do is start A/S to get between 150-160, which would quite possibly make me the happiest person alive. During the summer a friend of mine gave me some Anapolan(full cycle I believe), and Proviron . After doing my research, I don't think that's what I want to take though. I also have Testosterone available from another friend, and even though I keep telling him that their should be more to the name, he says that's all that is on the box.

(this is getting long....thank you for your patience)

So here finally is the question. Is it wise for me to start taking a stack of A/S, or is it too early? And if I decide to be reckless and do a cycle right now, will it be ok? I don't want to be a 200+ pound behemoth, just to 160 (I do Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and Muay Thai...want to do MMA), so I don't think I need hardcore A/S.

Again, from some of the research I've done, these are some of the agents I'm interested in: Dianabol , Sustanon , Clomid, Parabolan .

What I need to know, is in what combination should I take those? Should I take them at all, or something different? Also remember that I allready have Anapolan, Proviron, and Testosterone available to me. Preferably I want as little water weight as possible, but I understand that sometimes that cannot be avoided.

Really sorry for the long post, but I felt that information was necessary so that the experts out here can give me a good answer.

Thanks again, and ANY info is appreciated.

**tt333** · 01-23-2003, 02:16 AM

I'd say, give you some more time. Eat a gram to two grams of protein per bodyweight. Get on some creatine,protein,l-glut,flaxseed oil and multi vitamin. That should put some weight on you. You wont bulk up quick but in a month or two you should be able to gain 10 or 15 pounds. Get strict on your diet and take all your supps on time. If you dont gain anything from that, then I would think about AS.

If your not wanting to do this, a good beginner AS cycle . Test, deca or eq and dbol . You can see good gains just on a test cycle alone.

**FedSki** · 01-23-2003, 03:07 AM

You're right in wondering if the Test is real. I doubt it given what you say.

I agree with tt333 deca , test or sust and dianabol make a good first cycle.

**Big Al** · 01-23-2003, 03:49 AM

Hold on bro, improve the diet and ensure you are 100% healthy before thinking about AAS

**Pete235** · 01-23-2003, 06:09 AM

I would forget about the parabolan for sure bro as real parabolan is as rare as a 4 leaf clover. Anything you find that has a label claiming to contain parabolan has a 98% chance of being fake.

**hammerhead** · 01-23-2003, 07:18 AM

You're a hard-gainer. You need a different approach to bulking. 95% of this board has no clue what you'll have to go through to get where you want to be.

Your goals of 150 - 160, which is only 20 pounds or so heavier, is achievable. I can tell you from experience that once you get there you will likely find out you're not as big as you thought you would be! You might end up needing 175 lbs. I was 6' and 125 lbs. and I wanted to get up to 160 - I figured 180 would be all i'd ever need to weigh. I was at 195 a few months back and that's at least 20 lbs lighter than what I want to look like. I don't look anything ike what I thought I would at this weight!

Eat alot of small meals all day long. Your body cannot digest but so much food per meal anyway. The diets the big guys eat won't work for you because think about it - if your digestive system was as efficient as thiers is would you be 130 lbs? Of course not.

As far as AS - you need to push yourself naturally for awhile and see how far you can get. Then - if you do resort to AS - which I suspect you will - don't worry about the cutting stuff. You won't need cutting cycles or cutting steroids to achieve a hard cut look. I can achieve more in 2 weeks of cutting (on mass steroids) than the big guys can in a 12-week cutting cycle. It's genetics. Of course it takes me a 12-week mass cycle to achieve what the big guys can do naturally. Stick to the bulking steroids and don't waste your money on a cutting cycle. Just add a week or two of "cutting" to the end of your mass cycles.

You must focus on preserving your body's natural testosterone production. Chances are your natural production is low to start with. Be careful - you could easily get yourself to a size you cannot maintain without AS - and you could get to where without AS you're 110 lbs instead of the 130 you're at now! Take the right amount of time between cycles and don't overdo it! Pay close attention to how your body feels in-between cycles because that's the body you have to live with!

Start out by locking your body into a maintenance calorie level - figure out what it is and eat at that level for awhile. It's probably between 2100 and 2400 calories a day. Remember - if you eat small meals all day long you'll get alot more out of those calories. Then crank up the calories to 3000 to 3500 a day and work out hard and see what happens. Give it at least one month before deciding whether it works or not.

You have to eat right. Let me suggest starting out with a diet that includes 3 or 4 protein shakes a day with about 30 or 40 gms of protein per shake. Eat 6 light meals a day about 2 to 3 hours apart. They can be as simple as a bagel and a hard-boiled egg. Avoid fats and sugars. Try to eat about 30 gms of protein per meal for at least 4 of those meals. Focus on getting complex carbohydrates. Rice, potatoes, pasta, bread. You'll need about 60 to 80 gms of carbohydrates per meal and i'm not counting sugars. You should never eat more than about 100 gms of sugar or 100 gms of fat in one day.

This is a starting point. Eat like that and work out hard for awhile and tell us how far you get. If you can get there naturally the body you keep for life will have a longer warranty on it than the one you'll build on AS even if it is a few pounds lighter.

**The Butcher** · 01-23-2003, 08:19 AM

First off, it's nice to see a Newbie go into as much detail as you have Anonimatrix. It was well written, and it let everyone know enough about you to make educated suggestions. That makes a world of difference when it comes to giving advice.

Second, I think everyone here has given you good advice. Since your strength is still increasing, but your weight is not, you need to up your calories. Add another meal, and another protein shake every day to what you are doing right now. That should give you about another 750 calories a day which might be all you need to grow some more. Also, try the supplements suggested by tt333. Hammerhead's diet plan looks pretty sound, and since you said you probably could eat alot more, that is probably the thing that is limiting you the most.

If you still haven't gotten anymore weight in a month or two, then you might want to consider aas. Post here again when that time comes, and you will surely get plenty of responses (especially if your post is as well put as this one, and it looks like you have done your research). Pete 235 is right about the Parabolan , and Fedski is correct about the test. Unless you can get ahold of the bottle of test and figure out exactly what it is, I wouldn't waste my money or time with it. Get legitimate products. It's alot less frustrating! Keep us posted.

***JohnnyB*** · 01-23-2003, 09:42 AM

I have to agree up your calories, be cause AAS isn't going to help if you can't eat more. Get used to eating then think about AAS.

JohnnyB

**Carlos_E** · 01-23-2003, 09:52 AM

Anonimatrix, PM me your email address and I can email you the bulking diet I've been on. It works. I started bulking naturally at 147 and now I'm high 170s.

**Andy** · 01-23-2003, 12:22 PM

Just want to agree with other posts. Especially if you are still gaining so well naturally, adjust your diet and stay away from juice. Also do a lot of research on post testosterone symptoms. With your past problems steroids may be especially bad for you. There have been studies (I believe) showing weakened immune symptoms due to testosterone supplementation. Goodluck dude

**Anonimatrix** · 01-23-2003, 06:40 PM

I just wanted to thank everyone for your advice. It really means a lot to me. I think I will follow everyones advice, reevaluate my diet and try to gain some more naturally. Depending on how it works out, maybe I won't need to take A/S anytime soon.

A few more questions though.

Hammerhead: You say not to eat more than a 100 grams of sugar or fat a day. I have to first figure out how much that is (one candy bar or ten?), but why do you say that? I'm not really worried about fat, because even now I think I'm well under 10% of bodyfat (I'll get it measured again soon). Again I'm not sure how much sugar and fat that is, but are you saying not too eat that much cause of my appearance, or are those amounts a lot for a day and it's unhealthy?

Again thanks for everyones advice, and thanks for receiving me so well.

**Doc M** · 01-23-2003, 10:23 PM

Anonimatrix,

Give me a bit more detailed medical background and I will make some suggestions for you. A lot of the advice in your thread is good, but it could be harmful as well depending on your state of progression, symptoms, and other health factors. High protein could greatly aggravate your condition causing gastric distress and bowel dysfuntcions. Have you had any portion of your colon or small intestines removed? What stage are you at? What is your daily bowel cycle like? Do certain foods aggravate the stomach and colon? Give me some more and I will make a suggestion for you to achieve your goals.

**Anonimatrix** · 01-24-2003, 01:15 AM

Thanks a lot for caring Forecon.
You made a very good point, because I don't know how well I'll do on a diet like that, because I have had a nice chunk of my small intestine removed.
I send you a PM with all the details. I'm sorry about the length of it, but I tried to include every detail.

Also thank you Carlos_E for the diet. I'm gonna give that a shot as soon as I hear from Forecon.

Thanks everyone.

**hammerhead** · 01-26-2003, 12:39 PM

The point of keeping your sugar and fat intake within a reasonable range is threefold. First - it will help you to gain solid muscle and not body fat around the middle. Yes - you can afford some fat now but trust me - the less fat you put on now the happier you'll be when you get my age. Second - you want your body to process your proteins and to burn fat. Eating too much sugar and fat can change what your body burns for fuel and can affect protein metabolism. Third - you want to keep your blood sugar levels steady and eating too much sugars will lead to blood sugar levels popping up and down - it affects you in many ways including energy levels. Eating complex carbos leads to a stable blood sugar level.

The main point for saying that is that sometimes when you say eat alot of calories people willl run out and start cramming away large pizzas and boxes of ice cream bars and that's alot of calories but it doesn't build muscle as well as the good stuff. By focusing on the grams of protein and fat and sugar you eat you will develop a much healthier approach to eating big and therefore - to getting big!