Thread: HCG for recovery?
02-10-2003, 04:42 AM #1
HCG for recovery?
so HCG aids or prolongs HPTA recovery?
02-10-2003, 06:39 AM #2G-S Guest
No. Not like you may think. Go read the thread in the educational forum.
02-10-2003, 07:01 AM #3
Last edited by FedSki; 02-10-2003 at 09:48 AM.
02-10-2003, 12:26 PM #4
This little article is from Muscletalk, by Bigfella:
HCG stands for Human Chorionic Gonadotrophin and is not a steroid , but a natural peptide hormone which develops in the placenta of pregnant women during pregnancy to controls the mother's hormones. (Incidentally, this is the reason you may hear of people testing for growth hormone (HGH) with a pregnancy testing kit - If their HGH shows 'pregnant', they've been ripped-off with cheaper HCG - but we digress slightly).
Its action in the male body is like that of LH, stimulating the Leydig cells in the testes to produce testosterone even in the absence of endogenous LH. HCG is therefore used during longer or heavier steroid cycles to maintain testicular size and condition, or to bring atrophied (shrunken) testicles back up to their original condition in preparation for post-cycle Clomid therapy. This process is necessary because atrophied testicles produce reduced levels of natural testosterone, this situation should be rectified prior to post-cycle Clomid therapy.
HCG administration post-cycle is common practice among bodybuilders in the belief that it will aid the natural testosterone recovery, but this theory is unfounded and also counterproductive. The rapid rise in both testosterone, and thus oestrogen due to aromatisation, from the administration of HCG causes further inhibition of the HPTA (Hypothalamic/Pituitary/Testicular Axis - feedback loop discussed above); this actually worsens the recovery situation. HCG does not restore the natural testosterone production.
The typically observed dosing of 2000 to 5000IU every 4 to 5 days causes such an increase in oestrogen levels via aromatisation of the natural testosterone that this has been responsible for many cases of gynecomastia .
From the above discussion it is clear that HCG is best used during a cycle, either to:
1) Avoid testicular atrophy, or
2) Rectify the problem of an existing testicular atrophy.
Doses of HCG
Smaller doses, more frequently during a cycle will give best overall results with least unwanted side effects. Somewhere between 500iu and 1000iu per day would be best over about a two-week period. These doses are sufficient to avoid/rectify testicular atrophy without increasing oestrogen levels too dramatically and risking gynecomastia. This dosing schedule also avoids the risk of permanently down-regulating the LH receptors in the testes.
02-10-2003, 12:41 PM #5
good posting. doesn't mention hcg usage during or after reltively short cycles (8 to 12 weeks). even during relatively short cycles weeks there can be some significant testicular atrophy that only manifests itself towards the end of the cycle. in this instance i wonder if hcg is better used at the end of the cycle. then again using hcg mid cycle will probably prevent atrophy altogether.
hmm, i'm mid cycle now, i wonder if i should start shooting my hcg. decisions, decisions . . .
02-10-2003, 11:21 PM #6
Think of it like this; If you were to come off a cycle and your nuts were atrophied, how much harder do you think it would be to get them functioning? They have been dormant, and not functioning due to lack of LH signaling. So you would take your clomid or nolva after cycle with atrophied testes, giving the HP axis proper stimulation to begin LH production. But if your nuts have been shut down and not used to getting the signal (LH), they will take somewhat longer to restart in the overall recovery process. However, if you were to keep them functionally receptive to LH by providing HCG during cycle ( ex,whether you do 2 weeks mid cycle at 500-1000 IU/week or do 500-1000 IU weekends only throughout cycle, this is always controversial) they will never atrophy in the first place. So when you come off cycle, wouldn't it seem like your testes would be more receptive to clomid/nolva in recovery? Just a thought
02-11-2003, 05:01 AM #7
i've got three shots of hcg , each 1500iu (i think - i've got the Organon Pregnyl that says 1500iu on the box and on each amp). i wonder if it's worth doing one each weekend for the next three weeks? any comments?
i've been reading the drug profile on AR and it says an effective dose for an athlete is between 2000iu and 5000iu. Does it mean in total or each shot?
02-11-2003, 08:18 AM #8Associate Member
- Join Date
- Oct 2002
- city of the winds
i read another profile and it claims doing 500iu each week its good enough but, i guess it depends on each person how long has been juicing also how bad is the system down to do 500iu to up to 2000iu or more.....
02-11-2003, 08:57 AM #9
i don't belive that 500 i.u would be good enough for a week...the way i run it is at the end of my cycle at 500 i.u ed for 10-14 days..Madmax..
02-11-2003, 09:02 AM #10
500 ed. is your supply in 500iu amps or do you mix a larger amount and store it in the fridge or something?
02-11-2003, 11:55 AM #11
i actually bought 5000 i.u bottles which i wish i wouldn't have but i only load 10 i.u on the needle which = 500 i.u from the bottle...and i preload 9 other syrnges and put them in the fridge for use through out the week...Madmax..
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