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  1. #1
    Carlos_E's Avatar
    Carlos_E is offline National Level Bodybuilder/Hall of Famer/RETIRED
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    20 Week Cycle Question

    I'm planning out a 20 week bulk cycle and I'm wondering how you guys normally do it. Do you run the same gear and doses through out the entire cycle or do you slightly increase the dose midway through or switch to different gear all together. What do you feel gives the best results? This is my second cycle so it's pretty basic. My first cycle was 150 mgs Prop EOD Weeks 1-4, 400 mgs deca weeks 1-16, 600 mgs T400 weeks 1-16. I put on 30 pounds. I'm 5'6" 192, fairly lean. This is what I was thinking of running.

    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-20 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan

    Or should I just run it like this:

    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-10 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-10 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 11-20 600 mgs EQ
    Weeks 11-20 750 mgs Test Enan

    Or after the first 10 weeks switch to different gear. I plan on running arimidex EOD throughout and using nolvadex , clomid and arimidex for post cycle recovery. Any suggestions?

  2. #2
    asymmetrical1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    I'm planning out a 20 week bulk cycle and I'm wondering how you guys normally do it. Do you run the same gear and doses through out the entire cycle or do you slightly increase the dose midway through or switch to different gear all together. What do you feel gives the best results? This is my second cycle so it's pretty basic. My first cycle was 150 mgs Prop EOD Weeks 1-4, 400 mgs deca weeks 1-16, 600 mgs T400 weeks 1-16. I put on 30 pounds. I'm 5'6" 192, fairly lean. This is what I was thinking of running.

    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-20 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan

    Or should I just run it like this:

    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-10 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-10 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 11-20 600 mgs EQ
    Weeks 11-20 750 mgs Test Enan

    Or after the first 10 weeks switch to different gear. I plan on running arimidex EOD throughout and using nolvadex , clomid and arimidex for post cycle recovery. Any suggestions?
    on my long long cycles bro i run the same amounts....i just switch esters and compounds.....

  3. #3
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    the first version looks good, no need to switch dosages or gear for a 20 week cycle, imo

  4. #4
    Carlos_E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by asymmetrical1
    on my long long cycles bro i run the same amounts....i just switch esters and compounds.....
    Can you give me an example?

  5. #5
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    you could switch from enanthate to cypionate , and don't use adex in pct, it will hold back your recovery, stick with nolva and clomid for pct

  6. #6
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    I like your first one carlos,but you need to run the test a wk further than the EQ so they level out at the same time.

    DB

  7. #7
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    #2 looks good, I agree with the bros.. My only suggestion is to end the cycle with prop the last few weeks to stablize the test in your body.. No need to adjust dosages for the drugs, just run it straight thru in my opinion..

    Looks good Carlos

  8. #8
    Carlos_E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by monster.
    #2 looks good, I agree with the bros.. My only suggestion is to end the cycle with prop the last few weeks to stablize the test in your body.. No need to adjust dosages for the drugs, just run it straight thru in my opinion..

    Looks good Carlos
    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-19 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 21-22 200 mgs Prop EOD

    Then start post cycle right after the two weeks of prop?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-19 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 21-22 200 mgs Prop EOD

    Then start post cycle right after the two weeks of prop?
    Looks good,you can start the prop at wk 19,then 3 days after last prop shot start pct.I like the above with that minor adjustment.

    DB

  10. #10
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    I agree with that last one, starting and ending with prop is a really good idea. Plus this way you will be off of EQ for 3 weeks, which will help recovery

    -MS

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    I keep my doses "relatively" the Same..i.e. Toward the end when I switch back to Prop to finish up, I'll go to 150mg ED the last two weeks, but other than that I keep it pretty much the same, I just switch esters often.
    On your Prop Bro, I know you've heard this, but it can't be said enough, with a 27 hour half life it needs to be ran ED...The difference it makes in me is completely night and day. For instance 75mg ED is far superior to 150mg EOD. EOD leaves me moody and even "somewhat" lethargic, not to mention the gains aren't as good.
    Also, on a cycle that long you'd be doing yourself a serious injustice not to run HCG .
    On one that long I like every 6 weeks, 500iu ED for 2 weeks, then 1000iu ED the last two weeks ending about 5 days before my last Prop shot.
    Good Luck Bro.
    TSW

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    Can you give me an example?
    I'll start with an oral, test e, and deca ....run for about 12 weeks....then slide into prop, fina, and var for for another 10-14 weeks......

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    Quote Originally Posted by asymmetrical1
    I'll start with an oral, test e, and deca....run for about 12 weeks....then slide into prop, fina, and var for for another 10-14 weeks......
    lol..AS1...since when have you been known to "slide" into anything!....

  14. #14
    asymmetrical1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-19 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 19-22 200 mgs Prop EOD

    Post cycle 3 days after prop.
    looks outstanding

  15. #15
    Carlos_E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSevnthWarrior
    I keep my doses "relatively" the Same..i.e. Toward the end when I switch back to Prop to finish up, I'll go to 150mg ED the last two weeks, but other than that I keep it pretty much the same, I just switch esters often.
    On your Prop Bro, I know you've heard this, but it can't be said enough, with a 27 hour half life it needs to be ran ED...The difference it makes in me is completely night and day. For instance 75mg ED is far superior to 150mg EOD. EOD leaves me moody and even "somewhat" lethargic, not to mention the gains aren't as good.
    Also, on a cycle that long you'd be doing yourself a serious injustice not to run HCG .
    On one that long I like every 6 weeks, 500iu ED for 2 weeks, then 1000iu ED the last two weeks ending about 5 days before my last Prop shot.
    Good Luck Bro.
    TSW
    As much as I loved prop my last cycle I HATED doing ED shots. I started out with ED and switched to EOD. I know I need to man up and deal with it but I was doing my entire cycle in my quads I started building up scar tissue. I did prop only shots in my pecs and my lats before. I'll never try that **** again. I just stood in the mirror watching my face turn funny colors and getting light headed during the shots.

  16. #16
    asymmetrical1's Avatar
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    everyone will tell you, receptors down de-regulate....but you will think they do when you get into a long cycle....switching up compounds and esters makes me think i'm growing

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    As much as I loved prop my last cycle I HATED doing ED shots. I started out with ED and switched to EOD. I know I need to man up and deal with it but I was doing my entire cycle in my quads I started building up scar tissue. I did prop only shots in my pecs and my lats before. I'll never try that **** again. I just stood in the mirror watching my face turn funny colors and getting light headed during the shots.
    LMAO..........I like the last cycle you posted and took down...rotate your shots more.....I like the pecs myself and delts also,I rarely hit my legs..but that's just me

  18. #18
    Carlos_E's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by asymmetrical1
    everyone will tell you, receptors down de-regulate....but you will think they do when you get into a long cycle....switching up compounds and esters makes me think i'm growing
    I remember reading a post by BASK8KACE where he said in longer cycles it's good to bump up your dose or change gear to continue growing. That's why I was thinking of switching gear or slightly increase the dose.

  19. #19
    Carlos_E's Avatar
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    As it stands this is what I'm looking at. Possibly throwing in HCG .

    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-19 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 19-22 200 mgs Prop EOD

    Post cycle 3 days after prop.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    As it stands this is what I'm looking at. Possibly throwing in HCG .

    Weeks 1-5 200 mgs Prop EOD
    Weeks 1-19 400 mgs EQ
    Weeks 1-20 500 mgs Test Enan
    Weeks 19-22 200 mgs Prop EOD

    Post cycle 3 days after prop.
    Looks great......HCG is a good idea also,last 5wks or so....say sat and sun 500ius ed.

    DB

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    Quote Originally Posted by asymmetrical1
    everyone will tell you, receptors down de-regulate....but you will think they do when you get into a long cycle....switching up compounds and esters makes me think i'm growing
    Yeah, when they saturate to the point that you Plateu, you'll swear they do!
    But really they don't....I read an article that said they do once, (actually I think I just misunderstood the terminology of the author) and from being on long cycles, I didn't argue it, even though I had always been told just the opposite prior to that. But Pheedno set me back straight again.
    When receptors saturate, they UP-Regulate (meaning produce more - multiply) which is a good thing, but after a while, even though receptors are "multiplying" they still can't keep up with the onslaught of saturation.
    So in turn you "could" up your doses considerablely, with only equal or even less results....So this is a good time to switch esters/compounds etc, or shut 'er down and start over.....But who wants to do THAT???

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSevnthWarrior
    Yeah, when they saturate to the point that you Plateu, you'll swear they do!
    But really they don't....I read an article that said they do once, (actually I think I just misunderstood the terminology of the author) and from being on long cycles, I didn't argue it, even though I had always been told just the opposite prior to that. But Pheedno set me back straight again.
    When receptors saturate, they UP-Regulate (meaning produce more - multiply) which is a good thing, but after a while, even though receptors are "multiplying" they still can't keep up with the onslaught of saturation.
    So in turn you "could" up your doses considerablely, with only equal or even less results....So this is a good time to switch esters/compounds etc, or shut 'er down and start over.....But who wants to do THAT???
    not me...

  23. #23
    BASK8KACE is offline Anabolic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    I remember reading a post by BASK8KACE where he said in longer cycles it's good to bump up your dose or change gear to continue growing. That's why I was thinking of switching gear or slightly increase the dose.
    Carlos_E,

    One of the most fantastic characteristic of the human body is its adaptability. The body reaches (or nearly reaches) a state of homeostasis after approximately 2 months during a long cycle. So, to continue growing a person would either have to increase doses (on the same cycle, NOT consecutive cycles), or switch compounds.

    I think the better choice is to switch compounds since this will force the body to adapt to new steroids at as low a dose as possible and will minimize the chances of side effects due to ever increasing doses. I recently wrote out a 20 week cycle in which I mentioned this.

    Here's a link to the original thread where I posted a study from the University of Maryland regarding homeostais:
    http://anabolicreview.com/vbulletin/...ad.php?t=63345

    You look amazing in your avatar. Keep up the good work.

    Good luck with your cycle!
    Last edited by BASK8KACE; 02-02-2004 at 09:04 PM.

  24. #24
    BASK8KACE is offline Anabolic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos_E
    Can you give me an example?
    Carlos,

    Here's a link to my 20-week cycle plan in which I switch to new compounds at the 11 week mark:

    http://anabolicreview.com/vbulletin/...ad.php?t=80995

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