How bad is fructose ?

[Geebee]

Amongst many questions of a thread, I asked why fruit is forbidden for a "clean bulk diet". I had no reply to that part of the thread.
may I eat grape with rice, apples with turkey breast, may I drink fruit juice with rice oe meat ?

[dalcowbag]

fruit isnt "bad" its just that it has no use in repairing muscle glycogen, and in a strict cutting diet you dont want to be taking in nething you dont need

DCB

[SwoleCat]

That, and fructose is stored in the liver. Too much, and the remainder gets stored as adipose tissue.

~SC~

[Geebee]

In a 4300 cal diet like mine, how many fruit and/or which quantity of fruit juice can I get until it starts getting stored in adipose tissue.

[Aggression]

I thought an apple was good to eat pre workout to give you energy?

[usualsuspect]

Most fruit is fine. Just stay away from fruit juice drinks loaded with refined sugars and artificial flavors.

[SwoleCat]

In a 4300 cal diet like mine, how many fruit and/or which quantity of fruit juice can I get until it starts getting stored in adipose tissue.

I don't believe any scientist could actually give you this answer. There is no way to know.

~SC~

[AnabolicBoy1981]

fructose has funny enzymes in it that make you fat, though it's glycemic index rating is one of the lowest.
Juices are bad cuz they are liquid and get absorbed super fast, not to mention many brands add sugar.
A couple pieces of fruit a day won't kill ya, but you gotta experiment. Personallly i dont even like fruit so i never eat it.

[TheChosenOne]

Why do they put Fructose in weight gainers like NLarge2? Is it because of its low GI? Because most of the time you find almost all maltodextrin as the lead ingredient in weight gainers but NLarge2 has malto and fructose.
Wait I think I have an idea. Is it because of fructose's sweetness being that fructose is the sweetest sugar per amount?

[Geebee]

Thanks for your replies. Here is my new diet (I had to change it because I have much BS when waking up and if I have a PF breakfast (ie without insulin , I'm a diabetic) my BS keeps increasing till 10 am (first PC meal, ie first slin).
5.15 breakfast : PC (don't need any fruit, because C is oatmeal)
7.55 (work starts at 8) : P drink
10.00 PC liquid (5 d/w it's prewo meal)
12.30 (5 d/w) pwo meal (PC liquid)
13.00 PC solid :1 fruit with meat, 1 fruit with carbs
16.00 PC liquid
18.30 PF liquid
19.45 PF solid
22.30 or later P drink (pre-bed)
about 2.00 P drink
No fruitjuice whatsoever

[simplecanibus]

stay away from fructose if your cutting, and if you're bulking there are better choices for carbs. fruit juice is just pure sugar, you don't need it at all in your life, ever.

[DirtyDog]

Why do they put Fructose in weight gainers like NLarge2? Is it because of its low GI? Because most of the time you find almost all maltodextrin as the lead ingredient in weight gainers but NLarge2 has malto and fructose.
Wait I think I have an idea. Is it because of fructose's sweetness being that fructose is the sweetest sugar per amount?

As far as I understand this myself, fructose (fruit sugar) is a simple carbohydrate and maltodextrin (corn starch) is a complex carbohydrate.

I guess they put the fructose in so your body has a source of carb available straight away while the maltodextrin is being broken down into a usable form of energy. If they put all fructose you would have too much at once and if they put all malto then you would be starved of carb until it was broken down.

[eggplant]

from what i understand...fructose restores liver glycogen...not muscle..and after a brutal weight training session, your liver and muscle glycogen are both very depleted..so by combining fructose and dex/malto..the fructose will restore liver glycogen...and this ensures that the dex/malto you take in together with the fructose will start restoring muscle glycogen..being that liver glycogen is already restored by the fructose..most of the dex/malto are used in the muscle cells..correct me if i'm wrong...

[Aggression]

I always use whey protein mixed with dex PWO

[DirtyDog]

I dont know how true this is but i've been told that post workout shakes should be taken as seperate carbs and protein.

Carbs first then protein about 30 mins afterwards.

I was told this is because your body wants the carbs faster to replace glycogen after the workout and if you take protein at the same time then some of this will be converted into energy not used to build muscle.

[AnabolicBoy1981]

Why do they put Fructose in weight gainers like NLarge2? Is it because of its low GI? Because most of the time you find almost all maltodextrin as the lead ingredient in weight gainers but NLarge2 has malto and fructose.
Wait I think I have an idea. Is it because of fructose's sweetness being that fructose is the sweetest sugar per amount?

And cuz fructose is cheaper than maltodextrine.

[AnabolicBoy1981]

As far as I understand this myself, fructose (fruit sugar) is a simple carbohydrate and maltodextrin (corn starch) is a complex carbohydrate.

I guess they put the fructose in so your body has a source of carb available straight away while the maltodextrin is being broken down into a usable form of energy. If they put all fructose you would have too much at once and if they put all malto then you would be starved of carb until it was broken down.

Even though fructose is just as bad as a simple carbohydrate, it's technically refered to as a "complex sugar", which is why it has a low GI, even though it's still a sugar. It's very confusing because usaully the closer to a sugar a carbohydrate is, the "simpler" it is. It's kind of a paradox.
All in all, fructose sucks.

[AnabolicBoy1981]

I dont know how true this is but i've been told that post workout shakes should be taken as seperate carbs and protein.

Carbs first then protein about 30 mins afterwards.

I was told this is because your body wants the carbs faster to replace glycogen after the workout and if you take protein at the same time then some of this will be converted into energy not used to build muscle.

True that.
Not to mention the stomach enzymes required to breakdown carbs is an alkaline, and the ones for protein are an acid. So technically its not good to have both swimmin around at the same time. Even still, most of us still eat our yams with our chicken. I think it's more of an issue when dealing with liqued nutrints like protein shakes and and creatine/carb drinks, weight gainers,etc.
Some nutritionists are nutty about food combining, but i wouldn't worry about it except with post workout shakes and supps.
Yeah, i always hit my creatine/carb combo first, and then a half hour later hit the protien shake. Then an hour later I eat food.

[brian11]

I dont know how true this is but i've been told that post workout shakes should be taken as seperate carbs and protein.

Carbs first then protein about 30 mins afterwards.

I was told this is because your body wants the carbs faster to replace glycogen after the workout and if you take protein at the same time then some of this will be converted into energy not used to build muscle.

Ok well think about it like this. The glycogen that is being rushed to the muscle and it acts as a shuttle for the protein. Thereby increasing the rate of absorption of the protein to the muscles. Keep them together.

[DirtyDog]

True that.
Not to mention the stomach enzymes required to breakdown carbs is an alkaline, and the ones for protein are an acid. So technically its not good to have both swimmin around at the same time. Even still, most of us still eat our yams with our chicken. I think it's more of an issue when dealing with liqued nutrints like protein shakes and and creatine/carb drinks, weight gainers,etc.
Some nutritionists are nutty about food combining, but i wouldn't worry about it except with post workout shakes and supps.
Yeah, i always hit my creatine/carb combo first, and then a half hour later hit the protien shake. Then an hour later I eat food.

Im glad someone else had heard that.

Have you ever heard about the body building diet where you eat all your carbs and protein seperately? So you start with carbs first thing in the morning, then 2 hours later eat protein, then 2 hours later eat carbs etc...? im cant remember how fats fit into this but ive got it in an ebook so ill have a read sometime soon.

Its to do with what you said about stomach enzymes being alkaline for digesting carbs and acid for digesting protein and them neutralising each another. What its basically supposed to do is allow better absorption of the nutrients of each meal. Apparently we waste alot of nutrients when we eat carbs and protein at the same time.

In response to brian11's post on whether pwo carbs and protein should be taken together - I can see the idea behind that theory but I dont think protein will have been broken down ready to be absorbed by the time the dextrose is absorbed. I expect it maybe a bit if you were using whey protein isolate but not that much. Just my opinion though, im no nutritionist.

[longhornDr]

Im glad someone else had heard that.

Have you ever heard about the body building diet where you eat all your carbs and protein seperately? So you start with carbs first thing in the morning, then 2 hours later eat protein, then 2 hours later eat carbs etc...? im cant remember how fats fit into this but ive got it in an ebook so ill have a read sometime soon.

Its to do with what you said about stomach enzymes being alkaline for digesting carbs and acid for digesting protein and them neutralising each another. What its basically supposed to do is allow better absorption of the nutrients of each meal. Apparently we waste alot of nutrients when we eat carbs and protein at the same time.

In response to brian11's post on whether pwo carbs and protein should be taken together - I can see the idea behind that theory but I dont think protein will have been broken down ready to be absorbed by the time the dextrose is absorbed. I expect it maybe a bit if you were using whey protein isolate but not that much. Just my opinion though, im no nutritionist.

I'd like to see the science behind this concept. I've never seen anything in the literature to suggest that. You can't really describe enzymes as being acidic or alkaline, though you can say they function at acidic or alkaline pH.

All gastric enzymes function most effectively at acidic pH and all pancreatic enzymes (for both protein and carbs) function most effectively at alkaline pH. There are individual mechanisms for digestion and absorption of carbs/protein/fat and they certainly don't cancel eachother out. Assimilation of nutrients is enhanced by mixed meals, not reduced.

[brian11]

Assimilation of nutrients is enhanced by mixed meals, not reduced.

Evidence for not mixing carbs and fat.