no test cycle

[houseofpain]

what would be a good cycle for strength and size without using test. i kind of wanna do something like d-bols and fina or something. any info would be appreciated. thanks fellas.

[50%Natural]

I wouldn't suggest it, but I have done eq/winny/var before and saw pretty good results. Unless you are gettin a good deal on those I wouldn't do it because running a lot of androgens will not give you optimal results. All steroids are a derivative of some sort of testosterone . It just doesn't make sense to not run test since test is the hormone in your body responsible for retaining muscle mass. Do a little research on the human body and protein synthesis and you will see why it just makes sense to run test in every cycle. I have done test less cycles before and found later that i could have seen far better results with the test in my cycle. If you are one of those people afraid of running test because of the side affect associated with test then I suggest you hold off and do more research. Like I said, I've done this before so I can totally relate and being on both sides of the fence I can tell you to just run the test, it's not as bad as the profiles say...good luck

[houseofpain]

i am not affraid of the side affects it just breaks me out and drives me crazy but when i think about it i would rather be big. i took a test only cycle for my first cycle in december of 2003 and gained about 26 lbs in 7 weeks and my bench went up about 65 lbs. i felt like i was on top of the world but i guess i can run some test just not as much as i was doing. i started out doing 3cc's a week and went to 4 which is 1000mg's, i broke out kinda bad when i came off but i got a stronger form of tetracycline which helped a lot and i am completely clear again but yeah i guess i should just quit being a pussy and do it. ANY INFO ON AN OPTIMAL CYCLE FOR SIZE AND STRENGTH? i currently weigh about 253 and bench 405 i have about 15% bf. what would you suggest. oh yeah i am going away to play football in august so i cant take deca b/c i will be tested and it stays too long. thanks bro...any one have info on optimal cycles...info is appreciated.

[Phillyboy1]

tren /EQ cycle look at my post. i have no libido problems

[50%Natural]

I am not a firm believer in the fact that a drug like eq will kill your libido if your test dosage is not higher than the compliment's dose in this case eq. Well, you already noted the problem that you ran too high of test but it sounded like you got impatient. I'd consider 500mg test e/wk along with 600mg/eq wk. I think that would do you well. Try running that for 12 weeks.
wk 1-13 500mg test e
wk 1-12 600mg eq
if you wanted, you could throw some var in there also. Maybe 6 weeks for say 40mg/ed. That would be up to you but I bet you could do well on 500mg test and 600mg eq. That is me. People suggest 400mg/eq wk but I never really saw good results on eq until i bumped it to 600mg/wk. I bet you could see good results running less for longer instead of going heavy for a short length of time like you did on your previous cycle.

[m16a2]

I would recommend using test in your cycle. I omitted test from a couple of cycles and found that you have less results with the same shutdown post-cycle. It really doesn't make a whole lot of sense, but that is just from my experience. If you want to get the most out of your cycle, don't leave the test out.

[houseofpain]

--50% said: I'd consider 500mg test e/wk along with 600mg/eq wk. I think that would do you well. Try running that for 12 weeks.
wk 1-13 500mg test e
wk 1-12 600mg eq
if you wanted, you could throw some var in there also. Maybe 6 weeks for say 40mg/ed.

where whould you suggest the var as in what weeks and do you think d-bols would work well instead?

[Sorken]

no test no cycle !

[RJM03]

gotta have the test.

[m16a2]

where whould you suggest the var as in what weeks and do you think d-bols would work well instead?

D-bols are usually better for bulking cycles since they will help you put on some mass and strength. Unfortunately, these results will quickly diminish in many cases, which is why you use them as a jumpkick in your cycle. D-bol is best for the first few weeks of a cycle where your goal is to bulk, especially effective with deca . Var is used to cut and for lean gains and therefore should be used at the end of the cycle. Read more about var by searching for anavar , or oxandrolone.

[houseofpain]

thanks a lot fellas....much appreciated advice