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  1. #1
    RONINASAUNA is offline Associate Member
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    Fat loss just stopped?

    Goal= Trying to go from about 15% body fat to 8-10% body fat and keeping as much LBM as possible.

    height = 6'0
    starting weight = 203

    Cardio is performed 5 times a week at 45mins first thing in morning, @ 60-70%BPM on empty stomach.

    Diet:

    Meal #1
    50g protein(shake)- 1/2 cup Oats


    Meal #2
    50g protein(chicken) - veggies- 2 brown rice cakes


    Workout 45mins to 1hr


    Meal #3
    50g protein(shake) - 1/2 cup brown rice

    Meal #4
    50g protein(eggwhites) - veggies

    Meal #5
    50g protein(STEAK) - veggies

    Meal #6
    50g protein(chicken) - veggies - 2to3 oz Almonds
    ======================================

    Diet is kept like this but on 7th day (carb up for meals 2,3 &4)

    IMO I get plenty of fat for the day from the steak and Almonds.

    "Supplements"= MultiVitamin, Liv52,Vit C.

    Currently on, and planned to run 10wks of 40mg/day Papervar to help prevent LBM loss.

    ==================================================

    I am now on week 5 and current weight is 195lbs. I lost 2-3 lbs a week for the first 3 weeks. For the last 2 weeks, weight, waist measurement and body fat have remained the same.

    Diet/cardiio have remained identical throughout the 5 weeks.

    I am lost discouraged and confused at to what to do next. Strength has not gone down. I make sure I perform intense workouts and cycle weight(heavy/light) and volume.

    I have tried to cut about 5 months ago,with similar results. After week 4, all fat loss stopped, but I still kept going for 3 more weeks and lost strength and muscle. The only difference in my mind now is the Papervar preventing any muscle loss which I suffered cutting last time. Diet on last cutter was Carb rotation( high, med,med, low, low ,low and repeat) with no cheat meals. I faired no better at carb cycling than keeping carbs constant.

    After 4-5wks my body just stops, and prevents any fat loss. I can lose all the weight I want by cutting calories futher, but that is self defeating.

    So now I am stuck and confused and ready to give up. I bust my ass hard every day, eat super clean and strict, perform cardio and have absolutely nothing to show for it other than my efforts.

    I dont know what else to do.... nothing works for me IMO


    Any suggestions, help, info is greatly appreciated.

    Last edited by RONINASAUNA; 12-23-2004 at 03:17 PM.

  2. #2
    RONINASAUNA is offline Associate Member
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    forgot to mention:

    Cardio is performed first thing in the morning @7:30, low intensity for 45mins. Sorry that wasnt clear, I will edit post.

    First meal of the day is 9am - 9:15am

    I have kept track via food log and its the same every day. The only variant being the 2-3oz almonds, of which I have only consumed 2oz each day.

    All food is exactly weighed and measured.

    Total calories consumed each day (except for 7th day) is : 1814 total

    65% protein, 20% fat, 15% carb

    I eat a ton of veggies (greenbeans, broccoli,cauliflower only)

    the only things not listed that are used with meals are :Mustard, Soy Sauce, NoSalt, sugar free jello, cinnamon, salt, pepper,crystal light. Absolutely nothing else goes near my mouth...(well, except for my wife's snatch and I dont think that has any calories .. hehe)

    Also forgot to mention, I get 1-1 1/2 gallons of water per day.

  3. #3
    SwoleCat is offline AR Hall of Fame
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    Appears to me you are lacking the inclusion of enough healthy fats in your approach. W/out adequate fat intake, it's hard to convince your body to let stored bodyfat go.

    ~SC~

  4. #4
    RONINASAUNA is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwoleCat
    Appears to me you are lacking the inclusion of enough healthy fats in your approach. W/out adequate fat intake, it's hard to convince your body to let stored bodyfat go.

    ~SC~
    much appreciated

    will try to modify the above sticky "cutting diet" to my needs and run it for a bit as it seems to include more "healthy fats" as you mention.



  5. #5
    Blown_SC is offline Retired Vet
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    No PWO Shake bro?

  6. #6
    RONINASAUNA is offline Associate Member
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    Smile

    Quote Originally Posted by Blown_SC
    No PWO Shake bro?

    Actually, no there is no "real" PWO shake, but rather a PWO "meal"

    Just following the advice of a high level competitor from another board with his own website/nutrition guidance.

    I was told to not have a PWO shake when cutting, only when bulking. To quote him as it was told to me "... You are having carbs after your workout, and it takes 7 hours to fully digest a chicken breast, so you will have protein in your body at all times, so no need for a post workout meal.... and you shouldn't worry about losing strength with the amount of protein you are taking in..."

    He advised me to only have the 50/50 dex/malt shake PWO when bulking.

    Well respected Mod from another board.

    Thanks !!

  7. #7
    beenie's Avatar
    beenie is offline Senior Member
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    Try cutting your carbs back-- remember you are getting them from the oatmeal, the rice cakes, the veggies and the nuts. I would do the oatmeal OR the rice cakes rather than both.
    Last edited by beenie; 12-25-2004 at 01:16 PM.

  8. #8
    SwoleCat is offline AR Hall of Fame
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    Yeah, everyone has a preferred/personal way.

    I use dextrose/whey no matter bulking/cutting/etc., as it's far more ideal for repair (due to the simplistic digestion properties), and the glycogen restoration/repair process does NOT change just because one is cutting as opposed to bulking. If anything, it's even MORE crucial at that time out of any, but like I said everyone has his/her own way of carrying out methodical practices.

    By the way, if you were following this high level competitor's advice who is very "well respected", wouldn't you logically,

    (A) Have HIM/HER critique/give you your plan (like the missing fat, that's a standout error IMHO), and

    (B) be able to disclose who this is since he/she is well respected? Unless he/she wishes to be kept a secret, but if he/she had his/her own website and nutritional guidance, you'd think it would be information that was desired to be public. I know I would.

    Like I said, different strokes for different folks! Try everything and see what works for you, that is the key to success.

    ~SC~



    Quote Originally Posted by RONINASAUNA
    Actually, no there is no "real" PWO shake, but rather a PWO "meal"

    Just following the advice of a high level competitor from another board with his own website/nutrition guidance.

    I was told to not have a PWO shake when cutting, only when bulking. To quote him as it was told to me "... You are having carbs after your workout, and it takes 7 hours to fully digest a chicken breast, so you will have protein in your body at all times, so no need for a post workout meal.... and you shouldn't worry about losing strength with the amount of protein you are taking in..."

    He advised me to only have the 50/50 dex/malt shake PWO when bulking.

    Well respected Mod from another board.

    Thanks !!
    Last edited by SwoleCat; 12-25-2004 at 08:02 PM.

  9. #9
    RONINASAUNA is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwoleCat
    Yeah, everyone has a preferred/personal way.

    I use dextrose/whey no matter bulking/cutting/etc., as it's far more ideal for repair (due to the simplistic digestion properties), and the glycogen restoration/repair process does NOT change just because one is cutting as opposed to bulking. If anything, it's even MORE crucial at that time out of any, but like I said everyone has his/her own way of carrying out methodical practices.

    By the way, if you were following this high level competitor's advice who is very "well respected", wouldn't you logically,

    (A) Have HIM/HER critique/give you your plan (like the missing fat, that's a standout error IMHO), and

    (B) be able to disclose who this is since he/she is well respected? Unless he/she wishes to be kept a secret, but if he/she had his/her own website and nutritional guidance, you'd think it would be information that was desired to be public. I know I would.

    Like I said, different strokes for different folks! Try everything and see what works for you, that is the key to success.

    ~SC~

    The orignal carb cycling program that I tried the first time IS his exact plan and guidance program which I paid him for and was consulting with him, it just never really worked for me as well as I thought it would have. Many people have followed his advice and achieved great results. On that carb cycling plan, there was NO fat intake other than 10 almonds at night. Strictly pro/carb cycle. I have spoken to many people on the other board that this has worked for, but like you said, you have to see what works best for each individual.

    As far as naming the person, I would have no problems doing that, its not a big secret, I just didnt want to "advertise" someone else's "nutritional guidance" on another board. Very nice guy,extremely knowledgable and has always answered all my questions and helped me understand his methodologies.

    I just wanted to take his ideas and try and modify them to work better in my individual case.

    I would be more than happy to post a link to his site if asked.

    I really do feel that following the cutting "sticky" on this forum, with the addition of healthy fats will lead to easier fat loss for myself. I have started on Udo's oil blend for the past couple days and already notice a difference in the mirror.

    thanks again for all the great info on this board!!!

  10. #10
    longhornDr's Avatar
    longhornDr is offline Member
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    You are going to have to adjust your diet and cardio as you progress, it should be obvious that you will not keep losing fat at the same rate if you do not adjust your program.

    Like others suggested you need to drop some protein and carbs and up the fat.

  11. #11
    Served is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwoleCat
    Appears to me you are lacking the inclusion of enough healthy fats in your approach. W/out adequate fat intake, it's hard to convince your body to let stored bodyfat go.

    ~SC~
    Whats up swole..I was just wondering what kind of fats you would recommend. I've been in this situation myself. Would taking flax seed be enough?? thanx

  12. #12
    SwoleCat is offline AR Hall of Fame
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    Flax oil, Omegas 3/6/9, olive, natural peanut butter, almonds, macadamias, etc.

    ~SC~

  13. #13
    Panzerfaust's Avatar
    Panzerfaust is offline Ron Paul Nuthugger
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    Quote Originally Posted by RONINASAUNA
    forgot to mention:

    Cardio is performed first thing in the morning @7:30, low intensity for 45mins. Sorry that wasnt clear, I will edit post.

    First meal of the day is 9am - 9:15am

    I have kept track via food log and its the same every day. The only variant being the 2-3oz almonds, of which I have only consumed 2oz each day.

    All food is exactly weighed and measured.

    Total calories consumed each day (except for 7th day) is : 1814 total

    65% protein, 20% fat, 15% carb

    I eat a ton of veggies (greenbeans, broccoli,cauliflower only)

    the only things not listed that are used with meals are :Mustard, Soy Sauce, NoSalt, sugar free jello, cinnamon, salt, pepper,crystal light. Absolutely nothing else goes near my mouth...(well, except for my wife's snatch and I dont think that has any calories .. hehe)

    Also forgot to mention, I get 1-1 1/2 gallons of water per day.

    Well respected or not, IMO you need to add a PWO 2:1 Dex/Pro

    I would make that first meal a pro/fat meal. It has already been said that you are missing a vital supplement in EFA's. Make sure to mix them up from time to time. Drop the rice cakes IMO as they serve no nutrional purpose other than giving you something to chew on, if you are gonna have a carb it should be 100% Rolled Oats..no girly flavored packets.

    Your main source of carbs should come from PWO nutrition.

    And remember to stay in your target HR, going over will be catabolic.

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