I wanted to say hi, and get some cycle help

[The Snake]

Hi everyboy, I just finally decided to become a member after reading the comments on here for a year now. This is the most helpful site I have ever found on this topic. I am 22 years old and weigh 183 pounds right now. I have been working out for 4 years now and I just love going to the gym and pounding out my built up aggression at the gym. I was pretty dumb last year because I decided to do a cycle without doing much research. I just way too naive and thought steroids were gonna be like a miracle drug transforming me into a monster. My cycle was only 8 weeks in duration and I did 250mg of Sustanon a week and 200mg of Deca a week. I did no antiestrogen because I never even knew what they were. Before the cycle I was about 170 pounds and by the end of the cycle I was 195 pounds. I gained an incredible amount of strength as well. I had trained extremely hard and ate really well because I figured that would be important while juicing. I was pretty glad with the results but boy was there a hard crash after. It plays on your mind quite a bit and I wanted to do another cycle but I had to stop myself and accept the losses and focus on my school instead. To tell you the truth, after the hard crash, I really started training intensely again and after falling to 180 pounds, I came back up to 190 pounds and was as strong as ever just this last december. I had to take a 2 months of because of a leg injury but I have been going to the gym consistently for the last few months but i feel like I am just going through the motions maintaining now instead of trying to make gains. But I want to train really hard here for the next couple of months and then maybe do my 2nd cycle in September. I wanted to know what you guys think of this cycle,

Weeks 1-4 25mg/day dbol
Weeks 1-10 500mg of Sustanon
and then clomid therapy for three weeks after the last shot of Sus
Day 1 300mg of clomid
Day 2-11 100mg of clomid
Day 12-21 50mg of clomid

What I would like to know is how are you supposed to administer the dbol? Do you just take it like an Advil or is it better to let it dissolve underneath you tongue? Also I am hoping that someone can tell me if I start clomid the second after my last shot of Sustanon? Or the day after? My goals for this cycle are to put on some bulk and try to maintain as much gains as possible in size and strength. Should I be taking anything else with this cycle like some winny or Deca to solidify gains? I usually see that people like to do dbol, sus and deca together for gains but I dont really want to gain like 30 pounds and then lose it all, my goal is to keep a solid 10-15 pounds after doing this cycle. Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated. I look forward to being an active member on this site for a long time, its just a wikid site. Oh, sorry that I have no pictures, I will try to take some just before my cycle and keep posting them throughout hopefully.

[hellapimpin]

your cycle looks okay..i would up my dbol to 40 mgs a day, and from weeks 8-12 run some winny... do clomid 3 weeks after your last shot of sust.. your clomid therapy seems to be pretty good...good luck dude

and

Bump

[The Snake]

Thanks for the reply hellapimpin, I was kinda worried that my post was to long or something, I never have done this before. I have just been reading the stuff on here for about a year. So i should start clomid around week 13? Does the winny help solidify gains and how much of it should I do? Oh yeah I wanted to know what bump means?

[01dragonslayer]

Hey snake, welcome to the board. There is only a few suggetions I would recommend with your cycle. You could bump the d-bol up to 30mg/ED, but I wouldn't go much higher than that for now since this is your first time cycling it. D-bol is heptoxic so make sure you add some milk thistle, ALA, glutamine, or Tyler's Detox in there. Also, try and split your doses 3xs/day because of its short half-life, i.e. 10mg/A.M.; 10mg/mid-afternoon; 10mg/before retiring. I would definately throw winny in there wks 7-12 at 50mg/ED. I include it into all my cycles because you can cycle right up until your recovery of clomid(and I love the pumps and hardness I get from it). You could cycle some deca at 400mg/wk also, but thats up to you. I would even suggest some EQ. Start your post cycle clomid wk13 at the doses you have listed. Don't forget your anti-e s and have nolva on hand. 'Bump' is just a way to send your post back up to the top of the threads. Remember to train hard and eat clean. Good luck.

[The Snake]

Thanks Dragon Slayer, I think I will throw some winny in there, bu then do I do clomid 3 weeks after my last sustanon shot or do I wait until 3 weeks after winstrol ? I think it is supposed to be after the Sus right? Oh and do u know if you are supposed to just swallow the dbol or clomid or let it dissolve under your tongue? Thanks for the help though bro, greatly appreciated.

[01dragonslayer]

Start your clomid 3wks after your last shot of sust, which would also be one day after your last dose of winny. As far as taking d-bol and clomid sub-lingually, I'm not sure on that. I've always swallowed the tabs so I can't comment its effectiveness by letting it dissolve under the tongue. D-bol kicks in fairly quick so I suppose you could maybe try it, but if you don't start seeing results I would either start chewing them or swallow them whole.

[The Snake]

Thanks a bunch Dragon Slayer, Just another quick question though, What benefits do u think Deca or EQ would have in the particular cycle I outlined? Deca would probably be good for the joints, and Im not sure what EQ would do, but would they help solidify gains? Im just kind of undecided about doing so much gear in a cycle, sometimes less is more Im thinkin. My main goals for this cycle are to bulk up and try to keep as much size as possible. In your experience do u think winny in the cycle help makes u harder and keep gains better?

[01dragonslayer]

Personally, I always include EQ and winny into all my cycles. IMO EQ is a great anabolic because it can be used for cutting OR bulking. I also like the increased appetite effect it has. It helps me consume all those extra calories needed for muscle building. Its also an erythrocytic, meaning it increases your RBC s and makes you very vascular and gains are very retainable. I include winny into all my cycles because it enables me to cycle all the way up till clomid therapy. Not to mention the hardness and pumps that I get from it. Plus the gains that you achieve from winny near permanant. I never cycled deca and probaly never will because I know that you tend to bloat while cycling deca because of the water retention. There is also a theory that says that EQ and deca shouldn't be used in the same cycle because they tend to fight for the same receptor sites, so in essence you'd be wasting gear. I'm not sure how much truth there is behind that, but I stay away from deca because I don't want the extra water retetion. But it really all depends on what your trying to achieve. Just my opinion.

[The Snake]

Thanks Bro,

After reading for hours and hours I think this is what my cycle is gonna look like:

Weeks 1-4 dbol 30mg/day split into three 10mg doses in a day
Weeks 1-10 500mg of Sustanon split into three shots in a week (MWF)
Weeks 7-12 Winstrol at 50mg/day
Week 13- Begin clomid therapy 300mg day 1 and then 100mg for next
10 days and then 50mg for next 10

What do u guys think? Also any suggestions about fitting EQ in there would be wikid. Thans so much for the help dragonslayer.

[01dragonslayer]

Wks 1-10 400mg/EQ. You can even mix it with the sust. Good luck.

[joe_capone]

squeeze in eq at 400mg weeks 1-12 this will make u happier

[The Snake]

By mixing it with Sust, do u mean actually putting the two together in same injection? Like if I am doing 500mg of sust and 400mg of eq a week, could i just do mwf of about 165mg of sust and 125mg of Eq for each injection?

[joe_capone]

yes mix the eq with the sus to ease the pain from the prop. just mix 250 mg of sust and 200 eq wich makes 2 ml.. thats if u have the sustanon amps and 200mg/ml eq vial.. if u wanna split the sustaon to eod.. go ahead and u still can mix 200 mg of eq with it.

[01dragonslayer]

Originally posted by The Snake
By mixing it with Sust, do u mean actually putting the two together in same injection? Like if I am doing 500mg of sust and 400mg of eq a week, could i just do mwf of about 165mg of sust and 125mg of Eq for each injection?

Yes, you can mix the two in the same syringe, but you really don't need to inject it 3xs a wk. Twice is fine, but it will also depend on the mg/ml of EQ you have in order to determine how/when to inject it. For example, if you have EQ that is 200mg/ml then you can take a 200mg dose on Mon. and another on Fri. If you have Eq that is 50mg/ml you could take one dose of 150mg(3cc s) on Mon; 100mg(2cc s) on Wed; and another 150mg on Fri. I suggest trying to get EQ that is 200mg/ml; alot less injects. BTW if you decide to bump the EQ to 12wks, as suggested by jcapone, don't forget to bump the rest of your cycle two wks as well.

[The Snake]

Thanks joe_capone, it sounds like a better idea to do just 2 shots a week of the stuff. My sust comes in 250mg amps so it would be easier to do two shots if I am doing 500mg a week. I dont have any EQ right now but does it usually come in 200mg/ml vials? I still have a few months until I start the cycle so I can just wait until all gear is acquired. Can't wait though lol. Oh by the way, should I have other antiestrogens on hand like nolvadex ? Its better to be safe but I dont know if it is necessary with this cycle.

[The Snake]

Thanks Dragonslayer, I was just asking some of the questions that u answered when u replied. I really gotta give u guys props. I feel alot more prepared now. I just talked to my boy and i can get all that stuff so I am pretty much set now. Just gotta train hard for a couple more months while waiting to begin.

[01dragonslayer]

Anti e s are a must for any cycle that includes test. Yes, you'll definately need some for this stack, i.e. armidex, liquidex, femara, etc. Gotta have nolva on hand too.

[joe_capone]

yes bro you need anti estrogens.. you are using dbol and test. get some arimidex or liqudex they both the same anyways but ldex is a pill form to keep down water rentation and to prevent estrogen. also get some nolvadex just incase. THIS IS A MUST. they say sust should be used eod.. but i always done my shots monday and thursdays. 2 amps (500 mg) a week and it worked just fine for me. but split it up if you wanna see how it goes. and make it eod. yes the best eq u can get ahold of come in 10ml vials 200mg/ml.

[joe_capone]

i am soo sorry im meant ldex is the liquid form lool my bad.

[The Snake]

Thanks alot Bro's

So i guess my planning is done,
Week 1-4 30mg/day dbol
Week 1-10 500mg Sus and 400mg of EQ taken Mon and Thurs
Week 7-12 50mg/day Winstrol
Week 13- Begin clomid therapy
And have liquidex and nolvadex on hand in case of gyno
Would u only do those antiestrogens if u see signs of gyno or do u do liquidex during your cycle? Like how do u do those throughout your cycle? What days and how long?

[The Snake]

Anybody else got any suggestions for me? Tell me what u guys think of cycle? Any feedback or personal experiences with any of the stuff I am planning to use would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Bro's.

[Rickson]

I would use the liquidex at .5mg ED throughout the cycle and post cycle therapy .