Any truth to this??

**PJK015** · 03-29-2004, 01:39 PM

i was wondering if there is any truth to this...

Will novladex hinder your gains while running test??

I say no...but i have heard different and have not been given a reasonable explanation.

I have been researching novla in depth (just out of curiousity) and can not see how this could be true? ( not saying that it necessarily is)

**tbrocato** · 03-29-2004, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by PJK015

i was wondering if there is any truth to this...

Will novladex hinder your gains while running test??

I say no...but i have heard different and have not been given a reasonable explanation.

I have been researching novla in depth (just out of curiousity) and can not see how this could be true? ( not saying that it necessarily is)

I have heard some people before say that it might put a slight hender on gains but I guess it all depends on the person but I doubt its anything noticeable....nolvadex is def. needed depending on the amount of Test your running and if your prone to gyno.

**PJK015** · 03-29-2004, 01:44 PM

if it does.... does anyone know why/how?

**quebecbulk** · 03-29-2004, 01:45 PM

people say that because nolvadex lowers igf production in the body, but for that to be so, you would have to be doing a big dose (50mg/ed).

**toolman** · 03-29-2004, 01:46 PM

It absolutely, 100% does not hamper your gains, unleas you consider estrogen related water bloat or gyno, gains. It keeps ldl/hdl chol. levels in check, prevents gyno, water bloat, etc. Nolva is a part of every one of my cycles and you will find that true with most of the vets and mods here.

**tbrocato** · 03-29-2004, 01:47 PM

Originally Posted by PJK015

if it does.... does anyone know why/how?

Maybe something along the lines as your trying to lower the amount of estrogen becuase when you increase your test levels your estrogen also goes up and nolvadex drops estrogen levels and also your test levels ?

Dont know someone correct me if I am wrong.

**einstein1905** · 03-29-2004, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by PJK015

if it does.... does anyone know why/how?

There are a couple of studies that show a slight reduction in IGF-1 levels while using nolva.....However, there are also a greater number od studies (from what I've seen) that show contradictory or inconclusive results.
Nolva is antiestrogenic ( an estrogen antagonist) in all the right places but it's estrogenic in the liver, bone, and some other tissue types I believe.

**quebecbulk** · 03-29-2004, 01:52 PM

just ask pheedno, hes the expert on nolvadex ...

**baller45** · 03-29-2004, 01:53 PM

Yes, it does lower Igf. It will not be the difference between being ronnie coleman or carrot top.

Acting as an antiestrogen in the breast, tamoxifen increases breast cell growth inhibitory factors, such as transforming growth factor beta
(TGF beta) and reduces stimulatory factors, such as transforming growth factor alpha (TGF alpha) and insulin like growth factor 1 (IGF 1).[147,148]

**einstein1905** · 03-29-2004, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by baller45

Acting as an antiestrogen in the breast, tamoxifen increases breast cell growth inhibitory factors, such as transforming growth factor beta
(TGF beta) and reduces stimulatory factors, such as transforming growth factor alpha (TGF alpha) and insulin like growth factor 1 (IGF 1).[147,148]

This was the case in one study, but since we won't lower ourselves to report "info" like the media, we should give an unbiased report and include the contrdictory data from other studies....hint hint

**PJK015** · 03-29-2004, 01:58 PM

ok, thanks for the responses

say you were running test with IGF-1 and novla @ 20mg ED
since the novla has an effect on the IGF levels would that effect your gains from the igf ??

**tbrocato** · 03-29-2004, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by PJK015

ok, thanks for the responses

say you were running test with IGF-1 and novla @ 20mg ED
since the novla has an effect on the IGF levels would that effect your gains from the igf ??

I think bottom line is that it might SLIGHTY hender gains at MOST. Just run your nolvadex and you will be ok

**PJK015** · 03-29-2004, 02:03 PM

i am running novladex regardless...i just started this thread for discussion and out of curiousity

i am not running gh or igf, just enan and prop...but say i were running igf...would the novla have an effect in that sense... ie would you need to up the dosages? or would it be an unnoticable effect (on the igf)

**tbrocato** · 03-29-2004, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by PJK015

i am running novladex regardless...i just started this thread for discussion and out of curiousity

i am not running gh or igf, just enan and prop...but say i were running igf...would the novla have an effect in that sense... ie would you need to up the dosages? or would it be an unnoticable effect (on the igf)

I think it would be unnoticable effect...

**einstein1905** · 03-29-2004, 02:04 PM

Originally Posted by PJK015

ok, thanks for the responses

say you were running test with IGF-1 and novla @ 20mg ED
since the novla has an effect on the IGF levels would that effect your gains from the igf ??

If you're taking IGF-1, your own endogenous IGF-1 will be supressed for most of the active life of the IGF-1 you shoot. You can look in the GH/IGF-1/slin forum for recent posts on this.
So, nolva will have no effect on IGF-1 if you're supplementing with IGF-1

**PJK015** · 03-29-2004, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by einstein1905

If you're taking IGF-1, your own endogenous IGF-1 will be supressed for most of the active life of the IGF-1 you shoot. You can look in the GH/IGF-1/slin forum for recent posts on this.
So, nolva will have no effect on IGF-1 if you're supplementing with IGF-1

thanks
ill check in the gh/igf-1 forum for more about this