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Thread: "vets" have no experience with anavar v Tbol?

  1. #1
    Quester's Avatar
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    "vets" have no experience with anavar v Tbol?

    NPP + Test C (at TRT dose) and Anavar or Tbol, nobody has any knowledge about this?

  2. #2
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    Well considering the amount of compounds of each class and the number of combinations, and proportion of dosages (low test high NPP et.c.), the possible combinations become a large number... I am sure lots of people have done this cycle but less remember everything about it.

    I can tell you about anavar though, it is not for building muscle. I had some, labmax tested it for presence, labmax tested it for purity (labmax has a purity test for anavar and winstrol too I think), shit was legit powder, though no strength gains, just a little added vascularity and hardness, would probably have been more pronounced if I had lower bodyfat then.

    Have read countless times that Tbol is not for building muscle either.

    Sorry for not being a vet but answering lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Quester View Post
    NPP + Test C (at TRT dose) and Anavar or Tbol, nobody has any knowledge about this?
    I'm guessing your goal is NOT to put on much weight with this cycle , maybe a re-comp? low dose test, with NPP and either var or tbol is a very low aromatizing cycle , so your wanting to recomp or stay lean with low water retention (not ideal for growth).

    If staying or getting leaner on this cycle is your goal then VAR has a bit more effects in regards to lipolysis.. if liver enzymes are an issue with you when you run orals, then VAR is by far the best choice . VAR is more likely to work its effects via the androgen receptor , whereas Tbol is likely to work its effects apart from the androgen receptor .

    being your running test and nandrolone , which both work its effects by binding to the androgen receptor, throwing a class 2 steroid like T-bol that works outside the AR may be a good idea. will balance things out a bit

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    I much prefer var over tbol. Tbol gives me stomach issues which can inflict on results and to be honest tbol wasn't that effective anyway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    I'm guessing your goal is NOT to put on much weight with this cycle , maybe a re-comp? low dose test, with NPP and either var or tbol is a very low aromatizing cycle , so your wanting to recomp or stay lean with low water retention (not ideal for growth).

    If staying or getting leaner on this cycle is your goal then VAR has a bit more effects in regards to lipolysis.. if liver enzymes are an issue with you when you run orals, then VAR is by far the best choice . VARis more likely to work its effects via the androgen receptor , whereas Tbol is likely to work its effects apart from the androgen receptor .

    being your running test and nandrolone , which both work its effects by binding to the androgen receptor, throwing a class 2 steroid like T-bol that works outside the AR may be a good idea. will balance things out a bit
    How so?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    How so?
    VAR is a class 1 steroid , class 1 steroids mainly work by binding to the androgen receptor.. Tbol (like d-bol but without estrogen) is a class 2 steroid which has activity independent of androgen receptor binding/activation, class 2 steroid activity has been monitored in neuron's, microsomes, mitochondria. basically a class 2 builds muscle by things like nutrient partitioning , protein synthesis , nitrogen retention, etc.. things that act on the cells but don't directly act on the androgen receptor itself .

    fyi though, some steroids do both, and are both class 1 and class 2 like Tren for example. thats why Tren stacked with Deca is a potent combination , class 1 and 2 mechanisms of actions take place , the Tren binding very strongly to the AR whereas the Deca will work apart from the androgen receptor and build muscle by those other factors I stated.

    just something to keep in mind when designing your stacks
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  7. #7
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    Gearhead,
    That's one of the most insightful answers to a question on here. The depth of knowledge you possess is a greatly needed addition to our community.
    Thank You!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quester View Post
    Gearhead,
    That's one of the most insightful answers to a question on here. The depth of knowledge you possess is a greatly needed addition to our community.
    Thank You!
    This guy is indeed appreciated. I don't think I have seen a newcomer so knowledgable before.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    VAR is a class 1 steroid , class 1 steroids mainly work by binding to the androgen receptor.. Tbol (like d-bol but without estrogen) is a class 2 steroid which has activity independent of androgen receptor binding/activation, class 2 steroid activity has been monitored in neuron's, microsomes, mitochondria. basically a class 2 builds muscle by things like nutrient partitioning , protein synthesis , nitrogen retention, etc.. things that act on the cells but don't directly act on the androgen receptor itself .

    fyi though, some steroids do both, and are both class 1 and class 2 like Tren for example. thats why Tren stacked with Deca is a potent combination , class 1 and 2 mechanisms of actions take place , the Tren binding very strongly to the AR whereas the Deca will work apart from the androgen receptor and build muscle by those other factors I stated.

    just something to keep in mind when designing your stacks
    Ok, you got my nerdout receptors on hyperactive.

    Where exactly does the class II compounds bind in the cell. Obviously it’s probably not A second messenger type system since it has no cyclic AMP bindings, I’m assuming. Is it binding to ribosomal units/subunits causing post translational changes?
    Last edited by MuscleScience; 11-18-2017 at 07:51 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    Ok, you got my nerdout receptors on hyperactive.

    Where exactly does the class II compounds bind in the cell. Obviously it’s probably not A second messenger type system since it has no cyclic AMP bindings, I’m assuming. Is it binding to ribosomal units/subunits causing post translational changes?
    well unfortunately I'm not that big of a nerd. bio chemistry at the cellular level is way beyond me (though is very interesting and wish I had more time to research) , I cannot hang with bodybuilding coaches like Broderick Chavez (evil genius) that have degrees in biology and understand things on a biological macro scale (like fitness nutrition drug use etc.) and also on a micro scale (like how the cells themselves are functioning and being acted upon)..

    I don't know how the cells themselves are acted upon . I only have a surface knowledge of the pharmacokentics of various AAS and how they are supposed to function and work in the body ... how they specifically act on cells and communicate and act on DNA is way beyond my ability (but fascinating non the less).

    what do you think ? when a drug is able to illicit anabolic properties outside the androgen receptor what do you think is going on ?

    obviously IGF, HGH, and insulin are very anabolic in the right setting , but also have no AR binding affinity . insulin for example works on the cell as a type of 'gate keeper/key" , it uses potassium and 'unlocks' the cell and allows the uptake of glucose, water, aminos etc.. this is a very anabolic thing. but this is also why we can take HGH and Slin year round and not de-sensitze or increase Mysotatin up-regulation , whereas if you take a gram of test then after 8-10 weeks you begin to de-sensitize to it and Myostatin begins to increase . this is a de-sesnstiation to the AR itself ( so using compounds that work apart from the Androgen receptor help with overall muscle growth in the long term , this is just practical knowledge on my part , no bio chemistry or cellular biology knowledge here, just my opinions and thoughts)

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    well unfortunately I'm not that big of a nerd. bio chemistry at the cellular level is way beyond me (though is very interesting and wish I had more time to research) , I cannot hang with bodybuilding coaches like Broderick Chavez (evil genius) that have degrees in biology and understand things on a biological macro scale (like fitness nutrition drug use etc.) and also on a micro scale (like how the cells themselves are functioning and being acted upon)..

    I don't know how the cells themselves are acted upon . I only have a surface knowledge of the pharmacokentics of various AAS and how they are supposed to function and work in the body ... how they specifically act on cells and communicate and act on DNA is way beyond my ability (but fascinating non the less).

    what do you think ? when a drug is able to illicit anabolic properties outside the androgen receptor what do you think is going on ?

    obviously IGF, HGH, and insulin are very anabolic in the right setting , but also have no AR binding affinity . insulin for example works on the cell as a type of 'gate keeper/key" , it uses potassium and 'unlocks' the cell and allows the uptake of glucose, water, aminos etc.. this is a very anabolic thing. but this is also why we can take HGH and Slin year round and not de-sensitze or increase Mysotatin up-regulation , whereas if you take a gram of test then after 8-10 weeks you begin to de-sensitize to it and Myostatin begins to increase . this is a de-sesnstiation to the AR itself ( so using compounds that work apart from the Androgen receptor help with overall muscle growth in the long term , this is just practical knowledge on my part , no bio chemistry or cellular biology knowledge here, just my opinions and thoughts)
    Thanks for taking the time to write all that stuff up!

    I’ll have to look it up, hoping you knew to save me some time.

    I had never heard of different classification in AAS compounds. I’m interested to say the least. Maybe Bizzaro knows?
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    well unfortunately I'm not that big of a nerd.

    Let me introduce you to MuscleScience.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelkel View Post
    Let me introduce you to MuscleScience.....
    Just for that , you’re getting a lengthy, boring write up.
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    Would the, somewhat simplified, conclusion then be that T-Bol is better when cutting than Var?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tarmyg View Post
    Would the, somewhat simplified, conclusion then be that T-Bol is better when cutting than Var?
    the goal of running either of these compounds while on a cut is to help maintain muscle mass and prevent catabolism while on a hypo-caloric diet. both compounds will accomplish this equally Imo .
    however VAR is going to stimulate the CNS to a slightly greater degree as well as exhibit 'some' effects directly on lipolysis and fatty acid oxidation, because of those two things VAR is going to be slightly better then Tbol if lowering BF% is a primary goal
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    I'm hoping to take advantage of the SHBG suppression and enhanced recovery these substances provide. From what you have said, TBol would provide the greatest benefit via the synergism effect.

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    it's hard to get real, legit, correctly dosed tbol and var...

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quester View Post
    I'm hoping to take advantage of the SHBG suppression and enhanced recovery these substances provide. From what you have said, TBol would provide the greatest benefit via the synergism effect.
    yeah T-bol has a strong affinity to bind to SHBG , this is going to free up more testosterone and make things 'work better'. Your also going to get zero androgenic or estrogenic sides or effects from T-bol, its purely anabolic .
    Which is great when your trying to keep things super clean.

    This is personally how and when I use T-bol.
    IF I'm on a fairly heavy blast, especially a bulk, then I do not bother using it at all (I have things in there that are heavily converting to estrogen, or DHT, or very strong androgens, for a reason ... Tbol will really add nothing with all this going on).

    IF I'm cruising or doing a low dose 'clean' cycle (not a bulk) then I'll use 50mg a day to help better make use of the low TRT dose of test I'm taking, plus provide me with the anabolic effects and the steady tissue building it provides.
    This is a nice break from a heavy 'dirty' cycle (and if you've been on 3 grams of Tren , Ment, Dbol , NPP etc.. you know that its a bit stressful on the body, and doing 'clean' cycles a few times a year is a nice break).

    Some guys will get strength and athletic performance gains from T-bol as well , my wife does when she's on it, and guys will dose it an hour pre-workout , I however don't notice much in those regards . but then again I'm the type of guy to Pin 50mg of Tren suspension and drop 30mg of Dbol pre-workout (and no way can T-bol compare)
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    Quote Originally Posted by kronik420 View Post
    it's hard to get real, legit, correctly dosed tbol and var...
    Just go for SIS labs or Pharmacom and you get the code to check on their site... All my codes for Tbol and Test E has checked out no issue. PM for soruce as I do not know If I can post here !
    Last edited by Jangles1; 11-20-2017 at 12:46 PM.

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