where is the mass gains?

**shim jahng** · 01-18-2004, 10:29 PM

Hey all

I havent posted in a while, wife an i have a new baby so i have been a little busy, but i started my 7th week of test Enan (500mg a week) cycle today, and i am honestly a little disapointed. I have seen some great strength gains, and i would say i may have gained 5 pounds or so, but where is the big mass gains? im confident in my training, and im sure my diet is pretty good, i spent a great while mentally and physicaly preparing for this. I am getting great pumps during my workouts, but im just not gaining like i thought i would. im taking a maitnence of 20mg liquid nolva a day, and .5 ml letrozole every other day. no signs of acne at this point, and i dont feel that i am retaining any water. I have had lots of people tell me im looking bigger, but the scale is just not supporting those comments. I started a new training program with a couple of guys that are gonna do a show in october, so imthinking my strength gains may have even come from the routine change. Im not doing the show, but i am training like it. If its wasnt for the increased strength and killer pumps i would seriuosly be questioning the legitness of my gear. thats the other things that doesnt make sense, im taking Research Tech test, i thought it was supposed to be the sh*t. anyone have any thoughts on this? is it possible that my mass gains could still come?

**956Vette** · 01-18-2004, 10:33 PM

How many calories are you getting roughly?

**peaker** · 01-18-2004, 10:54 PM

could be losing some bf if your calorie intake is not very high. do you look/feel leaner. if think if people are saying you look bigger and you have gained 5lbs, could be cause your dropping body fat at the same time.

**shim jahng** · 01-18-2004, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by 956Vette

How many calories are you getting roughly?

im not really counting calories, but this would be a typical day of eating for me.

right out of bed 6:00 AM protien drink, and vitamines

8:00 breakfast: two sausage and egg and cheese breakfast sandwiches (not mcdonalds the place i work has a cafateria.

10:00 4-6 hard boiled eggs (just the whites no yolks)

11:30 another protien drink (complex protien)

12:30 a turkey and cheese sandwhich+ vitamines (good amount of turkey)

2:00 another turkey sandwhich

3:00 cup+ of cottage cheese and pinapple.

4:30 protien drink (complex protien)

5:15 work out time

6:45 after work out protien drink. (whey isolate)

8:00 dinner chicken, turkey burger, or steak of some sort.

9:30 protien drink, vitamines, and off to bed.

I eat alot of the same things, cause i know those things are higher in protien and good for training. my diet is pretty consistant every day, then i just what ever i want on weekends.

**swoleup** · 01-18-2004, 10:58 PM

Originally Posted by peaker

could be losing some bf if your calorie intake is not very high. do you look/feel leaner. if think if people are saying you look bigger and you have gained 5lbs, could be cause your dropping body fat at the same time.

U could just be losing body fat. Is ur body comp changing any?

**J*U*icEd** · 01-18-2004, 11:12 PM

hah....thats funny....same thing happend to me....i was on an EQ and sust cycle and i was down 10 pounds after the 4th week was up....in the end i ended up 8 pounds over what i originally started at but i was way leaner....ur definatly leaning out

**shim jahng** · 01-18-2004, 11:32 PM

Originally Posted by J*U*icEd

hah....thats funny....same thing happend to me....i was on an EQ and sust cycle and i was down 10 pounds after the 4th week was up....in the end i ended up 8 pounds over what i originally started at but i was way leaner....ur definatly leaning out

the thought that i am getting leaner has crossed my mind, i feel that i am and my workout partners say i am to. i am going up and down from 188 to 193, i am hoping to make a solid 200 out of this cycle. im doing a 13 weeker, as well i probably should have metioned that before. so im just about half way through. i would like to start seeing a good couple of pounds increase a week from here on out nothing to drastic, i dont want to draw alot of attention. im considering getting some N large just to make sure im getting plenty of calories. i feel that my diet is good as of now though.

**GETTING HUGE** · 01-19-2004, 04:36 PM

I think you need to take in alot more calories. I would start counting them. I'm taking in 800 & 900 calories each meal, 6 times a day.

**Ntpadude** · 01-19-2004, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by shim jahng

the thought that i am getting leaner has crossed my mind, i feel that i am and my workout partners say i am to. i am going up and down from 188 to 193, i am hoping to make a solid 200 out of this cycle. im doing a 13 weeker, as well i probably should have metioned that before. so im just about half way through. i would like to start seeing a good couple of pounds increase a week from here on out nothing to drastic, i dont want to draw alot of attention. im considering getting some N large just to make sure im getting plenty of calories. i feel that my diet is good as of now though.

I gained most in the first 5 weeks, after that testosterone started burning the fat off so bad I was loosing weight on the scale while still gaining muscle. Testosterone can burn bunches of fat if your calaries are not all that high. I ate mostly between 3500 calaries and 4000 calaries a day which if NOT on steroids would have put lots of fat on me, well on testosterone it was not enough and I still burned fat like crazy. Towards the end of your cycle, you might end up with nice abs like I did!

**motoxxxguy** · 01-19-2004, 08:01 PM

The scale is not always the best way to rate your progress. The mirror works much better in almost every case.

-moto

**sigrabbit** · 01-19-2004, 08:20 PM

Where are your simple carbs post workout???? That is the best time to get some carb in. Maybe I misread your post, but you would definitely benefit from eatting most of your carbs PWO.

**Jackman** · 01-19-2004, 08:29 PM

Yea you need to know eat 2 times withing 2 hours of your workout! 1 being a protien shake for quik delivery right after! and 1 an hour later with carbs!

**LebaneseMuscle** · 01-19-2004, 08:48 PM

ohhhh yeaa that one hit the spot today. Jackman's right, hit the shake for the protein then something else with tha carbs and protein. today i had my methoxy-pro right after the workout, then a massive and tasty footlong tuna sub an hour after my workout.

**TheSevnthWarrior** · 01-19-2004, 09:17 PM

I just went through the same thing roughly.
It's food.
I mean you're gear COULD be fake, I don't know, but though you're eating al lot of times, it's not enough Protein/Calories wise. For instance, those egg whites?...Most whites alone, even large, don't have as much as most people think, only about 3-4 each (whites only)
At first I couldn't really eat much more, so I started with more shakes, and more bars, until I developed a better appetite.
It's so dang simple you'll Sware that can't be it, but I'm telling you, I added 75-100 more grams of Protein, took in more recovery carbs after ANY exertion, and overall added about 800-1000 more calories, and I sware it was like switching gears. As long as I've been doin' this, I wouldn't of thought that I was making such a rookie move as not taking in enough Grams/Carbs/Calories...But after about 3 different Mods all had the same answer, I gave it a shot - And hey! What do ya know, I was wrong...that's never happened before.

**J*U*icEd** · 01-20-2004, 02:48 AM

add more cals....u should be fine....and N large is a great idea....i think it's the best mass building protein....JMO

**LuvMuhRoids** · 01-20-2004, 03:01 AM

What I noticed was the carb intake too. Youre on the wrong diet if youre looking to mass gains on enanthate . You have no carbs. I see little carbs with cheese and a pineapple and thats it. Where is the potato's, rice, complex carbs? Looks like your carb depleting and you have no energy, weak, and your muscles are not full. Your going flat like this.

You have the drug and diet backwards. Right now you should be eating at McDonalds, TacoBell, and eating your protein, complex carbs. Amass the gains on enanthate first.

If you wanted to, then diet like this on a cutting cycle to harden the gains like an EQ/Winny/Tren cycle along with nolvadex to reduce bloat and estrogen. Also using maybe clen /eca stack.

Of course this is only my opinion.

**Hate&Pain** · 01-20-2004, 12:29 PM

I'm one of his trainng partners and I have gotten on him about the caloric consumption. He has definitely gotten tighter and put on some size as well as realized terrific strength gains. He also does consume 46 grams of Isolate post workout so I dont think his protein consumption is an issue. Ultimately it comes down to carbs and realizing that it's ok to put on a little fat per the size gains. My question is would it be way to late to throw in some Deca and end it a couple weeks before the end of the sust cycle? He's largly concerend with the progesterone problems rarely realized with Deca. Can anyone alleviate his fears?

**LuvMuhRoids** · 01-20-2004, 02:14 PM

He's doing sustanon too? Only sais Enanthate . If he's doing sust also why is he dieting like this on these two drugs? Really should have come here before this cycle started. What is he exactly doing and what are his goals here? Tell ya what. How about you guys use that search button up top and type in cutting cycles, cutting diets, bulking cycles, bulking diets and do some research. The whole diet, cycle here is backwards. Training for a show on Enanthate too?

Originally Posted by Hate&Pain

I'm one of his trainng partners and I have gotten on him about the caloric consumption. He has definitely gotten tighter and put on some size as well as realized terrific strength gains. He also does consume 46 grams of Isolate post workout so I dont think his protein consumption is an issue. Ultimately it comes down to carbs and realizing that it's ok to put on a little fat per the size gains. My question is would it be way to late to throw in some Deca and end it a couple weeks before the end of the sust cycle? He's largly concerend with the progesterone problems rarely realized with Deca. Can anyone alleviate his fears?

**Johnny Boy** · 01-20-2004, 02:20 PM

Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't Deca kick in way too late starting at week 7-8?

**Hate&Pain** · 01-20-2004, 02:28 PM

My bad LMR he's just using Enanthate no sust. Also He's not training for a show I am. He's merely trying to put on some size and was wondering whats going wrong to this point. I posed a simply question whether you want to respond or not is up to you. By the way the show isn't for 9 months so we're not trying to cut at this point.

**ripsid** · 01-20-2004, 03:29 PM

I'd definately say your carbs are not near where they should be! I'd add a couple yams/potatoes/brown rice during the day. mid morning/lunch and mid afternoon about 45mins before workout.

I gained 15lbs in 1st week and I was using test en 800/800/600/600/600 for the 1st 5 weeks. I leaned out big time! and didn't gain that much more weight. My strength was great and pumps were ok.

I'd add more carbs to my cycle definately 1st. And what kind of Test? Shanghai? IP? What kind? It may be underdosed, you hear about it all the time.

SID
EAGLES SUCK!

**DF2003** · 01-20-2004, 03:41 PM

seventh has nailed it! eat more! ya gotta add fuel to the feed the fire!
hey seventh ya like that huh?

**longhornDr** · 01-20-2004, 03:42 PM

Like others have said, not enough carbs.

Looks almost like you are on a ketogenic diet.

**shim jahng** · 01-20-2004, 08:53 PM

thanks for the advice guys, great as always. looks like the majority rules, hmmm now im off to get a better diet plan going. i will keep you guys update in a few weeks.

**TheSevnthWarrior** · 01-20-2004, 09:17 PM

Originally Posted by Hate&Pain

I'm one of his trainng partners and I have gotten on him about the caloric consumption. He has definitely gotten tighter and put on some size as well as realized terrific strength gains. He also does consume 46 grams of Isolate post workout so I dont think his protein consumption is an issue. Ultimately it comes down to carbs and realizing that it's ok to put on a little fat per the size gains. My question is would it be way to late to throw in some Deca and end it a couple weeks before the end of the sust cycle? He's largly concerend with the progesterone problems rarely realized with Deca. Can anyone alleviate his fears?

Deca would have to be ran at insane doses to have a progesterone problem....I was worried about this when wanting to run Deca & Tren together.....Pheedno diminished my fears.

**DF2003** · 01-20-2004, 09:38 PM

hey seventh! whatcha think about the new avatar ?and check your pm.

**TheSevnthWarrior** · 01-21-2004, 02:44 AM

Originally Posted by DF2003

hey seventh! whatcha think about the new avatar ?and check your pm.

LOL...yeah Foo! I aint gettin' on no airplane ('lil Old school Mr.T there)
And you check your PM.

***50%Natural*** · 01-21-2004, 02:58 AM

you cheatin on me?

**TheSevnthWarrior** · 01-21-2004, 03:03 AM

Originally Posted by 50%Natural

you cheatin on me?

NO NO NO Baby, you KNOW you're the only one Hon....he wrote to me, I was just writin' back to tell him to get lost, I'm takin'.....I'm hurt, I thought you trusted me!