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  1. #1
    jtrio5 is offline New Member
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    Sustanon 250, Deca, Clomid cycle. Need Advice!

    I am 25 years of age, Weigh 180. And I exercise 4-7 days a week. May meal plan is set. I was curious if anyone had any advice for me... I am going to be doing a sustanon , deca cycle. My pct is clomid. I have done a few sustanon cycles before none being with deca. I would like to get the most out of what I have. I've got 40 amp organon sustanon, 40 amp deca. 100 clomid. If anyone has some words of wisdom I'd greatly appreciate it.

  2. #2
    vikingvip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtrio5 View Post
    I am 25 years of age, Weigh 180. And I exercise 4-7 days a week. May meal plan is set. I was curious if anyone had any advice for me... I am going to be doing a sustanon, deca cycle. My pct is clomid. I have done a few sustanon cycles before none being with deca. I would like to get the most out of what I have. I've got 40 amp organon sustanon, 40 amp deca. 100 clomid. If anyone has some words of wisdom I'd greatly appreciate it.
    50 mg of clomid a day for 30 days... after your cycle.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingvip View Post
    50 mg of clomid a day for 30 days... after your cycle.
    sustan 750-1000 mg a week, deca 400-500 a week.... Good cycle

  4. #4
    DanB is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingvip View Post
    50 mg of clomid a day for 30 days... after your cycle.
    you need to tell him when to start

    op 18 days after last injection

  5. #5
    DanB is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingvip View Post
    sustan 750-1000 mg a week, deca 400-500 a week.... Good cycle
    yes good cycle for experienced user, by his stats he isnt

    op take 500mg of sust and 400mg deca and stop the deca 2 weeks before test i.e. deca 10 weeks sustanon 12 weeks

    actually what mg per ml are your deca amps? 100mg, 200mg? im guessing one of these, i have never seen 250mg deca amps before. . . .
    Last edited by DanB; 03-07-2012 at 05:27 PM.

  6. #6
    jtrio5 is offline New Member
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    Are you thinking a 10 week cycle. in the past i've done 500 mg a week. Have you ever ran Deca with Sustanon ? Did you get good gains?

  7. #7
    DanB is offline Banned
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    also look into nolvadex for pct

    armidex or aromasin for an a.i. on cycle

    this is ESSENTIAL you NEED an a.i.

    also look into hcg to prevent testicular atrophy( your balls shrinking)

    also makes recovery alot easier since you arent fully shut down

    OP how tall are you and what is your current bodyfat?

    what will your daily macros be on cycle?

    7 days a week is too much I.M.O if your goals are just to bulk

    You say you have done a few sustanon cycles, can you give us a more detailed cycle history?

  8. #8
    jtrio5 is offline New Member
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    Thanks DanB I like the sound of that.

  9. #9
    jtrio5 is offline New Member
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    I am 5'8. Bf 13%. Is nolvadex a need? Sounds like I better hold off a little while to get the ai and hcg ....
    As far as past cycles I weighed 130 bf 7% doing 500 mg a week sustanon . I got good gains. Then cycled the same ever since. My last cycle was last year.

  10. #10
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    nolva is a must run your pct 18 days after last deca injhection or 14 after sus which ever one is last.

    Nolva 40/40/20/20
    Clomid 50/50/25/25

    ^^^ mg per day every day. the / indicates a week so 4 weeks

  11. #11
    DanB is offline Banned
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    yes nolvadex is needed, some would say even more so than clomid because it binds to different estrogen receptors, and many argue it is simply more effective

    if you use armidex as an a.i. it can cause an estrogen rebound which without nolvadex can become a problem

    aromasin dosnt cause such a rebound it destroys the estrogen

    nolvadex is cheap anyway

    130lbs was way too light to cycle, but that ship has long sailed so i wont bother

    whats your current daily macros?

  12. #12
    DanB is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by bob87 View Post
    nolva is a must run your pct 18 days after last deca injhection or 14 after sus which ever one is last.

    Nolva 40/40/20/20
    Clomid 50/50/25/25

    ^^^ mg per day every day. the / indicates a week so 4 weeks
    wrong

  13. #13
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    shit i meant 18 and 21 sorry for the **** up multi tasking with my 5 week old

  14. #14
    DanB is offline Banned
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    no problem

  15. #15
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    cheers for pointing that out i dont wanna giving dumbass info out.

  16. #16
    DanB is offline Banned
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    we all make simple mistakes sometimes dont worry about it

  17. #17
    jtrio5 is offline New Member
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    protien 170 grams, calories around 2000, carbs 220 grams. I can get the nolva from my source by the end of my cycle. But as far as the Ai. and hcg . They don't have it. I wish I could say simple fix but you might know how troublesome it can be too find new sources.

  18. #18
    DanB is offline Banned
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    ok bro here is the best advise you will ever get trust me on this

    go to the nutrition section, post your current diet i.e. all your daily meals complete with macros

    also post your stats and goals there aswell,

    let the guys there improve your diet,and yes it does need drastic improvement,

    i would take in more cals if i was cutting and twice the protein

    no offense intended here at all mate, i just call a spade a spade

    stick to the diet religiously they help you make for 6 months, drop down to 4 or 5 days max lifing per week

    and trust me on this mate you WILL grow naturally, cycle if you want but either way your wasting your time trying to gain with that diet and my bet is that if you keep your current diet for a year with no more cycles, alot of your gains will drop off

  19. #19
    vikingvip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanB View Post
    you need to tell him when to start

    op 18 days after last injection

    You see it is the detail which I did not know. I force myself gave advice in the best of my knowledge. Thank you Danb

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanB View Post
    yes good cycle for experienced user, by his stats he isnt

    op take 500mg of sust and 400mg deca and stop the deca 2 weeks before test i.e. deca 10 weeks sustanon 12 weeks

    actually what mg per ml are your deca amps? 100mg, 200mg? im guessing one of these, i have never seen 250mg deca amps before. . . .

     stop deca 2 weeks before the test for the libido? Deca can cut the libido and can give of the difficulty to ejaculate? I reacted in this way it is to generalize? thank bro

  21. #21
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    I did the exact cycle for 10 weeks and 8 week deca at 200/ week. An AI is absolutely necessary as my estrogen went up and I blew up like a blow fish plus I got alot of acne on my face. I was being generous with my arimedex at .5 mg 3 times a week so I uptd the dose to every other day and after a week I felt the difference so I went back to 3 times a week . you don't want to totally distroy your estrogen as you will get libido issues and it may hinder gains as estrogen is still needed to promote muscle growth. Hcg is a must and you don't have
    to over do it either IMO . I shot 250 twice a week and my nuts stayed nice an plump.

    Dandb two questions. explain what causes estrogen rebound if you dont mind. and I decided to start the Nolva and clomid on day 11 as I don't see a valid reason not to. in other words i feel that the longest ester of sustanon is so low amount relative to the other 3 estera that by day 10 or 11 I would barely have any synthetic test left or very little for that matter . so why not begin pct following the 10 day as a few days here or there should be a big deal, but I could be wrong and would like your opinion. By the way my pct will be 100/50/50/50 clomid and 40/20/20/20 Nolva .

  22. #22
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    thanks

  23. #23
    DanB is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikingvip View Post
     stop deca 2 weeks before the test for the libido? Deca can cut the libido and can give of the difficulty to ejaculate? I reacted in this way it is to generalize? thank bro
    Im not entirely sure I understand your question there but, I think you ask why stop 2 weeks before the test?

    Simply because it gives the deca a chance to clear before pct, and it is much easier to recover from test than deca, there's more too it than that I'm just simplifying it as much as I can

  24. #24
    DanB is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by jandj View Post
    I did the exact cycle for 10 weeks and 8 week deca at 200/ week. An AI is absolutely necessary as my estrogen went up and I blew up like a blow fish plus I got alot of acne on my face. I was being generous with my arimedex at .5 mg 3 times a week so I uptd the dose to every other day and after a week I felt the difference so I went back to 3 times a week . you don't want to totally distroy your estrogen as you will get libido issues and it may hinder gains as estrogen is still needed to promote muscle growth. Hcg is a must and you don't have
    to over do it either IMO . I shot 250 twice a week and my nuts stayed nice an plump.

    Dandb two questions. explain what causes estrogen rebound if you dont mind. and I decided to start the Nolva and clomid on day 11 as I don't see a valid reason not to. in other words i feel that the longest ester of sustanon is so low amount relative to the other 3 estera that by day 10 or 11 I would barely have any synthetic test left or very little for that matter . so why not begin pct following the 10 day as a few days here or there should be a big deal, but I could be wrong and would like your opinion. By the way my pct will be 100/50/50/50 clomid and 40/20/20/20 Nolva .
    Aromasin is whats called a sucidal inhibitor, basically it kills the aromatize enzyme which is what causes the estrogen, not all but most up to roughly 85%
    Armidex is a non sucidal inhibitor, it binds to the aromatize enzyme (up to 65% of total) and prevents the conversion of androgen to estrogen, remove the armidex and all bets are off and since it didnt kill the enzyme like Aromasin would then you have an abundance of aromatize enzyme's floating around dying to convert to estrogen with nothing to stop them and therefore it can cause big problems

    Nolvadex is then used because it prevents estrogen from binding to the receptors, rendering it effectively harmless

    The PCT early start yeah I can see your logic but your test levels will be too high and it will have little effect, you still need to run a 4 week PCT in the normal timeframe to restore everything to normal, now dont quote me on this as its just my thinking, Swifto as well as some of the other mods/vets could give you a definate answer but I dont really see a problem with starting 2 weeks early and extending the PCT to 6 weeks, but you CANT start at day 10-11 and do a 4 week PCT because there is simply too much test left in your body at that stage and the 2 weeks when levels are low enough for PCT to be effective simply wont be long enough

  25. #25
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    i agree with Dan on everything
    If people can't tell your on steroids then your doing them wrong

  26. #26
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    I see the logic of extending pct to 5 weeks . I wonder which has a better result . waiting for your test to drop to 0 and not hpta, lh or fsh stimulation or starting a 5 days earlier with very low test levels but starting to stimulate hpta lh and fsh
    while extending pct an extra week. For a common
    sense and practical standpoint the latter seems to be more effective .. thoughts ?

  27. #27
    DanB is offline Banned
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    I aint an expert in this field bro to be honest, while I do have an understanding of it, and again see your logic but I realise that when it comes to the things I dont understand, there are those that do understand it and they form the protocols that we follow, I trust the mods/vets here and if they tell me to just start at X then thats what I shall do until I increase my knowledge to a point where I can challenge the protocol if I see a better way.

    I dont think endogenous test will have dropped to 0 at start of pct, it will definately be very low, mabey 5 days earlier will do no harm but no good either because of the before mentioned reason of test levels being above your normal baseline, and its therefore overkill to start early? There could also be a number of factors that I'm overlooking here but on the flip side, yes Clomid has been shown to stimulate lh and fsh and so has HCG so the combination of HCG on cycle and a kickstart before PCT and earlier start of Clomid in my non-expert head makes sense to stimulate lh and fsh

    Actually I'd like a concrete answer on this now myself, I'm going to dig deeper into this

  28. #28
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    I appreciate that.. Would be anxiously awaiting as my 11 day is on Friday.

  29. #29
    DanB is offline Banned
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    Hmmmm I shall call in some back up for you then lol

  30. #30
    DanB is offline Banned
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    It may be tomorrow before he responds so I would subscribe to the thread Jandi if I were you . . . . . .

  31. #31
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    Is that how it's done !! you just tought me something else!!

  32. #32
    DanB is offline Banned
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    top of screen under buy steroids banner, you will see thread tools, then drop down menu and subscribe to thread

  33. #33
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    SERMs have little effects on subjects that are already shutdown using androgens.

    I dont see the point in starting PCT earlier than when Test is higher than 100mg or so. Even then, SERMs may not raise endo. T.

    You'de be better blasting your testes with HCG leading upto PCT IMO.

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