Partial Paraplegic, Staying out of the Wheelchair.. Advice Appreciated!

[gunsonwheels00]

Good evening everyone.. I am going to post some of my objectives/goals, and perhaps some of you could offer some knowledge & advice to help me out getting where I would like to be.. please & thank you!

My PRIMARY GOAL is to gain a lot more strength, and a little more mass, in my legs, so that it is easier for me to stand up and walk. Why is this so difficult for me?
First off, I have a stupid high metabolism that wants to eat everything, including my hard earned gains, so dampening my body's tendency to break down muscle is must. (Suggestions for maintaining lean muscle mass?)
Secondly, my knees are wrecked (along with most other major joints) and it doesn't take much for them to get pissed off and start crying for a break. (Suggestions for help with joint recovery & Support?)

& Third, most significantly, is my spinal cord injury, which greatly reduces my ability to successfully command my legs to lift (hip flexors), curl (hamstrings), or expand (hip abductor), as well as spasticity in my calves and weakness in my ability to lift my foot up (anterior tibial). All leg muscles are weakened but these are the ones most affected by paralysis. Fortunately through therapy, I have recovered ability to use them for a very limited amount of repetitions, very slowly increasing. SO...

THE THEORY IS, and found to be true, that if I increase the efficiency & strength of my muscles controlled by these weakened nerve signals, I can complete the action with more ease, and thus able to do it for more repetitions. In short, I have limited signal strength, but if I make my muscles significantly stronger, I don't require as much signal to do things.

So the third & final question is: whats a good combo to (1)prevent breakdown of lean muscle mass, (2)support busted joints, & (3)get a LOT stronger while staying lean?

Other notes: the injury also weakened my abdominal muscles, which are no doubt important as is the rest of my body, but I am focused on the legs. I want to stay on my feet!!
I am not looking to get big, but at 6'2, I would like to go from 175 to at least 185, maybe 190. I'm thinking that aligning with my natural lean body type will be easiest for my weakened lower body & blown out joints to support.
If anyone has any particular activities/workouts/theraputic ideas that they believe could help out, I would greatly appreciate any input in that field as well.

Thank you in advance!!

Mike (gunsonwheels00)

[Windex]

Sorry to hear about your injuries. Maximum respect to you not taking the easy way out and trying to overcome your body. couple of questions to get the ball rolling:

- Have you tried any physio or rehabilitation programs and any success ?

- Any medication currently taking ?

- Any supplements ? Glucosamine, etc ?

- Two drugs that come to mind that might be of service would be Nandrolone (joints/ligaments) and HGH


This has been my own personal experience from my injury (My L1-L4 is completely screwed and have a stenosis from a car accident). As of the last 6 months, I am currently doing physio 5 times per week. I don't do any big lifts anymore (bench, squats, deadlift). I also take 2250mg of Glucosamine Sulfate per day (Costco is the cheapest). And I have recently started on hGH @ 1mg (3IU) per day. I've seen a major improvement compared to my post accident state (car accident was August 2016). I've been able to go down from 150-180mg of Codeine to 60-90mg per day.

The part I can help the most is your diet - if you post it I will help you improve upon it.

Best of luck on the recovery. Hopefully one of the Vets can add some input as well.

[Wyatt 88]

The glucosamine you take from Costco is it in a liquid form in a white bottle with a red label?

[Mr.BB]

Good evening everyone.. I am going to post some of my objectives/goals, and perhaps some of you could offer some knowledge & advice to help me out getting where I would like to be.. please & thank you!

My PRIMARY GOAL is to gain a lot more strength, and a little more mass, in my legs, so that it is easier for me to stand up and walk. Why is this so difficult for me?
First off, I have a stupid high metabolism that wants to eat everything, including my hard earned gains, so dampening my body's tendency to break down muscle is must. (Suggestions for maintaining lean muscle mass?)
Secondly, my knees are wrecked (along with most other major joints) and it doesn't take much for them to get pissed off and start crying for a break. (Suggestions for help with joint recovery & Support?)

& Third, most significantly, is my spinal cord injury, which greatly reduces my ability to successfully command my legs to lift (hip flexors), curl (hamstrings), or expand (hip abductor), as well as spasticity in my calves and weakness in my ability to lift my foot up (anterior tibial). All leg muscles are weakened but these are the ones most affected by paralysis. Fortunately through therapy, I have recovered ability to use them for a very limited amount of repetitions, very slowly increasing. SO...

THE THEORY IS, and found to be true, that if I increase the efficiency & strength of my muscles controlled by these weakened nerve signals, I can complete the action with more ease, and thus able to do it for more repetitions. In short, I have limited signal strength, but if I make my muscles significantly stronger, I don't require as much signal to do things.

So the third & final question is: whats a good combo to (1)prevent breakdown of lean muscle mass, (2)support busted joints, & (3)get a LOT stronger while staying lean?

Other notes: the injury also weakened my abdominal muscles, which are no doubt important as is the rest of my body, but I am focused on the legs. I want to stay on my feet!!
I am not looking to get big, but at 6'2, I would like to go from 175 to at least 185, maybe 190. I'm thinking that aligning with my natural lean body type will be easiest for my weakened lower body & blown out joints to support.
If anyone has any particular activities/workouts/theraputic ideas that they believe could help out, I would greatly appreciate any input in that field as well.

Thank you in advance!!

Mike (gunsonwheels00)

Hi Mike!

The first advice would be to take some bloodwork to check your hormones. Traumatic events often takes a hit on your HPTA, which is your "sex hormones control system", and many times after trauma natural testosterone comes low. If it is low you can think about TRT, which can on its own help a lot when there is a testosterone deficit.
If your testosterone isnt low you really need to think about the steroids thing, because taking steroids will completely halt the HPTA, and there is no guarantees to come back at same levels. As many here know steroids are many times a lifetime decision. If you do decide on doing steroids and PCT, the best for recovery of you natural testosterone after cycle, is to just do testosterone only.

[gunsonwheels00]

Thank you for taking the time to reply, & I apologize for the late response, I just got home from a long trip out of state, my wife’s father was in a bad accident & we flew to go support him & the family.. He’s stable now & should make a good recovery.

Back to my recovery, let me answer your questions, & please feel free to skim through, I tend to be lengthy so as to not leave out any possibly useful information:

- Have you tried any physio or rehabilitation programs and any success ?
I was in the Marine Corps at the time of my injury, & was sent to San Antonio with access to the Center for the Intrepid, a world renowned rehabilitation facility, where I used as many of their resources as possible, went through multiple programs, and attended therapy multiple hours daily.
I was predicted to never leave the wheelchair, & I amazed everyone by proving them wrong, eventually getting to where I could “walk” nearly a mile (or staggering like a zombie from the Walking Dead more like), or walk with decent form for much shorter distances, mainly by compensating with other muscles.
The doctors there were open to trying all sorts of unorthodox methods, like I said I was prescribed anabolics (I remember now, it was oxandrolone, not sure the dosage).
They even prescribed me Marinol (THC oral prescription) to try & get me to gain weight.
They did a lot of electrostimulation therapy, even getting me a Bioness, an electrostimulation device that coordinates stimulation to affected muscles with the motion of the leg, to try and force my weak left leg to walk normally.. Pretty Damn Cool.. but it’s new technology and only kinda sorta worked the way it should.
After my discharge from the military, it was up to me to go to the gym & continue my therapy, which is where the struggle really began.. I didn’t have the discipline of the military to push me anymore, it was just me, myself, & I.

Current Medication?
I hate taking meds. I hate it. Before I was even discharged from the hospital (I was inpatient for 90 days almost exactly, & should have been inpatient for longer but they pushed me out for insurance reasons) I was refusing the hardcore pain meds, saying I didn’t need them. I almost screwed myself over on my benefits by saying I wasn’t hurt the way I was & was ready to get back to serving as a Marine. That’s all I wanted.
I’ve taken myself off meds more times than I can remember, & fought them as long as I can, but I always break down eventually, not because of the pain, but because of how the pain affects me, I’m pissy, I snap at people, I can’t get nearly as much done in a day, I don’t even want to get out of bed some mornings.
As it is, I take two 50mg of Tramadol daily, once in the morning, once mid day, for all the musculoskeletal pain. It’s effective & fast acting, helps me get going in the morning quick, but can also make me drowsy, and contributes to my chronic constipation.
I take 300mg of Lyrica/Pregabalin in the morning, 225mg mid day, & 150mg early evening, for the nerve pain, I crushed my rib cage & all the nerves inbetween the ribs got eternally pissed off & let me know in a screaming burning fuss. Lyrica is a very odd drug, it has a massive list of side effects & it seems to effect everyone differently. For me, it takes the burning pain away, I’m productive on it, I eat better on it, but it also takes away intensity of all feelings/emotions, & what I really don’t like about it is it lessens my sex drive & heavily reduces sensation during sex.. I very rarely finish, so that’s frustrating lol.
Recently I got prescribed Adderall 10mg extended release, once a day in the mornings, to focus up my scrambled head & try & pass a challenging Computer Science degree I was clawing my way through.. It’s very effective & I love how fkn productive I am on it, makes me feel like I’m worth something when I’m getting stuff done.. Downside is it suppresses my appetite, so I just really have to work to get my high caloric needs.
Besides that, I also have Xanex, which I never take, but I dealt with some panic attacks early in my recovery & still deal with lingering anxiety, but I would rather suppress that with working out & productivity.
Then, least but not last, good ole Viagra. Probably one of the reasons I had panic attacks early in my recovery was because my pecker wasn’t operating anymore, along with everything else below my nipple line. Eventually it came back online, but it wasn’t like it was before. Fastforward to current day, still not like it was before, but if I’m not taking meds, it runs like a champ. If I’m taking meds & using gear, it runs like a champ. If I’m taking meds & on a downcycle.. Gotta bust out the Viagra. So that’s the story with my meds.

Supplements?
I don’t take pre-workout regularly, but when I do, I use Jym.. I’ve used C4(garbage in my opinion), & N.O. Xplode, but Jym feels best to me.. & I take Optimen daily. I also take Flex by Animal, has all the good joint stuff in it.
I’ve been taking Glucosamine & Chondroitin since 2012, I’ve always had crap joints, then I ripped the knees up real bad once I joined the Corps, I tore something bad in my right knee a week before the Crucible in bootcamp, but chose to hide it rather than get pulled out of my platoon & spend another 3 months in medical before I could try to finish & graduate, so I scrounged up a bunch of pain meds from the kids that had their wisdom teeth pulled during bootcamp, & dragged myself through the 52 miles of obstacles for 48 hours straight, & stood tall with the rest of my platoon at graduation.. With a knee swollen 3 times its regular size. Needless to say that knee has never been the same.

After my injury, the rest of my joints followed suit. The joint supps help I think, but deca significantly reduces joint pain on cycle. I was recommended hGh by one of the guys back at the CFI (Center For the Intrepid), he thought it would help me rebuild my joints, & it’s a popular but unconfirmed theory (unconfirmed by myself anyway) that hGh could help stimulate nerve recovery in injuries such as my own. I am reluctant to try it out though, as it seems to have A LOT of side effects.. But maybe you can offer some education from your personal experience with it.

And Lastly my Diet:
So I suck at keeping up with a diet. I have to eat A LOT to keep my weight on, & it can be challenging to do that & keep it clean. The best I did at it was when I was in 29 Palms for a year & did nothing but work out & eat, I kept away from sugars & saturated fats, ate a lot of peanut butter, oatmeal, protein shakes, peanuts, stuff like that.. It worked great, I felt, performed, & looked like a champ.

Current day, I make a lot of smoothies (peanut butter, berries, mass gainer mix by Optimum Nutrition, milk, bananas, chia seeds), peanut butter sandwiches, hamburgers (I get the leaner ones from Sam’s Club), & my wife makes a lot of Italian food, lots of pasta, hamburger, & sausage mainly. I also drink at least 2 or 3 Monster Energy drinks a day, the Zero sugar ones.. A habit I am trying to kick. The best thing I can say about my diet is that I don’t eat sugary stuff, and I don’t eat out and don’t eat fast food.

Speaking of bad habits, I also vape a lot, the lowest nicotine level (3mg), but it’s more or less constantly. I feel like it helps keep me alert and off sets the sleepy effects of the pain meds. I try & quit from time to time but after a few weeks I end up back at it.
I estimate that I on average eat 2500 to 3000 calories a day. I know I need to get organized with it and also eat more like 3000 to 3500 calories a day considering how fast I burn them up.

I have to cut this off here.. I hope this answers all of your questions, & really look forward to hearing the response.. Maybe someone can help me get some direction and traction going here to keep pushing forward. Thank you again!

Sincerely,

Mike (gunsonwheels00)

[gunsonwheels00]

In Response To Mr. BB,

Thank you for making these points, I think you might be on to something.. I will look into getting some bloodwork done. I do have a couple questions on that though. First off, how long should I wait after I finish a cycle to get an accurate blood work result that isn't altered by the effects of the anabolics? Secondly, is there some way to test this "HPTA"? I have not heard of it before, & I will do some reading on my own, but I am just curious if you know. I have been on & off cycles for 4 years now, so it's probably jacked up by now. The only hope I can think of is that I have always been around the lowest recommended doses, often slightly below, I have never used them heavily. Lastly, I will google this and try and find out, but just off the top of your head, what is the best way to get blood work done without having it go on your medical record? The VA is always up in my business & I don't want any red flags showing up in the system.
Thank you again!

Mike (gunsonwheels00)

[gunsonwheels00]

The glucosamine you take from Costco is it in a liquid form in a white bottle with a red label?

I'm curious why you ask?

[Windex]

- You could try caffeine pills or expresso as an alternative to Monster if you need the energy

- I don't understand the science behind Sulfate vs Chondrointin vs MSM, but from my own personal experience I never got anything out of Glucosamine until I switched to Glucosamine Sulfate. I use 750mg 3x per day.

- Mass gainer powders have a lot of junk in them and it sounds like you already have tons of calories between the peanut butter and fruit and milk in the shake. Whole milk (homogenized) could also be an option if you aren't using it currently

- Easiest way to tackle nutrition is log everything. Makes it easy to track, adds accountability, and allows for easy adjustments. Upfront time investment is big but pays for itself in the long run. I'm old fashioned so I use pen and paper, but a lot of people will use Microsoft Excel or a cellphone app. It's not uncommon for people to eat 500-1000 calories less than what they think they are eating before tracking it.

- Sounds like your diet has moderate/high fat and moderate/high carbs and lower protein. I would add protein calories. Saturated fats (from Animals) are not the enemy, no need to stay away from them, just keep in moderation.

- There are multiple stickies in the diet and nutrition section of the forum. Give them a read. The most important of which is the TDEE thread.

- If you have the opportunity to get a prescription for HGH it's something to consider - tons of benefits.

[gunsonwheels00]

Sorry to hear about your injuries. Maximum respect to you not taking the easy way out and trying to overcome your body. couple of questions to get the ball rolling:

- Have you tried any physio or rehabilitation programs and any success ?

- Any medication currently taking ?

- Any supplements ? Glucosamine, etc ?

- Two meds that come to mind that might be of service would be Nandrolone (joints/ligaments) and HGH


This has been my own personal experience from my injury (My L1-L4 is completely screwed and have a stenosis from a car accident). As of the last 6 months, I am currently doing physio 5 times per week. I don't do any big lifts anymore (bench, squats, deadlift). I also take 2250mg of Glucosamine Sulfate per day (Costco is the cheapest). And I have recently started on hGH 1mg (3IU) per day. I've seen a major improvement compared to my post accident state (car accident was August 2016). I've been able to go down from 150-180mg of Codeine to 60-90mg per day.

The part I can help the most is your diet - if you post it I will help you improve upon it.

Best of luck on the recovery. Hopefully one of the Vets can add some input as well.

I'm not sure how this site works, if you have to be tagged to be notified of my response (see in thread above). I just realized I simply "responded" & did not "respond with quote".. This response is only to be sure you are tagged & notified

[gunsonwheels00]

Sorry to hear about your injuries. Maximum respect to you not taking the easy way out and trying to overcome your body. couple of questions to get the ball rolling:

- Have you tried any physio or rehabilitation programs and any success ?

- Any medication currently taking ?

- Any supplements ? Glucosamine, etc ?

- Two meds that come to mind that might be of service would be Nandrolone (joints/ligaments) and HGH


This has been my own personal experience from my injury (My L1-L4 is completely screwed and have a stenosis from a car accident). As of the last 6 months, I am currently doing physio 5 times per week. I don't do any big lifts anymore (bench, squats, deadlift). I also take 2250mg of Glucosamine Sulfate per day (Costco is the cheapest). And I have recently started on hGH 1mg (3IU) per day. I've seen a major improvement compared to my post accident state (car accident was August 2016). I've been able to go down from 150-180mg of Codeine to 60-90mg per day.

The part I can help the most is your diet - if you post it I will help you improve upon it.

Best of luck on the recovery. Hopefully one of the Vets can add some input as well.

I'm not sure how this site works, if you have to be tagged to be notified of my response (see in thread above). I just realized I simply "responded" & did not "respond with quote".. This response is only to be sure you are tagged & notified

Edit: I am having issues posting, being flagged for spam, "new users cannot post URLS or certains words like "porn, sex, ect.." ", and I don't see any URLs, or words that would be objected to.. so I'm a little confused. ?????

[gunsonwheels00]

- You could try caffeine pills or expresso as an alternative to Monster if you need the energy

- I don't understand the science behind Sulfate vs Chondrointin vs MSM, but from my own personal experience I never got anything out of Glucosamine until I switched to Glucosamine Sulfate. I use 750mg 3x per day.

- Mass gainer powders have a lot of junk in them and it sounds like you already have tons of calories between the peanut butter and fruit and milk in the shake. Whole milk (homogenized) could also be an option if you aren't using it currently

- Easiest way to tackle nutrition is log everything. Makes it easy to track, adds accountability, and allows for easy adjustments. Upfront time investment is big but pays for itself in the long run. I'm old fashioned so I use pen and paper, but a lot of people will use Microsoft Excel or a cellphone app. It's not uncommon for people to eat 500-1000 calories less than what they think they are eating before tracking it.

- Sounds like your diet has moderate/high fat and moderate/high carbs and lower protein. I would add protein calories. Saturated fats (from Animals) are not the enemy, no need to stay away from them, just keep in moderation.

- There are multiple stickies in the diet and nutrition section of the forum. Give them a read. The most important of which is the TDEE thread.

- If you have the opportunity to get a prescription for HGH it's something to consider - tons of benefits.

Thank you for the quick response!!

I will take your advice & work on switching over to caffeine pills & coffee as an alternative to the Monster habit.. I used caffeine pills in the past, when I was in 29 Palms & on top of my diet, it's a different type of "buzz" but they do work!

As far as the Mass Gainers go, is the "Optimum Nutrition Serious Mass" part of the junk Mass gainer you speak of? I actually had to quit using it this past month because my Urology doc was worrying about the high creatine levels in my urine (not the first time this has happened), and wanted me to quit intaking creatine so that she could get an accurate reading and be sure my filters weren't going out on me. I switched out the Mass Gainer for Optimum Nutrition 100% Whey.

I used to use the Fitbit app to log everything I ate, I liked how you could look things up and it would already have all the nutrition facts and add them up for you.. it was tedious and I quit doing it, but I will start doing that again. I agree, it was surprising how fast things add up (not a bad thing for my situation lol)

I'll crank up on protein calories and start buying more chicken or something.

I will also head over to the diet & nutrition section & see if I can glean some knowledge there, thank you for the pointer!

As far as the HGH, how would I even approach getting a prescription? Also, I know you mentioned you saw a lot of improvement in multiple areas from taking it.. did you notice any negative side effects?

Thank you again!

[Mr.BB]

In Response To Mr. BB,

Thank you for making these points, I think you might be on to something.. I will look into getting some bloodwork done. I do have a couple questions on that though. First off, how long should I wait after I finish a cycle to get an accurate blood work result that isn't altered by the effects of the anabolics? Secondly, is there some way to test this "HPTA"? I have not heard of it before, & I will do some reading on my own, but I am just curious if you know. I have been on & off cycles for 4 years now, so it's probably jacked up by now. The only hope I can think of is that I have always been around the lowest recommended doses, often slightly below, I have never used them heavily. Lastly, I will google this and try and find out, but just off the top of your head, what is the best way to get blood work done without having it go on your medical record? The VA is always up in my business & I don't want any red flags showing up in the system.
Thank you again!

Mike (gunsonwheels00)

Read this: Explanation of HPTA / Endocrine System & How Steroids Affect You

Time after using anabolics depends which anabolics you used and how fast your body recovers, everyone is different, but if you have been using without recovering with a PCT you may not have recovered since the 1st cycle. You need to explain exactly what have you been doing.

Your sex hormonal system, HPT axis is tested by doing bloodwork with the following tests: LH, FSH, total testosterone , free testosterone, sensitive estradiol, SHBG and DHT(optional). If you have been doing steroids like deca you should add prolactin test.

Im not from the US so can't really help with the best lab where to do the private bloodwork, but i'm sure other guys will chime in with the best advice. It should be very easy unless you live a state which requires doctor prescription.