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Thread: Carbs

  1. #1
    lew
    lew is offline Junior Member
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    Carbs

    Apart from pwo & ppwo is there any need to have carbs in the diet shouldn't all other meals be protein/fat? what ever the case cutting or bulking. views please

    Lew

  2. #2
    saboudian's Avatar
    saboudian is offline Senior Member
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    You're going to get many conflicting views on this, but thats how diet is. The problem with asking this question is that no one knows anything about your body, and you don't know anything about the person's body type that is giving you the info, this is important considering how individual diet info is. For the record I am a natural endomorph, currently 200lbs, low teens BF. (Of course that'll be going down since I'm going to be goin to begin dieting down soon)

    Honestly, unless I cheat, I don't take in any carbs at all. I generally aim for 500g protein/day and then whatever fat I get in is from the meat or eggs that I eat, so I'm usually around the low 4000's cals when I bulk. Now I don't necessarily believe that my body can up take 500g protein everyday, but the problem is that I have no idea how much it actually can. The only way I know that I am getting enough protein in is by taking in large excessive amounts, so that every time my body can uptake a gram of protein, it can do so. I honestly believe that if you are training naturally and hard, you can uptake at least 2g protein/lb.

    Alot of ppl think that they must have carbs to have energy for a workout, and you cannot gain weight without carbs, but this is one of the few cases when a calorie is a calorie. If you are not taking in enough calories, you're gonna feel like ****t and you're gonna lose weight. Protein builds muscle (and to a lesser extent, fat) not carbs. Honestly, the only thing that I believe that carbs are good for is energy, but if you are taking in enough protein/fat, you won't notice any decrease in energy at all without carbs.

    As far as carbs PWO, I have about 9lbs of pharmaceutical grade dextrose sitting behind me on a shelf, and i haven't touched it in months. I've heard all the arguements about why carbs PWO are so important, but I haven't used them in months and haven't noticed a single negative difference. I have a few technical reasons why they aren't neccessarily important, but thats just speculation right now, and in cases like this involving diet, real world experimenting is more accurate then any other info you can find, and this is the best thing you can do, your own experiments. Even if your real world experiment doesn't work out, you find something out about yourself, and can learn why it didn't or did react the way it did, you speculate and then try to find another way to improve it, this is how you learn your body and find out what works best by constantly trying to improve your own theories. If you blindly following technical info and believe it is true, it might work well for you if you are lucky, but you'll never find the way thats works the best for you. Just as a PLer has to mess around with that bench shirt to find the perfect groove, or a BBer has to constantly search for that magic formula for the last week, you can't figure it out by reading.

  3. #3
    lew
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    i found this from a book called serious strength training, theres a part on post workout nutrition its by dr Mauro di pasquale.


    " There are two distinct stafes to consider 1) immediately after training and 2) one to two hours later. Immediately after workout, ingestion of a targeted mixture of amino acids that are absorbed almost immeditaly induces a strong and rapid increase of aminoacidemia, which in turn acutely stimulates protein synthesis and decreases muscle catabolism. Acute amino acid intake and absorption stimulates the transport od amino acids into muscle, and their is a direct link between amino-acid inward transport and muscle protein synthesis(wolfe 2000). It also appears that a number of amino acids may increase secretion of the two powerful anabolic hormones, growth hormone and insulin .
    Intrestingly, the stimulaneous ingestion of carbohydrates and protein decreased the absorption rate of amino acids. You therefore should limit your intake immediately postexercise to amino acids only- NO carbs.
    An hour or two after training, you should ingest amino acids or whey protein powder in order to maximize protein synthesis, glycogen storage, and stores of intramuscular triglycerides".


    This is from his diet metabolic diet which basically limits carbs to 30g per day max even if training over a two week assesment period, then carbs are kept the same if you can manage this or increased slightly if you feel week,tired ect. Then one day is a cheat/carb up day.

    Intresting to see opinions from experts, swole, rambo ect

  4. #4
    rambo's Avatar
    rambo is offline The Lord God
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    I just woke up, but I really want to get to saboudian's statements, because I'm floored by his PWO nutrition theory. It's not a matter of "experience", it's scientifically proven- over, and over again.

  5. #5
    tatertoos's Avatar
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    I wish I would have never read this thread, my head hurts and I am confused. Now I must take a nap.

  6. #6
    beenie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tatertoos
    I wish I would have never read this thread, my head hurts and I am confused. Now I must take a nap.
    LOL! Me2!

  7. #7
    lew
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    Quote Originally Posted by tatertoos
    I wish I would have never read this thread, my head hurts and I am confused. Now I must take a nap.
    Yeh bro i hear ya! my point was from all the advise i have ever recieved, read from other threads by swole, rambo big t is that the best/optimum time for carb intake is PWO and PPWO because of the activity ie weight training hence the need for carbs after. BUT at any other time what would be the purpose of consuming carbs? surely it should be just protein/fat meals.

    maybe not - its best to get info from people who do this for a living advise about diet then from a text book.

  8. #8
    rambo's Avatar
    rambo is offline The Lord God
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    Here's the deal. There are 3 times during the day when carbs are essential, even when cutting.


    Breakfast,

    Post Workout,

    And the post workout meal (an hour after the shake)

    The most important of the 3 is immediately after your workout. The purpose is to shuttle nutrients into your body at it's most anabolic state.

    At breakfast you have been catabolic while sleeping, and the carbs you intake for breakfast are utilized to replenish Muscle glycogen.

    We all know what the PWO shake does.

    The post- post workout meal essentially does the same thing as the PWO shake, but less carbs are taken in. You should aim for half the amount of carbs in you post-PWO meal than you had in your PWO shake to avoid carb "spillover".

  9. #9
    lew
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    Quote Originally Posted by rambo
    Here's the deal. There are 3 times during the day when carbs are essential, even when cutting.


    Breakfast,

    Post Workout,

    And the post workout meal (an hour after the shake)

    The most important of the 3 is immediately after your workout. The purpose is to shuttle nutrients into your body at it's most anabolic state.

    At breakfast you have been catabolic while sleeping, and the carbs you intake for breakfast are utilized to replenish Muscle glycogen.

    We all know what the PWO shake does.

    The post- post workout meal essentially does the same thing as the PWO shake, but less carbs are taken in. You should aim for half the amount of carbs in you post-PWO meal than you had in your PWO shake to avoid carb "spillover".
    Rambo

    as i do cardio in the mornings before breakfast do you still feel this meal should be protein/carbs. i was just thinking the days i do cardio the first meal should be protein/fat and have a protein/carb meal second.

    Would this benifit the fat burning process? or does it not matter?

  10. #10
    SwoleCat is offline AR Hall of Fame
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    Listen to Rambo.

    I have NOTHING to add.

    You either take what people with experience that LOOK THE PART know to be true (and I help 1000's as well per month achieve the same look!), or you can read a book and get confused.

    ~SC~

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