How easy is it to keep naturally attainable gains after using a cycle.

[2jzgte]

Say someone who hasn't reached their natural genetic limit goes on gear and gains around 14 lbs. Are they more likely to keep their gains after a proper pct than somone who used gear to go passed their genetic limit Meaning they plateaued naturally and later used gear to get even heavier.

[almostgone]

Not sure of the wording of your question, but here's a good thread that may help you....

AAS- Tips on keeping gains for the moderate user

[scotty51312]

I think I understand what he's getting at.

Say the average Joe who hits the gym 3x a week eats an average diet with and average body say 5"10" 175lbs at 15%bf gains 15lbs on a 10week cycle. What are the chances he will keeps those gains? If that person falls back into the old routine of eating average and training average then they will absolutely not keep the gains.

The whole point of trying to reach your genetic potential is learning how your body works and how gains are made and kept.

Without knowing these things you'll just end up back where you started

[Chicagotarsier]

I think he is asking (on gear) if gains under genetic limit are more or less easily kept than gains over the genetic limit.

I do not know the answer just clarifying for a knowledgeable person to chime in.

[AD]

gains before genetic limit can be maintained if you eat and train appropriately.

gains beyond genetic limit, can only be maintained with gear, provided you eat and train appropriately.

[2jzgte]

gains before genetic limit can be maintained if you eat and train appropriately.

gains beyond genetic limit, can only be maintained with gear, provided you eat and train appropriately.

Thanks JD and Chicago, that's exactly what I was asking, couldn't figure out how to word it right but you hit it on the spot.

[auswest]

most of the time people cycling who have not built a strong base, do not know how to eat or train correctly.

IMHO, about 95% of people I see cycle lose everything they gained, wether it be after a month or 6 months. People may think they maintained it because they weight the same but most of the time they just start getting fat and continue to try and balance that figure on the scale, or they jump back on cycle to soon to notice..

What im trying to say from what I've seen for the greater percentage of people they just go up and down cycle to cycle while never making any significant long term progress. We all think we know how to eat and train but it is a never ending learning curve that even mR O's are always working on.

Personally if I knew when I started what I knew now I would have realised steroids is a long term commitment for anyone trying to make a real difference in their physique. You quickly get to the point you are spinning your wheels and staying on is invertible for anyone looking for real long term results.

Most people in your local gym cycle or have cycled but how many actually look good, cycling to your "natural limit" is not as easy as done because chances are given most people experience with lifting and diet they will never stay there

[XxAndreaxX]

My case is the following. I’m an Ectomorph, tending a little to endomorph, but we can put my type into ectomorph. We all know, ectomorphs are the worst cases to maintain gains after cycle. I’m 6ft at 68kg stock weight <12% Bf. My best gains natty were around 72-74kg at the same bf or 70kg at less than 10%BF.
After 3 cycles, I’m at 88kg at 14-15% BF natty 1 year after last pin. I don’t diet strictly, I’m on a high caloric diet and no supplements are used.
So my conclusion: the key to maintain gains, is first to do cycles with dry compounds only, so what you gain is lean.
The waterweight you gain, is waterweight you loose after.
You have to stay on a high caloric diet, you’ll get a little bit fat, but you won’t loose muscle that fast.
Another point, push the same weight and same workout. You might be able to hold strenght, because when you go off, your higher caloric diet, will give you that extra power, and if that’s not enough, you may take some creatine.
IMO, Supplements like Protein powder and Protein rich meals are not necessary, If you are on a high caloric diet and you don’t mind to retain some fat. So, that works for me, after a year being natty, I’m even stronger.
That if you plan to do a cycle a year, your body won’t have the time to retain too much fat. If you don’t plan to cycle again, you should change strategy.

[fit2bOld]

Over my lifetime I've been able to put on about 50 lbs of muscle 175 to 225. I easily maintain around 200. I did not use AAS to gain the first 25-30 lbs that is the base I built and still have.

[XxAndreaxX]

the thing is, if strenght and performance is maintained, or at least very similar to when you are on, you shouldn't loose very much lean muscle. you might loose all the bloat, but that's normal.

[scotty51312]

did someone really just say high protein meals aren't needed to maintain muscle gains? What would you suggest McDonalds? Thats high calorie

[itsjayman02]

did someone really just say high protein meals aren't needed to maintain muscle gains? What would you suggest McDonalds? Thats high calorie

You read that ridiculous quote correctly!!

[DJMikeT]

I've come to the conclusion from reading some of his other comments that he's somewhat clueless.....

[Chicagotarsier]

I am going out on a limb here.....

With my diet clean I cannot HELP but for it to be high protein. Eggs, Chicken Breast, Pork, Beef.....

It is when you start throwing in the pizza, burritos, french fries, hamburgers, fast food in general you see the protein go down and the carbs and fats go WAY up. I have not hit my carbs or fat on my 40 protien 30-30 fat carb macro once in a month..not once. I did not eat out once..not once. Over the month before I did not hit my protein 15 days...I ate out 15 days.... Pretty much sums it up.

[MuscleInk]

I am going out on a limb here..... With my diet clean I cannot HELP but for it to be high protein. Eggs, Chicken Breast, Pork, Beef..... It is when you start throwing in the pizza, burritos, french fries, hamburgers, fast food in general you see the protein go down and the carbs and fats go WAY up. I have not hit my carbs or fat on my 40 protien 30-30 fat carb macro once in a month..not once. I did not eat out once..not once. Over the month before I did not hit my protein 15 days...I ate out 15 days.... Pretty much sums it up.

Where are the sweet potatoes? Fresh veggies? Low GI fruit? Ezekiel bread? A lot of healthy choices you have missed.

[XxAndreaxX]

did someone really just say high protein meals aren't needed to maintain muscle gains? What would you suggest McDonalds? Thats high calorie

depends on your metabolism. If your metabolism is like mine, ectomorph for example, you can eat mcdonalds without problems, it does the trick. If not, I don't really know, maybe you should stay on a cutting diet.