Thread: Carb up question?
08-02-2003, 11:49 AM #1Banned
- Join Date
- Jun 2002
Carb up question?
Is it better to go from ketosis then slowly start off with 1 and 1/2 days, with the first wave if low glycemic carbs coming in the evening before. And slowly build up to high first thing inorder to fully utilize the insuline spike. Then taper back off to ensure no spillover.
I.e. 200 on Sat. Then upwards to 300 or 400 Sunday with high gi and high protein three times. no fat...etc.
The reason I ask is its difficult to ensure that my cells are completely full from just one day of loading.
08-02-2003, 01:53 PM #2Member
- Join Date
- Apr 2002
- In The Chocolate Factory
Carbing Up on CKD
By Yung Wun
What type of carbs should I be eating??
During the first 24hours of carbing up, high glycemic foods such as simple sugars promote higher levels of glycogen resynthesis when compared to low glycemic foods¹.Research also suggest that eating lower GI foods promotes glycogen resynthesis while avoiding fat gain due to the slin levels being more stable². Since high GI foods promote higher levels of glycogen resynthesis and lower glycemic promotes about the same minus some fat gain, should I just stick with low GI foods for the entire carb up? Since the first 24 hours when enzyme activity is at its highest, might as well take advantage of this and use a high GI food source for the first few hours, then switching to a lower glycemic source and carrying on till the next day. Some individuals find that when they do this it helps minimize water retention and fat gain.Does it matter if its Solid or liquid carbohydrate? a study by Reed,Mj et.al΅ suggest it doesn’t matter as long your taking in an adequate amount. A Liquid form might even be beneficial for the first few hours of the carb up, as it should raise a higher slin level than solid carbs.
Sum it up!!
Eat high glycemic food source for the first few hours and then switch to low glycemic source
When should I chow down??
It would seem separating your intake throughout the day is the way to go, but a study by Costill, Dl et.al suggest that it doesn’t matter, as long as your taking in a adequate amount for the day. In the study two groups were glycogen depleted. One group was fed carbohydrates in two meals the other in seven meals, same amount of carbs was given to each group. The study showed that both groups had a mirror image of glycogen resynthesis. Separating you intake would allow a more stable blood sugar level, and prolly be a more practical way of getting in all your carbs. Bottom line, just be certain your getting an ample amount for the day.
Sum it up!!
It don’t matter when, as long as your taking in an adequate amount for that day
Lets not talk about fat gain
When on this type of diet you cant help but to be fearful of gaining fat on your carb loading phase. Afterall you juss spent 5 days keeping carbs to a minimum, and now your gonna have two days of enjoyment. Feelings of guilt may set in, being that now taking in now a higher amount of calories. How can I loose weight, when I’m eating more?? Simple after that type of restriction your metabolism starts to level off at a steady pace, what you need know is a clean surplus of calories to kick your metabolism back into high gear. In a study conducted by Acheson, K.J, subjects were on a diet that was similar to a ckd. The subjects were on a low carb, high fat diet for 5 days and depleted there glycogen stores through exercise. The subjects were then given 500grams of carbs split between 3 meals. The study revealed that the subjects actually lost a fat balance of 88grams even though they were given a surplus of calories. When glycogen stores are depleted the main job of the carbs are not to be used as a fuel source, but to refill the depleted glycogen stores as fat is used for an energy source. Additional carbs which were not stored were used as an energy source˚. During the loading phase its wise to keep fat intake to a minimum to avoid excess fat storage. Fat gain occurring during the loading phase is not due to the surplus of carbs but from excessive fat intakeˆ. On the second day of loading carbs should be slightly reduced from the previous day and fat intake should be kept to a minimal to avoid storage of fat. To maximize fat lost some may choose to only have one carb up day to refill depleted stores, and allows more time spent in ketosis. You’ll most likely bloat following the carb phase, no need to worry. It will depart shortly after a few days.
Sum it up!!
Don’t worry about getting fat during the carb up, the main purpose if for the carbs to refill depleted stores.
What you need ta be doing
8-10grams of carbs for every kg of lean mass on the first day
5-6grams of carbs for every kg of lean mass on the second day
Keep fat intake to a minimum
1 gram of protein per pound of lean mass
¹Edward F.Coyle “Substrate utilization during exercise in active people” Am J Clin Nutr (1995) 61(suppl): 968s-979s
¹19.Burke, LM et. al. “Muscle glycogen resysnthesis after short term, high intensity exercise & resistance exercise” Sports Med (1996) 21:98-118
¹20.Janet Rankin “Glycemic index and exercise metabolism” in Gatorade sports science exchange volume 10(1)
²21.Costill, DL et al. “Muscle glycogen utilization during prolonged exercise on successive days” J appl physiol (1971) 31:834-838
΅22.Reed, Mj et.al. “Muscle glycogen storage postexercise:effect of mode of carb administration” Med sci sports Exercise (1989)66:720-726
˚21.Acheson, K.J “Nutritional influences on lipogenesis & thermogenesis after a carb meal” Am J physiol (1984)246:e62-e70
^Jebb,Sa et.al. “Changes in macronutrient balance during over-underfeeding assessed by 12-d continous whole body calorimetry” Am J Clin Nutr (1996) 64:259-266
Last edited by Yung Wun; 08-06-2003 at 12:29 PM.
08-05-2003, 08:52 AM #3Junior Member
- Join Date
- Mar 2003
When I start to carb up in the evenings, I generally take in simple carbs and glycogen in the form of sports drinks. You should it the bulk of these the first day, then work into a few starches and complex carbs. On sunday, the day before I start low carb again....I do the opposite of what most people do, and revert back to simple sugars.....This causes the body to slow down insulin production. Kind of like what people with Type 1 Diabetes have. There symptoms are decreased weight...tiredness, ketones in urine ect. All the things that us low carb dieters have to look foward too.
Also check out Dan Duchaine's Body Opus book...you'll learn alot!
08-05-2003, 11:35 AM #4New Member
- Join Date
- Jun 2003
Great post yung.
08-05-2003, 01:42 PM #5
Sometimes I feel – the more I learn the less I know………..
What have we learned?
Have at least 1 day off if doing many sets of lifting or if working out to failure.
Load yourself with simple carbs right after your work out and keep on loading for at lest 6 more hours.
The next day switch to more complex carbs.
Cardio – sprint like hell, don’t walk or do any aerobics. (then load yourself with simple carbs)
Did I miss anything?
One again – great post Yung Wun.
PS I’ve already asked this earlier – does anyone know if glycogen could be supplemented?
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