The cheapest and best stack I can think of...

I'm sure this has been around the board a few times:

"The cheapest and best stack I can think of anyone doing to put on major size is a gram or two of test with arimidex to keep water off with fina 75 to 150mg every other day for 4 weeks --then 2 to 3 weeks of cruising (test at 300-400mg and clomid at 5 (day one), 4(day two), 3(day three),then 2 every day for 2 weeks)--and then back on everything full again (maybe equipoise used instead of fina this time) for 4 weeks (then 2 to 3 weeks cruising again etc etc)---if you can’t gain gobs of muscle on that nothing exotic (masteron, etc etc etc) surely isn’t going to do it for you." -DC-

As this goes against pretty much EVERYTHING on this board... I ran this about 2.5 years ago (for a change) and saw GREAT gains (from 240lbs to 280lbs) from it..now the problem was I think it supressed my immune system becuase I came up with every flu/cold that was going around. I think I was sick for 3 months and just could not shake it. Needless to say I lost 20+lbs due to it. Beside NO stable blood plasma levels of test in your body during this cycle, is it possible that it did blast my immune system?

I think there may be a way to run this cycle with short acting esters only and starting the arim or letro a week of two before hand to build plasma levels. As far as "cruising" at 300-400mg Test PLUS Clomid?.?.? I'd think that I wouldn't due that again...after crusing then run it?.?.? Just something to throw out there get your thoughts on it...

Thanx,
Ben :dg:

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Originally Posted by Ben Lifton

now the problem was I think it supressed my immune system becuase I came up with every flu/cold that was going around. I think I was sick for 3 months and just could not shake it. Needless to say I lost 20+lbs due to it. Beside NO stable blood plasma levels of test in your body during this cycle, is it possible that it did blast my immune system?

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Yes, you are correct, ALL anabolic steroids supress your immune system. Hence "test" flu....

There is somewhat of a debate going around about certain disease(ie: the flu). It's thought that you already carry it your body, but your immune system continually fights it and keeps it weak, and its not until certain conditions are present, that you begin to feel the symptoms...

now correct me if i am wrong...but dont they give AAS to people with things such as aids/hiv in order to keep there immune system strong?

If so then how can all anabolics be considered to suppress the immune system....all always though that DHT was the main culprit( winny, tren, masteron)

Deca, test and anadrol are prescribed to aids/hiv patients if i am not mistaken.

Again correct me if i am wrong

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Originally Posted by quebecbulk

now correct me if i am wrong...but dont they give AAS to people with things such as aids/hiv in order to keep there immune system strong?

If so then how can all anabolics be considered to suppress the immune system....all always though that DHT was the main culprit( winny, tren, masteron)

Deca, test and anadrol are prescribed to aids/hiv patients if i am not mistaken.

Again correct me if i am wrong

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No, you are certain correct i that aspect, but have you ever seen how many different types of medication they take? They take the AAS to combat muscle waisting and then they have to take other meds to help bring there immune system back up...

Anabolic steroids reduce the amount of globulin A, G, and M in the blood stream. However, they increase the activity of the bodies natural killer cells, but overactivity of killer cells can lead to autoimmune diseases....

I believe they take around 10-12 different prescriptions a day :(.

Here are some research reports:

Yesalis CE, Wright JE, Bahrke MS. Epidemiological and policy issues in the measurement of the long term health effects of anabolic-androgenic steroids. Sports Medicine 1989 Sep;8(3):129-38.

Johnson MD. Steroids. Adolescent Med 1991 Feb;2(1):79-93

Kleiner SM. Performance-enhancing aids in sport - health consequences and nutritional alternatives. J Amer Coll Nutr 1991 Apr;10(2):163-76

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Originally Posted by Hyperlite

No, you are certain correct i that aspect, but have you ever seen how many different types of medication they take? They take the AAS to combat muscle waisting and then they have to take other meds to help bring there immune system back up...

Anabolic steroids reduce the amount of globulin A, G, and M in the blood stream. However, they increase the activity of the bodies natural killer cells, but overactivity of killer cells can lead to autoimmune diseases....

I believe they take around 10-12 different prescriptions a day :(.

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well put that is perfectly put nice to see another intelligent person on this board.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hyperlite

Yes, you are correct, ALL anabolic steroids supress your immune system. Hence "test" flu....

There is somewhat of a debate going around about certain disease(ie: the flu). It's thought that you already carry it your body, but your immune system continually fights it and keeps it weak, and its not until certain conditions are present, that you begin to feel the symptoms...

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A crazy thing about this though I have been using AAS for 12 years (off/on of course) prior to this and NEVER had this happen.... also NEVER had allergies either and now I do. I just think it was a chaotic level of test...

NEVER SAY NEVER....

I had no idea that roids were used for aids/hiv patients? I have always heard cancer patients. My buddy back in highschool got cancer after we graduated and his doctor suggested he get some roids. Some were prescribed and some he had to go buy himself even though they were illegal. I believe dbol and test cyp he was taking. I believe the dbol was the one he had to buy underground but is doctor still suggested it. Sure enough he passed away about a year after taking the roids and having the cancer. He go so freaking fat he looked like a fat watery blow fish while taking the roids. He also couldn't work out so he took the stuff and sat in bed all day. It was pretty freaky.

hyper: thanx for the info!

equiguns: the best pharms to hit for gear are the ones in gay villages...they always keep a fair stock of test and deca..

chefj: Thanks for the compliment

ben lifton: That sounds like it might support the theory. The high levels of AS depeleted your immune system enough to were the bacteria became strong enough to cause you trouble.

equiguns: You would be suprised what they use AS for now. There is a study out in california now (UC Berkely to be precise), in which they are using it as a male contraceptive. Its only 200mg EOW though