15 week cycle. opinions. Please revise

**Li Bert** · 02-11-2003, 08:15 PM

Week.....enathate.......Eq......dbol ........tren .. ....winny......t3.....clen
1..............1000mg....800mg..35mg/ed...........................................
2..............1000mg....800mg..35mg/ed...........................................
3................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
4................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
5................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
6................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
7................500mg....400mg................... ............................clen.
8................500mg....400mg................... ............................clen.
9................500mg....400mg................... ............................clen.
10..............500mg....400mg................75mg/ed.50mg/ed...t3.........
11..............500mg....400mg................75mg/ed.50mg/ed...t3.........
12..............500mg....400mg................75mg/ed.50mg/ed...t3.........
13..prop.100mg/ed......HCG .500iu/ed.....75mg/ed.50mg/ed.........clen
14..prop.100mg/ed......HCG.500iu/ed.....75mg/ed.50mg/ed.........clen
15..prop.100mg/ed.............................75mg/ed.50mg/ed.........clen
16...clomid
17...clomid
18...clomid
19...clomid
liquidex at .5mg/ed weeks 1-15

**Madmax** · 02-11-2003, 08:18 PM

Originally posted by Li Bert
Week.....enathate.......Eq......dbol ........tren .. ....winny......t3.....clen
1..............1000mg....800mg..35mg/ed...........................................
2..............1000mg....800mg..35mg/ed...........................................
3................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
4................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
5................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
6................500mg....400mg..35mg/ed...........................................
7................500mg....400mg................... ............................clen.
8................500mg....400mg................... ............................clen.
9................500mg....400mg................... ............................clen.
10..............500mg....400mg...............75mg/ed.50mg/ed...t3.........
11..............500mg....400mg...............75mg/ed.50mg/ed...t3.........
12..............500mg....400mg...............75mg/ed.50mg/ed...t3.........
13..prop.100mg/ed...400mg.................75mg/ed.50mg/ed.........clen
14..prop.100mg/ed...400mg.................75mg/ed.50mg/ed.........clen
15..prop.100mg/ed.............................75mg/ed.50mg/ed.........clen
16...clomid.....hcg
17...clomid.....hcg
18...clomid.....hcg
19...clomid
liquidex at .5mg/ed weeks 1-15

first thats a whole lot of gear...you might want to do more research before you start...theres alot of mistakes in that cycle...i don't even know if the cycle below that i provided is any good because you didn't provide stats...Madmax..

1. do not run clomid and hcg at the same time
2. 6 weeks on d-bol is to long run it for 4
3. what are your stats
4. don't run the eq till week 14 if you plan on taking clomid on week 16..
5. try this..i didn't put the frontloaded doses in my suggestion...add them yourself to the cycle...

prop 100mg eod (1-4)
test 500mg (1-12)
eq 400mg (1-12)
winny 50mg ed (10-15)
hcg 500 i.u ed for 10-14 days (17-18)
clomid 2 days after last hcg injection

**OGPackin** · 02-11-2003, 08:20 PM

Hey bro, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay to much gear in one cycle. Where the heck did u come up with that? Plus its all backwards!

OG

**monstercojones** · 02-11-2003, 08:21 PM

jesus man, how many cycles have you done?

**Li Bert** · 02-11-2003, 08:35 PM

i guess everyone has their own opinion on what is right and wrong and forwards and backwards. considering that vets and mods at 2 other boards approved this cycle and said it was very good. however, im always open to suggestions. 6 weeks on dbol is not to long but after six weeks in can get dangerous. milk thistle is in check for this. im 5'11 235lbs ~12%bf. this is going to be my 5th cycle. i dont know where that 400mg of eq for weeks 13 and 14 came from. they are not supposed to be there. so cancel that. goals for this cycle are to put on as much mass as possible in about the first 9 weeks. after that, im basically turning it over to a cutting cycle. ive done something similiar to this before but without the tren and winny and have excellent results. i want some more quality muscle to come about from the tren and to basically get as hard as possible from the winny. appreciate the comments

madmax - good call on the hcg . didnt know what i was thinkin when i typed this up over here. thanks

**Li Bert** · 02-11-2003, 08:58 PM

Originally posted by Madmax
hcg 500 i.u ed for 10-14 days (17-18)
clomid 2 days after last hcg injection

y would u want to run so clomid so far after the last winny injection? clomid after winny should be started the nexy day. half life is way to short to start that far after

**Rickson** · 02-11-2003, 09:10 PM

He is refferring to your last EQ shot I believe.

**Madmax** · 02-12-2003, 07:34 AM

Originally posted by Li Bert

y would u want to run so clomid so far after the last winny injection? clomid after winny should be started the nexy day. half life is way to short to start that far after

i know what the life of winny is bro...you could take the clomid the next day but i have always taken it 2 days after...just because you might overdraw on your winny and get less days out of the bottle then you were originally supposed to...winny is a bitch to measure out even and after 5 weeks of using it you might run out early buy 1 cc...and that would mean that the 3 week period you were supposed to wait from your last eq shot to your clomid was really only 20 days instead of 21....make sense now....one day isn't going to kill you...there is nothing wrong with doing it that way...it's not like your nuts are going to be less effected by clomid if you wait an extra day..ive always done it and it worked out fine....Madmax..

**OGPackin** · 02-12-2003, 08:35 AM

Hey bro, well i'll give u my thoughts about ur cycle and u can take it from there...First off i think its to much gear. IMO stacking 4, 5 different AS doesnt mean ur going to see any better results then if u stacked 2 or 3. 2nd, The way it looks it looks like a cutting cycle. Then why are u running the dbol ? Id use the prop to kcik start the cycle instead. 3rd, I'd hold off on the clen and t3. I would have used it before u started ur cycle and stop while on it. Reason being u run the risk of the clen and t3 buring muscle instead of fat. Plus I dont recommend t3 at all but thats just me. I also dont think u need the HCG either. And definitely not run winny and dbol in the same cycle. U also need to run the fina 8 weeks. Reason being fina could take anywhere from 2 - 4 weeks to reach an even consistent level where u'll get the most out of it. If u only run it 6 weeks u might only get 2 weeks worth anything. And theres no point in front loading the enant at 1000mgs it wont make it kick in quicker so IMO its a waste. And that goes for the EQ also.

Heeeeew, ok those are some of the reasons why i dont like ur cycle. If u have any questions im happy to respond back. Id run something like this........

weeks 1 - 4 100mgs prop ed
weeks 1 - 12 500mgs enant
weeks 1 - 10 400mgs eq
weeks 7 - 15 .75cc's fina ed
weeks 9 - 15 50mgs winny ed - IMO u dont need it, but if u want to

3 days after last fina injection and winny start clomid.

OG

**Rich8888** · 02-12-2003, 09:40 AM

Wow..bro...Too much gear, both OG and MM offer really sound cycle ideas for you to consider. DO YOUR RESEARCH....before you poke

**Big Al** · 02-12-2003, 10:03 AM

After five cycles I think you know what works for you. I agree with some of the points it is a lot of gear, but the cycle is well structured, I believe in long-acting esters finishing with short acting, so switching to prop at the end is a good idea, I have started with prop as opposed to ending with, and I prefer ending, and IMO d-bol can be used quite happily in the begining of a cutting cycle, and nothings kick-starts a cycle like D-bol and six weeks, well after five cycles your body shouldn't have a problem I have been running D-bol currently with prop and clen for a six weeker and no problems what-so-ever. I personnally wouldn't frontload, it really offers no benefit IME, I would make a few minor changes here and there, but in principal I think you are on the money.

**Li Bert** · 02-12-2003, 11:16 AM

Originally posted by Madmax
i know what the life of winny is bro...you could take the clomid the next day but i have always taken it 2 days after...just because you might overdraw on your winny and get less days out of the bottle then you were originally supposed to...winny is a bitch to measure out even and after 5 weeks of using it you might run out early buy 1 cc...and that would mean that the 3 week period you were supposed to wait from your last eq shot to your clomid was really only 20 days instead of 21....make sense now....one day isn't going to kill you...there is nothing wrong with doing it that way...it's not like your nuts are going to be less effected by clomid if you wait an extra day..ive always done it and it worked out fine....Madmax..

ok...i agree with you when it comes to measuring gear and how so can get lost. but i have more then enough of everything to last me even if i screw up or break a whole bottle. so it really doesnt matter. thanks for the heads up

**Li Bert** · 02-12-2003, 11:40 AM

Originally posted by OGPackin
Hey bro, well i'll give u my thoughts about ur cycle and u can take it from there...First off i think its to much gear. IMO stacking 4, 5 different AS doesnt mean ur going to see any better results then if u stacked 2 or 3. 2nd, The way it looks it looks like a cutting cycle. Then why are u running the dbol ? Id use the prop to kcik start the cycle instead. 3rd, I'd hold off on the clen and t3. I would have used it before u started ur cycle and stop while on it. Reason being u run the risk of the clen and t3 buring muscle instead of fat. Plus I dont recommend t3 at all but thats just me. I also dont think u need the HCG either. And definitely not run winny and dbol in the same cycle. U also need to run the fina 8 weeks. Reason being fina could take anywhere from 2 - 4 weeks to reach an even consistent level where u'll get the most out of it. If u only run it 6 weeks u might only get 2 weeks worth anything. And theres no point in front loading the enant at 1000mgs it wont make it kick in quicker so IMO its a waste. And that goes for the EQ also.

Heeeeew, ok those are some of the reasons why i dont like ur cycle. If u have any questions im happy to respond back. Id run something like this........

weeks 1 - 4 100mgs prop ed
weeks 1 - 12 500mgs enant
weeks 1 - 10 400mgs eq
weeks 7 - 15 .75cc's fina ed
weeks 9 - 15 50mgs winny ed - IMO u dont need it, but if u want to

3 days after last fina injection and winny start clomid.

OG

certain types of gear provide you with different things. im using the test enan, eq and dbols for a heavy bulking period of 10 weeks. i basically want to put on as much mass as possible in that time. on the other hand, im switching the cycle to cutting cycle towards the end to pull off the excess fat that i add durning the bulking period. i want the winny strictly for hardness and striations. the tren will help me add a few more pounds of quality muscle. the prop is there to help me keep the muscle that the t3 is going to break apart along with all that fat. ive never frontloaded before and wanted to give it a try but since this is a long cycle, i feel now that there is no need for it. maybe some prop at the beggining also at 100mg/eod for the first 2 weeks. havent decided yet. i dont even believe you would say that i wouldnt need hcg after 10 weeks of eq. thats crazy. eq is gonna shut me down pretty hard and basically have no sex drive when im done with this. not to mention a hard time maintaining or even getting an erection. thats just my expieriences from eq. im not going to use t3 and clen before the cycle b/c my bf now is around 11% and there is no need to. i have done similiar cycles like this, but not with as much gear and have had great success. 25-30 pounds to start off with. after cutting and going from 13% bf to around 7%. i still was up about 18 solid pounds.

**Li Bert** · 02-12-2003, 11:44 AM

Originally posted by Big Al
After five cycles I think you know what works for you. I agree with some of the points it is a lot of gear, but the cycle is well structured, I believe in long-acting esters finishing with short acting, so switching to prop at the end is a good idea, I have started with prop as opposed to ending with, and I prefer ending, and IMO d-bol can be used quite happily in the begining of a cutting cycle, and nothings kick-starts a cycle like D-bol and six weeks, well after five cycles your body shouldn't have a problem I have been running D-bol currently with prop and clen for a six weeker and no problems what-so-ever. I personnally wouldn't frontload, it really offers no benefit IME, I would make a few minor changes here and there, but in principal I think you are on the money.

thanks Al. we both have similiar ideas on how to put together our cycles together. i like ending with short esters also instead of lets say running the tren for the first 8 weeks. i dont like that. are u using any anti-e's in your prop, clen and dbol cycle? im going to run liquidex the whole 15 weeks at .5mg