To Rickson: Here is the Anavar Liver Study

[WiLLpOwEr]

Hey man,

No, this isn't the study done in 1993 with the alcohol patients. It's another one that I found @ http://www.cafdis-antidoping.net/doc...179167BE64.pdf

I bolded one part.



Jones RW, El Bishti MM, Bloom SR, Burke J, Carter JE, Counahan R et al. The effects of anabolic steroids on growth, body composition, and metabolism in boys with chronic renal failure on regular hemodialysis. J Pediatr 1980;97(4):559-66.
Abstract: Eight boys aged 9.5 to 17 years, on regular hemodialysis for chronic renal failure, were treated for 0.4 to 1.3 years with the anabolic steroid oxandrolone. The effects on linear growth, skeletal maturation, cell mass, and the fasting levels and response to intravenous glucose of BG, IRI, NEFA, BCAA, and IRG were measured. Following treatment there was a significant increase in mean growth velocity, growth velocity standard deviation score related to bone age, and cell mass. Overall
skeletal maturation was not accelerated, and only a small advance in pubertal status was seen. There was a decrease in fasting levels of BG and NEFA; fasting BCAA and IRG were increased. The response
to intravenous glucose was altered; there was a decrease in peak BG response, an increase in peak IRI response, and a more marked fall in plasma NEFA and BCAA levels. Fasting IRG levels correlated
with fasting BG levels, and fell significantly following intravenous glucose both before and after treatment. Hepatotoxicity, which was reversible, was seen in a ninth boy who did not complete the
study. The only other side effect, salt and water retention, was controlled by a reduction in oxandrolone dosage. These preliminary results suggest that anabolic steroids may be useful to
stimulate anabolism and growth in uremic children, and that their effect is mediated by an increase in insulin secretion and/or an improvement in tissue sensitivity to insulin. Further studies with careful
monitoring are required to substantiate the effect on final height and the risks involved.

As you can see, hepatotoxicity was only seen in one kid, who did not complete it, which probably means he was taking something else which caused the toxicity!

[Ex_banana-eater]

Great data

[Rickson]

I can't read the study for some reason. How much were they treated with dosage wise? Does it show improved liver function? What were the base line liver values for each child? Toxicity and elevated liver values are different so while toxicity can be overstated elevated liver enzymes can cause problems especially in adults? What would indicate that taking this 17AA like any other wouldn't cause the liver to work harder? I think on the surface I agree that any 17AA is not as toxic as we make it out to be but that doesn't mean it doesn't have an effect on the liver. Is there anything in that study which would back up that in a normal healthy adult taking anavar will improve liver function as stated in your post? Always welcome new info though and thank you for taking the time to look up the study. If you can post the whole thing I would appreciate it since all I get is a bunch of lines when I try to download it.

[CarbonCopy]

Hey Rickson that is a PDF file that is why you can't view it. You need Adobe Acrobat viewer to read it. You can download it for free from Adobe.

You can download it here:

http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

Peace,
CC

[Rickson]

Thank you CARBONCOPY. Willpower I can read it so don't bother posting.

[WiLLpOwEr]

Rickson that is the whole thing.

You're right, there is a lot of information missing from that study...like the dosage, and some of the values for liver function.

Please, Rickson, don't misinterpuret what I am trying to say. I am not saying that all 17aa steroids do not affect the liver, in fact that would be nonsense. What I am saying, is that specifically Anavar does not adversely impact the liver. That study was the best one I found, as many others do not examine liver function before and after oxandrolone treatment. However, I have still yet to see any study which shows a direct coorelation to Anavar ingestion and hepatoxicity.

The reason I am trying to start this whole "Anavar does not hurt the liver" campaign is to try to re-write the information on the main website. On the "Drug Profiles" page, the Oxandrolone information states: "Since Oxandrolone is only slightly toxic and usually shows few side effects it is used by several athletes over a prolonged period of time. However Oxandrolone should not be taken for several consecutive months, since, as with almost all oral steroids it is 1 7-alpha alky-lated and thus liver toxic."

That's what I'm trying to change, because I love the site, and I do not want it to be giving out false information.

[Rickson]

Well Willpower,
I don't think we are giving out false information. Any 17AA makes the liver work harder. This can potentially lead to problems. Now I have personally stayed on 17AA's for a long period of time without any adverse effect and most people probably could. However, just like some people can exercise and eat perfectly and die from a heart attack at 40 and others can eat terrible and never exercise and live to be 100, the same is true with liver function. The very study you quote shows one child having to drop out of the study due to liver toxicity. You assume it is from something else but he may be genetically more predisposed to this condition then the others. It is our job to inform people of the potential sides of a drug and high liver values which could lead to problems is one for any 17AA. I am not an alarmist meaning you will never see me say you can stay on for 4 weeks but if you stay on for 5 weeks your gonna die but at the same time one liver is all you get and erring on the side of caution is the smart thing to do. The fact that we don't know the dosages on this study makes it sort of useless since I would guess the dosages people do are going to probably be anywhere from 2.5 times to 10 times the amount done in this study. I have seen elevated liver values on my test at only 20mg a day of ox which tells me the drug isn't that easy on the liver and shouldn't be used for a prolonged period of time unless necessary and monitored by a physician.

[WiLLpOwEr]

Yeah I guess your right man.

Too many variables to consider, I think it's smart to play it safe.

Until a more conclusive study is performed, I guess we should assume that it can be potentialy harmful. I'm glad I see that now. Thanks for taking the time to analyze both the study and my posts.