State of Bodybuilding

I've been reading and watching a lot about the state of BB today. Golden era vs today's mass monsters. I got I to BB when I was 17/18, just at the beginning of the mass monster era. At 5-8" I've never really aspired to be Dorian Yates, yet wanted to be bigger then Zane et al. I'd like to get a feel for where you guys on the forum stand as regard to this question, especially in light of Arnold's comments at his 2015 classic and the bubble gut era, which I find repulsive BTW. I found some old flex mags I had from the early 90s and noticed that when I flicked through it, more than half of the guys depicted were dead. Made me very sad, but also very grateful that I didn't start pinning back then, I'd probably be dead now too. I had no idea that getting a physique like those guys involved much less focus on training and diet than it did in the 50s thru 70s. I don't regret waiting until now to pin as my test loss begins to accelerate, but I won't be stacking countless dif things in obscene amounts. I am not judging, but I am sad that a sport I always thought was a healthy pass time is anything but. I want to see my son get married and hopefully hold a grandchild.

Healthy goals are great. Todays competitive bodybuilding is not a healthy thing and never will be unfortunately. Until the judging standards change it will remain that way. Moderate dosing of aas coupled with intelligence and solid nutrition will take you far. The intelligence aspect includes frequent blood work to understand what's actually happening to you on the inside.

The problem with amateurs today is that everyone's in a rush to get the physique of their dreams. Basically the "want it now" or "more is better" generation which doesn't have the patience or work ethic of their elders. So they train six months and then start cycles that a seasoned vet may not run, then wonder why they have health issues.....

My point I guess would be to train hard and focus on nutrition, which is where most guys fail miserably. Use aas to help achieve your goals but not as the sole precurser to achieving them.

Be smart, be healthy and pursue your dreams in all aspects of life. BB'ing has opened so many doors in my life that I'm thankful for but it still has to be kept in the proper perspective. It doesn't come with a pension plan and health benefits!

Indeed Kel! BB has given me a work ethic and sense of discipline that has been extremely beneficial in all aspects of my life. I also must give credence to the fact that I'm fortunate to have been born with a mesomorph type body and reasonable genetics so gaining muscle was never difficult for me without aas. I wonder if this had not been the case would I have started pinning much early. I was also fortunate that the gym I first started seriously training in was run by guys who were very much about health and aesthetics and used to ridicule the over use of aas and also those who had a poor attitude in general and favoured hard work, discipline and perserverence.

I am also inclined to agree with you about laying a good portion of the blame on the judges. Another thing that kept me away from competing was the subjectivity, favoritism, and politics involved. I always knew I had way to bad a temper and short tolerance for BS to compete when I younger. I also had a good degree of difficulty getting my head around being judged by someone who may have never set foot inside a gym or was getting his rocks off watching us onstage lol.

Here's a link to a vid I watched last night, if you can get over the whiney French accent, he does make some valid points, especially about the fans.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhzOS8T7Hys

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Originally Posted by kelkel

Healthy goals are great. Todays competitive bodybuilding is not a healthy thing and never will be unfortunately. Until the judging standards change it will remain that way. Moderate dosing of aas coupled with intelligence and solid nutrition will take you far. The intelligence aspect includes frequent blood work to understand what's actually happening to you on the inside.

The problem with amateurs today is that everyone's in a rush to get the physique of their dreams. Basically the "want it now" or "more is better" generation which doesn't have the patience or work ethic of their elders. So they train six months and then start cycles that a seasoned vet may not run, then wonder why they have health issues.....

My point I guess would be to train hard and focus on nutrition, which is where most guys fail miserably. Use aas to help achieve your goals but not as the sole precurser to achieving them.

Be smart, be healthy and pursue your dreams in all aspects of life. BB'ing has opened so many doors in my life that I'm thankful for but it still has to be kept in the proper perspective. It doesn't come with a pension plan and health benefits!

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Totally agree, one aspect that I don't think many grasp is just how important nutrition is. They hyper focus on the perfect workout, perfect supplements and perfect cycle. But completely miss the mark with their nutrition planning. It's by far the hardest thing for me to get and keep right. It takes an an extraordinary amount of willpower to be consistent Day in day out, week in and week out and even month in and month out. That's what changes the game.

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Originally Posted by MuscleScience

It takes an an extraordinary amount of willpower to be consistent Day in day out, weekend and week out and even month in and month out. That's what changes the game.

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Yes it does. And lets not forget year after year...

I also think so many BBrs are gear dependant, Im not talking about high level, its the mid and below. I see guys in my gym that only train hard (or even come) when on and just plain lose their dedication when off. I try to explain to them that it matters most is when they are off, thats when the true dedication begins, anybody can be dedicated for 12-14 weeks on gear............................they just come up short when off cycle. Its like watching a fucking yoyo.

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Originally Posted by BG

I also think so many BBrs are gear dependant, Im not talking about high level, its the mid and below. I see guys in my gym that only train hard (or even come) when on and just plain lose their dedication when off. I try to explain to them that it matters most is when they are off, thats when the true dedication begins, anybody can be dedicated for 12-14 weeks on gear............................they just come up short when off cycle. Its like watching a fucking yoyo.

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Yet they wonder why?

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Originally Posted by BG

I also think so many BBrs are gear dependant, Im not talking about high level, its the mid and below. I see guys in my gym that only train hard (or even come) when on and just plain lose their dedication when off. I try to explain to them that it matters most is when they are off, thats when the true dedication begins, anybody can be dedicated for 12-14 weeks on gear............................they just come up short when off cycle. Its like watching a fucking yoyo.

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This is the thing that is rather frustrating when someone approaches you for help to get "back," into shape. They want your advice and opinions but when you give it to them, if it's to hard they won't do the things you told them they need to do. I use to help people out but it always ended up they same way. It took to much energy away from me to watch them not do what I suggested and quit when they didn't get anywhere.

Lmao I feel you guys. I've given hundreds of people advice and only a handful have actually done it. I have guys that ask me the same shit........year after year! But this past year things have turned, there's two kids I've been helping and they are both trying to get nationally qualified on Saturday so I guess it makes up for all the others.

I dont know if any of you remember the actor Jim Varney (Know what I mean Vern). He had a skit he used many times in his movies showing that his descendants got dumber and dumber and dumber...etc

I was never into bodybuilding when younger. I was a good Track and Field athlete and it was all about strength and coordination...not mass. So my reading of choice was Hot Rod magazines and Playboys. You waited each month for the new issue to come out and wow..you memorized that puppy cover to cover....rereading the last few years issues waiting for the next month. My point is you had some access to professionals talking about your desire and you studied it. Now...you go on google and type in how to cycle for mass and bam...instant gratification without any work. The difference is back in the day if you lied in magazines the business took you to task. Now with no monitoring of lying and the internet being an illegal drug selling place you have no clue what you are doing...and people are too stupid to know this. This website is the most informative and helpful resource ever.

But as said above most don't want the real answer...they want the answer they want.

On BB I always followed Arnold, Jessie Ventura, and Bolo Yeung. All three are from the golden era and all three going strong later in life. I can relate to them and respect them. I watch the new crew and the people that are the "mouth" of BB. Rich Piana comes to mind. RIP and all that jazz but man didn't everyone see that coming? I consider him the poster child of the modern BB.

Ronnie Coleman was an HGH IGF abuser like Rich but managed to look good even today in his 50s. He doesn't sit around on a throne with a crown looking like clown shoes talking about how he was killing himself. Respectable at least and not trying to encourage the average joe to think you can do what he did easily.

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Originally Posted by MuscleScience

Totally agree, one aspect that I don't think many grasp is just how important nutrition is. They hyper focus on the perfect workout, perfect supplements and perfect cycle. But completely miss the mark with their nutrition planning. It's by far the hardest thing for me to get and keep right. It takes an an extraordinary amount of willpower to be consistent Day in day out, week in and week out and even month in and month out. That's what changes the game.

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That is the biggest thing and biggest key that opens the best door of growth than anything else. Basic quality food eaten regularly with minimal amount of supps imo is the best way to go.

I am a late bloomer. I got into BB for health reasons. I was overweight at 45 and the dr said that I had 2 options: do more cardio or take a pill everyday for the rest of my life for high bp. I thought diet was caloric restriction and I knew that I needed an objective to lose the weight. I decided that I was going to compete ( and naturally). I went from 240 to 165 and competed. I soon realized that if I was going to continue, i needed to juice. I started out and can give you horror stories of the silly cycles but I did not have people like on this forum to keep me straight. Just the people that have you do tren, winnie and 2 orals on a second cycle, no hcg, no AI, no liver support. Tren is a bitch without test!
Anyway, I compete to keep my education going. There isnt a diet, there is a lifestyle now and I learn something new every single year about how my body reacts. You cant get this from books.
This year I was able to get my bulking diet dialed in to maintain 12 bf while bulking. No, I will never be Mr. O, but that is fine with me. I just want to make a new version of myself each year and look better. Yes, I want to win 1st place, but just to be my age and have the discipline and look better than the previous year is an accomplishment.
This year I am going to step it up and go to much bigger competitions.
To some of us, BB is not a trophy, but a lifestyle. I am saying this because alot of the ones you talk about seem like they are only in it for a trophy.
Obviously, since I compete, I do not follow the general rules of cycling (time on+pct=time off). I do get bloods and try to maintain my health in optimum levels. Some people accomplish crazy cycles that at some point in time willl catch up,with them.

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Originally Posted by BG

Lmao I feel you guys. I've given hundreds of people advice and only a handful have actually done it. I have guys that ask me the same shit........year after year! But this past year things have turned, there's two kids I've been helping and they are both trying to get nationally qualified on Saturday so I guess it makes up for all the others.

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Well BG like everything else it takes heart to be a real BBer diet is 24/7 365 days a year and that is a lot of will power.Now I was never a BBer I power lifted and never knew anything about diet until I had to cut weight for a meet.They had me on broth for a week to make weight not fun.I will be the 1st too admit it I couldn't eat like you guys.

High level bodybuilding makes me cringe, just the thought of what these guys put their body through makes me shiver... I like the way classic physique is heading...

There is only so many times you can change the oil in your engine..

What do you guys think the high level pro's are taking nowadays, people like bostin lloyd is always claiming that they are running grams upon grams and i at first didn't believe him.. but.. after Dallas Mccarvers autopsy came out showing that he had over 10 grams of steroids in his system it made me wonder.

Obviously without the genetics no matter how much gear you use you'll never look like the top level guys, but they area all genetically gifted so surely their level of use is similar?

Whats your thoughts?

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Originally Posted by Eduke93

High level bodybuilding makes me cringe, just the thought of what these guys put their body through makes me shiver... I like the way classic physique is heading...

There is only so many times you can change the oil in your engine..

What do you guys think the high level pro's are taking nowadays, people like bostin lloyd is always claiming that they are running grams upon grams and i at first didn't believe him.. but.. after Dallas Mccarvers autopsy came out showing that he had over 10 grams of steroids in his system it made me wonder.

Obviously without the genetics no matter how much gear you use you'll never look like the top level guys, but they area all genetically gifted so surely their level of use is similar?

Whats your thoughts?

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I think like anything else it varies. So dudes have to take massive amounts and some dudes just take TRT levels.